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Thread: Brando's Newbie 818R Build Thread

  1. #761
    Senior Member C.Plavan's Avatar
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    Brandon- We are dying here. How did it go? I'm hoping EXCELLENT. Its funny, the more I see you having fun with your car, It makes me start working harder on mine.... haha.

    Details! ASAP :P
    Thanks- Chad
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  2. #762
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Clary View Post
    The way the lotus was hitting the rumble strips make me think it was a borrowed car.
    Rewatched it again. I like to hit the rumble strips myself, but this guy, he's got two wheels right off the track in at least four corners. His driving style is smooth; his line: aggressive. The tracks I've been to for HPDE would have black flagged that Lotus and talked to him for rest of his entire session about why he feels the need to get dirt and rocks all over the track.

    I do respect how smooth he is. Smooth throttle. Smooth braking. Smooth steering. He's not jerking the car around trying to make it fast and thus just making it slow. Nice to see.
    Fast Cars, Fast Women, Fast Haircuts!

  3. #763
    Senior Member metros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.Plavan View Post
    Brandon- We are dying here. How did it go? I'm hoping EXCELLENT. Its funny, the more I see you having fun with your car, It makes me start working harder on mine.... haha.

    Details! ASAP :P
    I'm glad I'm not the only one. I've checked this thread several times hoping for updates.

  4. #764
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    Requirements:
    1. Return home safely to my family Success!!

    Goals:
    1. Stay on the track Fail
    2. Run a lap < 2:00 Success!! 1:58.1
    3. Run all 5 sessions without breaking down Fail

    Long term goal:
    1. Long term goal at this track is to run < 1:50 but that is pretty darn fast. I use this particular video as my benchmark (lotus 2-eleven running a 1:50) running buttonwillow configuration 13cw. I have this video memorized Definitely attainable




    Quote Originally Posted by D Clary View Post
    The way the lotus was hitting the rumble strips make me think it was a borrowed car.
    I kinda liked his lines. Although my one and only spin was caused from being a little aggressive on the strips.

    Quote Originally Posted by C.Plavan View Post
    That's just racing, no AX there :P. I'm much worse with my own car.
    Me too!



    Thankfully Speed Ventures pre-grids. My first session I ran with the green advanced group (there is also a red advanced) and to my surprise I ran the quickest time session #1.



    This video is my second session, which I ran 2 consecutive 1:58's before spinning out. I was pre-grided #1 so it was a totally open track. How sweet it was. The spin wasn't all that spectacular, I cut a corner a tid hard while the car was already on the edge. The only time I get this car to spin is in 3rd gear around 60MPH. Anything faster and the aero really does it's job, the car never got out of line on me besides this one instance.

    Watching the video you will see there is pleanty of meat left on the bone and I see AT LEAST 5 seconds that could be shaved off this, probably more.



    So much fun!



    Chad, the guys out there were saying the repave is good for 1-2 seconds off your prior time.
    Last edited by Brando; 10-19-2014 at 01:46 PM.

  5. #765
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    A few things come to mind looking at some pictures:

    I want to take 1 degree of camber out of the rear and add one to the front. So -2F & -3R


    Loosen front suspension and tighten the rear.


    Move the L-bracket for front bumper down 1"




  6. #766
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    Wayne Presley's Avatar
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    That's very cool Brando.

    BTW, invest in a driving suit, gloves, arm restraints and HANS before your next track session please!
    Wayne Presley www.verycoolparts.com
    Xterminator 705 RWHP supercharged 4.6 DOHC with twin turbos

  7. #767
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    You camber settings need to based on tire temps and not pics.
    Wayne Presley www.verycoolparts.com
    Xterminator 705 RWHP supercharged 4.6 DOHC with twin turbos

  8. #768
    Senior Member mikeb75's Avatar
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    Great video; thanks for sharing!

    But you wrote you didn't make all 5 sessions without a mechanical; what happened?
    818SC chassis #206 EJ207 2.0L VF37 twin scroll || Cusco type RS 1.5 LSD || Wilwood pedal box (firewall attach) || Wilwood superlite front calipers
    BUILD Phase 1: 6/6/2014 car delivered || 5/24/2015 first start || 6/7/2015 go karted || 4/20/2016 hard-top-topped || 10/25/2016 registered || 11/18/2016 inspected & complete
    BUILD Phase 2: 3/8/2017 EJ207v8 || 5/29/2017 re-first re-start || 7/17/2017 re-assembled with race car bits

  9. #769
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Presley View Post
    You camber settings need to based on tire temps and not pics.
    I know you don't measure these things from pictures. That was not a very thought out comment on my part. Tire temps were at 34F 36R hot. I do still think the rear needs another -*.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Presley View Post
    That's very cool Brando.

