Eric's 33 Build #583

[kraftee]

...and Tim, I saw you were discussing stereo systems over on wallace18's current build thread. Didn't want to hijack that thread so I thought I would post this here. I bought a Kenwood Bluetooth bridgeable amp and installed it behind the passenger seat on the floor. It comes with a nice wired remote head (mountable if you have a console - I don't.) Even with just two 6" Infinity door speakers, it sounds amazing, even at 70mph with the top down. It is also dead simple: I simply open my iTunes app on my phone and pick a mix or artist (or open Pandora - but then there is the cellular data charge to deal with.) Then, all day, whenever I start the car, it automatically starts playing my chosen music. Everything shuts off when I turn off the key - and my phone goes into pause mode. Pretty awesome and I can adjust the volume, skip tracks, etc., with my little wired remote that lies next to the transmission tunnel. My phone stays in my pocket.

It's the best hidden sound solution I have seen so far.

[kraftee]

LOVING the hitch I bought from Erik Hansen. Turns the 33 into a pretty decent unit to haul a light trailer - especially a vintage one loaded with vintage trail bikes!

[H R Lucky]

Really looks good Erik,
I have 2 questions: 1. do you have a 3 link rear or 4 link? reason I'm asking is for the trailer hitch, I am making my own from Eric Hansens plans & he wasn't sure it will fit my 4 link rear, so I may have to do some modifying. 2. can you give me some details on how you got your radiator overflow tank installed next to the radiator? I don't seem to have enough room there to get it installed.

thanks,
Nevin

[Dodgeman]

...and Tim, I saw you were discussing stereo systems over on wallace18's current build thread. Didn't want to hijack that thread so I thought I would post this here. I bought a Kenwood Bluetooth bridgeable amp and installed it behind the passenger seat on the floor. It comes with a nice wired remote head (mountable if you have a console - I don't.) Even with just two 6" Infinity door speakers, it sounds amazing, even at 70mph with the top down. It is also dead simple: I simply open my iTunes app on my phone and pick a mix or artist (or open Pandora - but then there is the cellular data charge to deal with.) Then, all day, whenever I start the car, it automatically starts playing my chosen music. Everything shuts off when I turn off the key - and my phone goes into pause mode. Pretty awesome and I can adjust the volume, skip tracks, etc., with my little wired remote that lies next to the transmission tunnel. My phone stays in my pocket.

It's the best hidden sound solution I have seen so far.

Kraftee,
The sound system you installed (Kenwood bluetooth bridgeable amp) do you happen to remember the model number?

Thanks,
Bob

[kraftee]

Nevin,

I have the 4-link and it fits just fine. Even though Erik says you don't really need to use the upper support bars, I installed them on my car. They are installed well above the upward travel limit of the upper links in the stock 4-link rear end. The end result is a very sano-looking installation that doesn't really detract from the rear end of the car (in my opinion.) The bonus is that the bars help support the sheet metal trunk floor. Here are a few photos that show the finished product.

Eric

[kraftee]

Hey Bob,

The Kenwood system is KAC-M1824BT. Pretty sure I bought it from Crutchfield. Sounds great with just two Infinity Kappa Reference Series door speakers - even at 70mph with the top down! Mounted behind the passenger seat and the remote is unobtrusive, easy to hide, and simple to operate while driving.

Eric

[kraftee]

Nevin,

Here are some pics from a few months ago when you could see how it is mounted. Mounted it directly to Mike Everson's radiator shroud.

[H R Lucky]

Erik,
thanks for the info on the trailer hitch.
on the overflow tank, I can't even get mine to fit without hitting the head light wires & the suspension, I will have to re-investigate what my obstruction is.

thanks again,
Nevin

[kraftee]

Nevin,

The key was mounting it a bit lower. When you look at pic 4 in the post above, you can see a rivnut mounted a few inches above the lower mount. That was my first attempt. Didn't work mounted that high. Once you install it low enough (with spacers as shown), you will probably have to twist it one way or the other just slightly to bend the mount tabs and clear everything. Now, you will notice I did NOT use the gas shocks on my hood hinges, but instead went with stainless braided cables as hood limiters on each side. Pretty sure the gas shocks would not allow mounting where I did.

Eric

[kraftee]

I have had several builders contact me about more pictures and details on the soft top boot. I had this made by the local trim shop - who specialize in vintage cars and have done trim work for me for 30 years. Good people. Anyway, my problem was that I simply could not stow the top itself in my trunk because of my battery location. That long wooden header bow being permanently attached to the top was the problem. So, whenever going anywhere, I would have to leave the soft top up - or at home.

