818R - roll cage vs head

[billjr212]

I was right on the edge of highjacking an old abandoned thread that was (sort of, kind of, not really) on topic and then thought it best to just start a new one.

I am considering going the 818R route (I currently have a MK3 roadster and this would replace it). I would, however, be using it more like an 818S buyer might - 90% street/ 10% track, so I would get the windshield option. I just prefer the style and safety factor of the 818R's frame/roll cage design. I still beat myself up every once in a long while for not getting a challenge car instead when I built my MK3 7 years ago.

My question though - where does that angled side bar land on your body? Is it going to be a head clunker requiring a helmet on the street? I am hoping it is low enough to be around shoulder height, but I'm tall only by 1950's standards (5' 9"). The top of my head sits just about at the top of the kirkey seats for the roadster (appears they have the same option in the 818R) as a reference point. Unfortunately I haven't seen the 818 in person since it was just a frame at the open house last year.

Thoughts? Easily adjusted by a qualified welder (aka not me)? Roll bar padding an option? I'm not worried about climbing over the door to get in and out.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

This photo should answer some of your questions
Bob

DSC_0707.jpg

[billjr212]

Hmmmmm. I was afraid of that. Thank you for the fast response.

Bad height for a bare noggin but I think the combination of roll bar padding and one of those racing seat head supports would be sufficient. Like this.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/kir-00200/overview/ (plus the cover of course)

[riptide motorsport]

You could make it removable..........

[apexanimal]

This:

https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...p?Product=2397
http://www.ogracing.com/bsci-dual-du...-bar-padding-3

[Santiago]

I'm going to call it a skull crusher on the street. Here's another angle:

Spyshot818R-3.jpg

Ok, so you get side-swiped or (worse) T-boned on the street. Your body is going to be safely protected by a steel cocoon - your head is toast.
Keep in mind that in a race setting you (a) have a helmet on which, if contact is made, is (b) protecting you from SFI rated padding which is still hard as hell and will cause damage to an unprotected head. Moreover, you likely have some sort of head and neck restraint on which should greatly limit the range of movement your noggin is permitted to go. Best to think of these as safety systems (read: holistic approaches to specific dangers) which have their intended uses. Race safety systems are often designed with an isolation scheme, the goal of which is to keep harm away from you. Street systems employed by the OEM's typically have a soften scheme, the goal is to reduce the rate of your deceleration.

Anyway, you might consider just cutting those beams out altogether. In the race setting their function seems largely to be to support the main hoop (and probably add some rigidity to the chassis). Some serious roll-over protection is paramount for a race setting, but on the street you're probably not so concerned with that. Besides, the R's main hoop is already more stoutly built than the S's bar - so you're still ahead of the game. You'd be left with this, sans front down-bars & prototype passenger bar:

project818spyphoto5medium.jpg

Something to consider.

Best,
-j

[longislandwrx]

I think with a five point harness, where your body movement is severely limited, you would not be at high risk of hitting that bar unless it was hit and deformed into the cabin. But why take any risk with your brain.

That being said, if you are opposed to wearing a helmet on the street, I would suggest either running a front seat that offers full containment which can be had for under $500
or at the absolute minimum I would pad the heck out of that bar.


I would not even think about running the r with those bars with a 3 point, there's just too much for your body to strike.

[RM1SepEx]

Drive an R = wear a helmet... It is the only real way to be safe vs crushing your skull in severe side impact

[JeromeS13]

Drive an R = wear a helmet... It is the only real way to be safe vs crushing your skull in severe side impact

+1

I've seen several in-car videos from cars with cages. When they have a pretty good crash, there's no telling where/how far your head will go. Not worth the risk, IMO. But, it's your head...

[billjr212]

Thanks again for all the comments everyone. Seems like there are a few options out there including (from most complicated to least):
1. making removable but also would add padding for the track days when it is on
2. complete removal
3. padding plus side head support on the seat
4. padding plus open face helmet

Any of these appear to make the 818R an option for semi-regular street use, 1, 2, and 4 being the safest theoretically. Obviously I have no intent to put my head at unnecessary risk (or at least at any greater risk than I would if I were in my Mk3 or an 818S). I can assure you it is not my good looks that get me through life.

Definitely would stick with the full harness. That's what I have in my mk3 and it only takes an extra few seconds versus a regular 3 point belt for me at this point. Again, I'm just trying to confirm my hope that the 818R is feasible for my use. I am not looking to build until winter 2014 at the earliest. Daughter #2 is only 2 weeks out, so my calendar is about to fill up!

[longislandwrx]

I also plan on driving my R on the street, for rock and brain protection I will wear a helmet. I can give you some distances once I get the harnesses and seats in.