    BTW, invest in a driving suit, gloves, arm restraints and HANS before your next track session please!
    I have a suit and gloves, I didn't wear them but will moving forward. HANS and arm restraints are on the list. Good looking out


    Quote Originally Posted by mikeb75 View Post
    Great video; thanks for sharing!

    But you wrote you didn't make all 5 sessions without a mechanical; what happened?
    Bro....I don't even want to say it. It's not good.

  10. #770
    Senior Member mikeb75's Avatar
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    Oh no!! And you can't just keep us hanging like that.

    Most important thing is you (obviously) got home safely.
    818SC chassis #206 EJ207 2.0L VF37 twin scroll || Cusco type RS 1.5 LSD || Wilwood pedal box (firewall attach) || Wilwood superlite front calipers
    BUILD Phase 1: 6/6/2014 car delivered || 5/24/2015 first start || 6/7/2015 go karted || 4/20/2016 hard-top-topped || 10/25/2016 registered || 11/18/2016 inspected & complete
    BUILD Phase 2: 3/8/2017 EJ207v8 || 5/29/2017 re-first re-start || 7/17/2017 re-assembled with race car bits

  11. #771
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    True true. Glad to be home, getting ready to head to the pumpkin patch with the kids.

    So, argh I have been biting my lip because it's so disheartening. I will just get to the bottom line. My 4th session I had bearing failure. I thought I covered every base so I must be missing something here.
    The only thing I can think of is perhaps there was some damage to the bearings with the initial tune and over-boost condition I had a few weeks back. I did pull it off the track after I noticed it detonating, but maybe it was too late. I would think if that was the case I wouldn't have made it through the first 3 races, but I don't know how these motors fail....although I am learning faster than I would like.

    After the race yesterday I tailored it directly to my buddy Frank at Prolific Autosport who helped me rebuild the motor. He has a long history building ej's and he was as disheartened as I was. We are taking every step possible to determine the cause. Yesterday will be the last time I race this car without safety equipment and adequate data logging. I am feeling the pain of not being able to review logs of engine vitals and because of that now have to hope there are visible signs when we pull the motor apart.

    I'm trying to keep it cool and not be overwhelmed with all sorts of emotions. I guess I am allowing myself to go numb about it all.
    Hopefully I pulled the car before doing any serious damage. I will have the motor apart next weekend.

    I am really sorry to have to report this to you guys. Maybe there is something I am doing wrong here. Perhaps there is some silly things I am not doing right on the motor that I hope to expose to share and keep others from walking this road.

  12. #772
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Presley View Post
    BTW, invest in a driving suit, gloves, arm restraints and HANS before your next track session please!
    One of the many reasons I don't like running, or seeing anyone I like, run with Speed Ventures. They'll let you on track in an open top car with out arm restraints. They'll layout a AutoX course with a 10 foot "safety" buffer between the outside of the highest speed sweeper and a concrete curb.

    Speed Ventures is the sketch.

    Good to see you running Brando. =)
    Fast Cars, Fast Women, Fast Haircuts!

  13. #773
    Senior Member mikeb75's Avatar
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    No apologies! You're one of the trailblazers, and we're all fortunate you've shared as much as you have.

    Go; enjoy the pumpkin patch with the family, unplug and decompress. Then, when you're ready let us know what you find. Between your mechanic, yourself and everyone else here ideas will start flowing.

    </end pep-talk>
    818SC chassis #206 EJ207 2.0L VF37 twin scroll || Cusco type RS 1.5 LSD || Wilwood pedal box (firewall attach) || Wilwood superlite front calipers
    BUILD Phase 1: 6/6/2014 car delivered || 5/24/2015 first start || 6/7/2015 go karted || 4/20/2016 hard-top-topped || 10/25/2016 registered || 11/18/2016 inspected & complete
    BUILD Phase 2: 3/8/2017 EJ207v8 || 5/29/2017 re-first re-start || 7/17/2017 re-assembled with race car bits

  14. #774
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brando View Post
    I know you don't measure these things from pictures. That was not a very thought out comment on my part. Tire temps were at 34F 36R hot. I do still think the rear needs another -*.
    Wayne means Tire Pyrometer Probing.