When using the boot, the top rolls up and zips into the boot, which is then snapped onto the belt bows just like the soft top itself. There are two additional straps that snap right inside the door jamb. The purpose of these is to keep the boot snugly down in position while driving. That leaves only the three bows, the two little tensioner rods, and the two side stacks to stow away while travelling top down. In the first pic below, you can see how little trunk space is taken up by this. Of course, if you have side curtains, they stow nicely too (second pic.) Leaves the entire lower part of the trunk open for all your stuff.

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Of course, if you go to shows and travel like I do, you will have much more stuff in your trunk. Here is how I usually travel: In the first pic, you can see a decent-sized toolbag along with towels and rags in the very rear of the trunk, plus two foldable chairs. The second pic shows all the previous stuff, plus all the top pieces, plus cleaning fluids and chamois (behind battery), and a small cooler. Note that there is STILL plenty of room for an overnight bag. The final pic adds the side curtains.

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[kraftee]

Okay, everything fits. But here's how easy it is to stow the top itself: In the first pic, the header bar is still attached and top is flopped carefully over onto the hood and ready to roll up. In the second pic, the top is pre-rolled and ready to disconnect from the windshield. Finally, the header bar is rolled up and the top is ready to put into the boot (pic 3.) In pic 4, the boot is unzipped and ready for the top. The final pic shows the boot (upside down) with the top zipped into it.

P9240002.JPGP9240014.JPGP9240015.JPGP9240017.JPGP9240018.JPG

Now, simply flop the boot over and set on the top of the waterfall. Snap onto the belt bows just like the soft top (pic 1), snap the two hold down straps into the door jambs (pic 2), and you're ready to go. Takes me about 7 minutes to put the top down, stow the pieces and snap on the boot - and a few minutes longer to put the top back up.

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[CVOBill]

Eric, thanks for the detailed pictures. Now to show my trim shop and see what he can do, it would be nice if Rod Tops would offer this as an option with the top.

[kraftee]

...it would be nice if Rod Tops would offer this as an option with the top.

I sent pictures to Rod Tops to suggest just that. No response.

[sturigus83]

Eric my name is Tom and I use sturigus83. I just have to say a very outstanding build everything and I have read all your post and took a lot of notes as well. I havent ordered my 33 yet but it wont be long I have the itch real bad and you know what mean. I hope next year I can order mine. I have just been learning by reading all the builds. I have the manual already and you can get lost there quick but I enjoyed reading your build very much and have learned a lot. Thank you very much I live up by Brunswick Ga.

[kraftee]

Thanks Tom. If you ever want to make the short pilgrimage to Gainesville, you're welcome to come by and take a look at the car. Tom Wallace lives nearby, and I am sure he would be happy to show you what he has done (although the 33 he is currently working on is at the paint shop, I think!) ERIC

[kraftee]

As the final part of the "Hide all the soft top parts when the top's down" project, I built a simple false floor for the trunk. Hides EVERYTHING from the soft top - including the side curtains - plus towels, rags, toolbag, etc. Gives a great, uncluttered, flat floor for travel and shows.

[H R Lucky]

Nice work Eric.

[CVOBill]

Looks great Eric.

[kraftee]

At last I feel like #583 is complete (at least until I decide to add horsepower...or better brakes...or some other "improvement".) The final step was getting rid of the last of the FFR "advertising" on the car. I had earlier filled the FFR cast steering wheel center with JB Weld and put on a "V8" decal, and I also covered the FFR badge on the oil fill cap with another V8 decal. Finally, I gave away the FFR logo floor mats and installed a custom set from my local trim shop.

So, as my last post to this build thread (I'll start a new thread for anything else I decide to do to the car), I thought I might share a few thoughts and feelings about this build. First off, I want to sincerely thank the members of this forum (and the other one) for all the help, guidance, great ideas, and support. Without you guys there is no way I could have finished this project. There are a LOT of giving, talented people here!

Next, although it may appear so at times, this is not meant to be a "bash FFR" post. Truth is, I really haven't had any dealings with them at all since early in the build when I got so frustrated by my perception of a lack of customer support. I know MANY other builders have had fantastic support and are huge fans of Dave and his company. That's awesome. Some guys have built multiple FFR kits and are delighted with them. Me? I am delighted with the result. I love my little red roadster. It's quick, fun, and beautiful - and I am very proud of it.

However, there are some caveats that I believe every potential 33 builder should be aware of. First, I understand that the issues I had with backordered parts have somewhat been resolved. It's generally not even a problem unless you are on some maniac mission to finish your car in a few months (like I initially was.) I think much of my problem can be traced to an FFR sales guy (who no longer works there) who kept telling me what I wanted to hear - instead of the truth. That's water under the bridge, although I still haven't forgiven Dave for NEVER returning a call or email.

The bigger issue for me turned out to be difficulties with the fiberglass body. I have heard some builders (the "pro" builders and the guys with extensive body and paint backgrounds) say, basically, "What did you expect for the price?" And, "Every pro knows that to get a quality result with ANY body, it takes a lot of expensive materials and time-consuming labor. You amateurs should not expect a body that you can just scuff and paint!"