    Take a reading on every tire, on the outside, middle, and inside of the tread, quickly after a session. By quickly I means the first thing you do. Don't even take your helmet off. Write down your data. Push the probe into the tread. Yes, make a little hole and push the probe in about 2-3mm.

    Read the temps like this. (Assume ideal tire temp is 170-180)
    Outer - Middle - Inner
    165 - 175 - 185 -------> too much camber, add more positive camber (or decrease caster)
    155 - 180 - 185 -------> too much camber & too much pressure; add more positive camber & reduce tire pressure 2 psi
    190 - 175 - 165 -------> too little camber, add more negative camber (or increase caster)
    185 - 170 - 185 -------> too little pressure; add 2 psi
    170 - 200 - 170 -------> too much pressure; remove 2 psi
    175 - 175 - 175 -------> go get 'em Ace!
    125 - 125 - 125 -------> tires too large; reduce diameter or width or both so the tread will heat up
    265 - 265 - 265 -------> tires too small; increase diameter or width or both so the tread will stay within the ideal tire temp range.
    Last edited by Rasmus; 10-20-2014 at 03:56 PM. Reason: castor ---> caster; le durr
    Fast Cars, Fast Women, Fast Haircuts!

  15. #775
    818 builder metalmaker12's Avatar
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    The 818 is proving to have many motor related issues, and I am just not sure a turbo ej engine is a reliable option for this car at this point. These motors have issues in the wrx platform but not as much as what's going on with our 818's. It seems almost every 818 built and driven medium- hard has had issues.
    818S frame #13 Jdm version 8 ej207

  16. #776
    Senior Member C.Plavan's Avatar
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    Sorry to hear that Brandon! That sucks Buddy. I'm disappointed for you.

    Did you get anything it the filter/vent tank? What oil are you using (brand/weight)?
    Thanks- Chad
    818R-SOLD!!!- Go Karted 7/20/14/ Officially raced NASA ST2- 2/28/15
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  17. #777
    Senior Member FFRSpec72's Avatar
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    Sorry to hear, any symptoms before it let loose? did you have a data logger running? I assume the block is shot ?
    Tony Nadalin
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  18. #778
    Research Calibrator sponaugle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brando View Post
    After the race yesterday I tailored it directly to my buddy Frank at Prolific Autosport who helped me rebuild the motor. He has a long history building ej's and he was as disheartened as I was. We are taking every step possible to determine the cause. Yesterday will be the last time I race this car without safety equipment and adequate data logging. I am feeling the pain of not being able to review logs of engine vitals and because of that now have to hope there are visible signs when we pull the motor apart.
    First and foremost, congratulations on building such a great car. Indeed seeing your videos is an inspiration to many.

    Tracking an EJ motor can be a taxing experience. I have had at least 8 or 10 EJ engine failures that were track related, all of interesting and different causes. Each was also a learning experience. One thing I will mention, which you also mention, is data logging. If you want to know 'what happened', you need data and lots of it. There are many many clues that can found in data that you record. You might want to consider something like the RaceCapture Pro, which is very much oriented for your kind of car and driving. It is cheap (comparatively to RacePaq, Aim, etc), has GPS, accelerometers, Yaw, plus analog and digital inputs, SD recording, dash integration, bluetooth and cellular telemetry, and a bunch of other things.. for $500. (http://www.autosportlabs.com/product/racecapturepro/)

    For my track car, here is what I record:

    From the ECU -
    Timing, RPM, Dynamic Advance, Knock Retard, Engine Temp, Commanded AFR, MAP, STFT, Inj Duty

    From the engine via sensors-
    EGT, EGBP, AIT Pre and Post Intercooler, MAP, Oil Pressure front of block, Oil Pressure back of block, Oil Temp, AFR

    I don't remember if you are running a subaru ECU. If so, you should 'enable' the safety features which can be done by your calibrator or yourself. If you need some tips on how to do that let me know.

    What fuel were you running?

    Cheers!

    Jeff

  19. #779
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    Good to hear back on your track report...I too was one of those thread-checking stalkers waiting to see how things went. =)

    Sorry to hear about the engine woes... I know it sounds a bit harsh, but we hope that it was due to a more minor oversight rather than an intrinsic difficulty. Keep us posted.

    And GET A H&N RESTRAINT! Seriously, a good one will only run you $650 or so. That's less than a set of tires you'll burn up in a weekend at an open lapping event. This should be of the highest priority.

    Next, don't let your passengers grab the damn roll bar. If they need to grab something, tell them to grab the shoulder straps. That "hands outside the cockpit" thing is grounds for being black flagged at a NASA event.

    Last, as Rasmus noted, I think you reported tire pressures (not temps). Ideal temps vary with tire compound, so best to talk with a tire rep. For slicks 180-220 is a good range. For streets, I don't know.

    Also, if you're going to take tire temps (which is a good idea), then (a.) don't use a laser type thermometer use the probe type Rasmus showed, and (b.) if you're doing temps at a track best to come in to the hot pits right on the tail of a hot lap that's damn close to your usual pace (might want to ease off the brakes a tad, but definitely don't ease off the tires). Then go out the pits and run again or do a proper cool down. Tire temps come down fast at the surface, so unless you've got a laser on them in real time, you'll get very low temps at the surface by the time you make it into the pits (even if screaming into them - which is a no-no). A smidge under the surface and temps are less apt to drop almost instantly, so you've got time to record temps with the probe. By "time" I mean like only a few minutes. So best to have a helper just run the corners and do the temps for you. If you do a cool down lap, come into the paddock, then get out/grab your probe (yaddah-yaddah), you're not getting clean and reliable data. You're aiming for "hot temps" as close to what you'd see on track.

    Best,
    -j
    "Weight transfer is the enemy."

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  20. #780
    fasterer and furiouser longislandwrx's Avatar
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    looking good out there, at least pick up a helmet support.

    http://www.saferacer.com/sparco-raci...FUkF7AodLRAAUA

    I imagine money's tight now after the third rebuild.
    A well stocked beverage fridge is the key to any successful project.

  21. #781
    Research Calibrator sponaugle's Avatar
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    Just as a reference, here are some comments on the list of things to datalog listed below. In general you want to datalog *as little* as possible with the Subaru ECU. Once you get over 10-12 values the capture rate will be too slow. You should avoid captuing things that don't have high variance or cannot be derived from other values. You can always do post capture analysis, but you can't make up data you don't have.

    Things I *would not* capture:

    A/F Sensor #1 (AFR) - Useless in most cases as it does not read accurately at high flow. You should be logging a real wideband AFR sensor.
    Atmospheric Pressure (psi) - Does not change much (if at all)
    Battery Voltage (V) - Also should not change a lot, and can be logged externally.
    Engine Load (Relative) (%) - Not needed.
    Exhaust Gas Temperature (F) - Doesn't work.. post turbo for CAT protection.
    Exhaust VVT Advance Angle Left (degrees) - While this is a real feedback item, unless there is a problem with the system you can derive this value from load and rpm.
    Exhaust VVT Advance Angle Right (degrees) - While this is a real feedback item, unless there is a problem with the system you can derive this value from load and rpm.
    Fuel Injector #2 Pulse Width (ms) - You only need one of these, and depending on your tune it may not be needed. If you are running close to the end of the injector flow I might log it.
    Fuel Injector #1 Pulse Width (ms) - You only need one of these, and depending on your tune it may not be needed. If you are running close to the end of the injector flow I might log it.
    Fuel Pressure (High) (psi) - Not really measured, so useless.
    Fuel Pump Duty (%) - derivable from other data (and reasonable useless)
    Fuel Tank Pressure (psi) - not useful
    Idle Speed Control Valve Duty Ratio (%) not useful while racing.
    Idle Speed Control Valve Step (steps) not useful while racing.
    Intake VVT Advance Angle Left (degrees) see exhaust VVT
    Intake VVT Advance Angle Right (degrees) see exhaust VVT
    Learned Ignition Timing (degrees) this should not be active since you are not going to drive around with long term knock correction....
    Main Accelerator Sensor (V) - not needed
    Main Throttle Sensor (V) - not needed
    Manifold Relative Pressure (Corrected) (psi) - not needed
    Manifold Relative Pressure (psi) - not needed
    Mass Airflow Sensor Voltage (V) - not needed
    Throttle Sensor Voltage (V) - not needed