That is all true. However, it seems to me that FFR was built on the concept that a guy with average mechanical skills and NO car-building experience can put together a satisfactory finished product. That's what they advertise, anyway. That may even be true of the Roadster kit. There have sure been a LOT of those things built! But I would argue that there is almost NO way to put a 33 HR kit together as a satisfactory finished product without doing (or paying for) a LOT of body work. This would not be a problem if they warned you up front. Something like a disclaimer (on the 33 kit and, from what I understand, the Daytona Coupe kit too) saying something like, "This is a more advanced kit. Builders without body and paint experience should expect to spend between $5,000 and $10,000 for professional body and paintwork." However, NOWHERE in any of the literature does it mention the difficulty of this body (mainly due to there being LOTS of pieces to fit and, IMHO, shoddy FFR glasswork.) Another place they could prepare potential builders is at the build school. The teachers there do a fine job of helping builders learn great tips on how to assemble the chassis, but they never even hint at how difficult the body is going to be.

Another issue with this kit that is never mentioned by FFR is the abundance of very cheaply made (mostly Far East-sourced) accessories. Again, this would not be a huge issue if somewhere they warned you that, "This kit comes with all the basic accessories needed to complete a roadworthy car. However, many builders choose to upgrade some of the basic accessories with more expensive pieces available from aftermarket companies."

I guess the big question is, "So Eric, knowing what you now know, would you do it over again?" That's a tough one. As I said initially, I do love my hot rod. However, the build school, my forum research, and my sales guy at FFR all led me to believe that I could build this kit to the level I was going for (local-show-worthy driver) for less than $30K - since I already owned a donor Mustang. Well, I have about $50K in the finished product (plus many, many more than the 200 man-hours they told us it would take at the build school.) So, to answer the original question, I would have to say, "It depends." If I went into it with my eyes open, fully expecting to pay upwards of fifty grand for a nice result, then, yes, I'd do it again. At the end of the day, I wouldn't sell the car for $50K, so I guess it was worth it to me, right? That's been the gist of this long, rambling post. If you are a lurker considering the purchase of an FFR 33 Hot Rod kit, be prepared for the issues I have described. Know your limits and what you are capable of doing. For everything that you cannot do, be prepared to open your wallet. It's still the coolest hot rod you can build. ERIC

[erlihemi]

Congratulations on an excellent build Eric. You made it yours!! I do have to agree 100% with your summary of issues. Those, coupled with a few other observations, are why there is no 818 in my garage. That doesn't mean there won't be a Daytona or 35 truck, but I know what I'm watching for now. That said, I'm confident a similar build of equivalent quality using other mfgs components would end up at similar expense or greater. I could have finished mine the first year with a "scuff n paint" and the leftovers laying in my garage from another adventure for under $30K. It evolved into something else that isn't quantified, yet certainly wasn't priceless.
I would like to echo a couple of your sentiments:
1) The build school is great and I always recommend it, BUT, rather than prove that a pile of pre drilled parts can be zipped together by 6 guys in a weekend, more time on the individual component issues should be covered.
ie, I never saw the roof and door issues coming, and that is solely a design and manufacturing issue, not a "fabricator should expect it and accept" issue.
2) I would like a truly "stripped kit" option minus all the stuff most of us leave in the box. That amounts to $1-1.5K easy.
But, a stripped kit option needs to state, for experienced builders, electricians, and machinists only....
3) better alignment of stage 1 kits with parts and the manual sequence.

But, having driven it hard before its even finished, completely changed the front glass, and likely more off book mods, I'm reasonably happy with the overall build. Now if we could just have an R chassis 33 with a cage we could certify in some sanctioning body I would be happy!!

From the outside looking in... YOU BUILT ONE HECKUVA NICE CAR YOURSELF!! Enjoy the ride

[kraftee]

I have decided that it is time to start a new project and put #583 up for sale. In my last post to this thread, I said that, "I wouldn't sell the car for $50,000..." However, I am going to do just that. I am pricing the car at $49K. You could not duplicate the car for that price. If you think you might be interested, please contact me via email at [email protected], or on my cell phone at 352-538-4843. She's a great car, but I am ready for a new challenge!

Factory Five Hot Rod #583, 4-link rear, rear exit exhaust, Uni-steer electric power steering, black powdercoat frame, Rod Tops soft top with side curtains. Chrome tilt column.

Fresh Blueprint 5.0 H.O. with flow-honed intake, 75mm throttle body, 80mm MAF.

Tremec 3550 5-speed with Forte external hydraulic slave cylinder.

Ford Trac-Loc 8.8 rear with 3.73:1 gears.

Whitby power brakes

Whitby Vintage Air A/C and heat

Thousands of dollars in cool upgrades. Review this thread or call me for details.