    These I would datalog:
    Coolant Temperature (F)
    Throttle Opening Angle (%)
    Engine Load (Calculated) (g/rev)
    Engine Speed (rpm)
    Fine Learning Knock Correction (degrees)
    IAM (multiplier) - you really should not need this, since it should never go down.. it will go down but you would see that first in the realtime knock retard. That is what you should be worried about. Also it is easy to derive if you have DA tables flat.
    Ignition Total Timing (degrees)
    Injector Duty Cycle (%)
    Intake Air Temperature (F) - Only if post turbo. Pre turbo is pretty useless.
    Knock Correction Advance (degrees) - depends on year and which monitor has realtime knock retard. You only need one of the monitors that shows knock.
    Manifold Absolute Pressure (psi)
    Primary Wastegate Duty Cycle (%)
    Mass Airflow (g/s)
    Vehicle Speed (mph)


    What to log varies a bit by ECU type (model and year).. as Subaru changed some things over time. You have to know a few things about how the particular ECU is configured, but it is worthwhile to dig into this for your particular car.

    Jeff

  22. #782
    Mechie3's Avatar
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    Are you using the factory oil cooler by any chance? If you spin a bearing that assembly needs to be replaced. It's impossible to clean it out and will send bearing material into your new block.
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  23. #783
    Senior Member wleehendrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brando View Post
    I will just get to the bottom line. My 4th session I had bearing failure.
    So bummed to hear that, Brandon... you're having the worst luck. I hope the internal damage is minimal and you're back soon.

  24. #784
    Research Calibrator sponaugle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mechie3 View Post
    Are you using the factory oil cooler by any chance? If you spin a bearing that assembly needs to be replaced. It's impossible to clean it out and will send bearing material into your new block.
    Unfortunately true! I have tried to clean one, and even after many many passes of brake cleaner, hot water, submerged cleaning, and pressure washing it still produced grit.. I eventually cut it open and the design is such that it is almost impossible to get clean once contaminated... and of course they are not cheap. I would consider spending the money on a real oil cooler, as the stock is more of an oil heater. You can run without it.

  25. #785
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    Talk about bitter sweet. I got a call from Sacramento this morning, they passed me! As soon as I can drive my car back to the REFs they rivet a smog exempt tag, I go back do DMV and get plates. Only problem is I don't have a working car. Such mixed emotions. I have a certain window of time to get back to the DMV with all paperwork done before things like my brake and light cert expire.

    Thank you for all the valuable feedback.

    With regards to the data logging. I tried to get the tactrix logging to SD but hit a hurdle configuring it and didn't get it working before the race. I wasn't keen on having my laptop in the car with me. I really appreciate the guidance in choosing a data logging system because I have been racking my head against a wall trying to figure out the best fit for my usage. RaceCapture Pro does seem like a great solution. On my laptop I was getting a Tactrix logging rate of 90ms.

    Do you know if the rate stays consistent when logging to SD as opposed to directly to laptop?
    Is 90ms adequate or do you think that is to slow?
    If i go with RaceCapture would I still want to log the tactrix in addition to it?

    Thanks for the tips on checking tire temps across the tread for refining camber and pressure. I will definitely use that information and technique moving forward.

    I too hope the engine failure was due to an oversight. Something I can change and prepare for so next round I get AT LEAST a season out my powerplant.

    As far as warning, I didn't notice anything in person, but watching the video I can hear some warning knocking going on after the second session. I could definitely hear it at idle on the video

    Yea money is surely tight after 2 rebuilds. Hopefully I got the car off the track before destroying the heads or block. I think I did. I'm hoping I can get away with replacing crank, rods and bearings. I am prepared to accept that much. More so, I just want to have the assurance that I will be avoiding bearing issues moving forward. Whatever that may entail.

    I didn't notice that guy grabbing the rails during the 3rd session. I don't really care to bring people on ride alongs unless they are teaching me. If there is a next time I will surely be more aware and prep them ahead of time to not grab the roll bar.

    Message received on the HANS, you guys have my word I will get one before I run again. Yea money is indeed tight after all this, but making home safely is paramount and I don't want to run again until all my bases are covered.

    I was running Motul 10w50. I had the dry sump the same way as i had described it to you before...filter on the vent and one of the scavenging to PCV.

    Yes I am running the same factory oil cooler, but won't be moving forward after what I'm reading. Would that really contain enough contamination to ruin a new bearing that fast? Insane.

    I don't see it as having the worst luck.I am having a great time for the moments I do get to let this car rip. I am indeed having a rough patch with my motor but i'm sure things could be worse. I'm alive and happy and have a wonderful family and surrounded by lots of love. I would like to consider myself a very lucky man.

  26. #786
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    I am sure you guys have better things to do then watch video's but this thread serves as my data repository for this part of my life. So forgive my abundance of media.

    This is my 4th and last session where the bearing went. Painful to hear at the end. I was having fun running with the white EVO.


  27. #787
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    This is my 3rd session, I had a passenger. I ended up missing pre-grid and was stuck behind the entire pack. I hesitantly worked my way back up front.
    I wasn't really pushing things this round, I was working back confidence after a spin.
    Good for a 2:04 still. I was surprised how much a difference the extra 200lb made. Quite noticable.





    OK. I'm done posting media. Thanks for your understanding.

  28. #788
    Mechie3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brando View Post
    Yes I am running the same factory oil cooler, but won't be moving forward after what I'm reading. Would that really contain enough contamination to ruin a new bearing that fast? Insane.

    I don't see it as having the worst luck.I am having a great time for the moments I do get to let this car rip. I am indeed having a rough patch with my motor but i'm sure things could be worse. I'm alive and happy and have a wonderful family and surrounded by lots of love. I would like to consider myself a very lucky man.
    If you didn't replace it after your first block failure it would most certainly ruin the second one very quickly.

    From 2008 to 2010 I went through three shortblocks on my WRX and 2 sets of heads. Each time the failure was different. Like you I counted my blessings to be able to at least afford to start again (even if it did make money tight) and to not make the same mistake twice.
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  29. #789
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    So this has me wondering, do you in-the-know Subie guys think we should just replace the factory oil cooler as a standard preventative measure (like many do with timing belt, plugs, water pump, etc.)? I guess I'm thinking at least for the R-crowd who will likely run their cars hard from the get-go, maybe we should be planning this from the start?

    And by all means Brando, keep posting vids! I can't be the only one who is vicariously living through them... =)

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  30. #790
    Senior Member wleehendrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brando View Post
    Talk about bitter sweet. I got a call from Sacramento this morning, they passed me! As soon as I can drive my car back to the REFs they rivet a smog exempt tag, I go back do DMV and get plates. Only problem is I don't have a working car. Such mixed emotions. I have a certain window of time to get back to the DMV with all paperwork done before things like my brake and light cert expire.
    Congrats! Look on the bright side... in the long run, that's huge. You'll be street legal without having to deal with windshield, wipers, ride height, etc... lots of things they could have hassled you for with the R.

  31. #791
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santiago View Post
    So this has me wondering, do you in-the-know Subie guys think we should just replace the factory oil cooler as a standard preventative measure (like many do with timing belt, plugs, water pump, etc.)? I guess I'm thinking at least for the R-crowd who will likely run their cars hard from the get-go, maybe we should be planning this from the start?

    And by all means Brando, keep posting vids! I can't be the only one who is vicariously living through them... =)

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  32. #792
    Senior Member Tamra's Avatar
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    I'm sorry to hear that, Brando. That is really rough. I hope the third try is a charm for you.

  33. #793
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brando View Post
    Yes I am running the same factory oil cooler, but won't be moving forward after what I'm reading. Would that really contain enough contamination to ruin a new bearing that fast? Insane.
    I don't know these from first hand experience but I know that the big EJ builders in the US will refuse to build you a motor if you insist on reusing the factory oil heat exchanger. Their reputations have been questioned in the past by customers that have ruined their high dollar motors by reusing the heat exchanger.

    Please do post a follow-up and diagnoses after you tear down the motor. Sorry this happened to you.
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  34. #794
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santiago View Post
    So this has me wondering, do you in-the-know Subie guys think we should just replace the factory oil cooler as a standard preventative measure
    I think you should delete it altogether. Run an aftermarket (e.g setrab) oil-air heat exchanger and

    a mechanical thermostat bypass that slowly opens as the oil heats up. That way the oil heats up to operating temp quicker.
    If you're running a dry sump. Plumb it in between the return from the scavenger pump to the oil tank.
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  35. #795
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    I am having a hard time finding any Subaru compatible coolers by setrab. I have found various air cooled solutions. What are your thoughts on those?

    http://thmotorsports.com/i-1740226.a...FWqCMgodPG4AVA

  36. #796
    Senior Member C.Plavan's Avatar
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    Brandon,

    Setrab will work fine. You do not have to worry about compatibility. You can get a sandwich plate and go off the oil filter location, or the dry sump location like Rasmus said. That picture I posted in your thread (dry sump diagram) should give you a good idea. You make your own lines, you really do not need a "kit" etc.

    Get a fan pack unit with the -12 AN adapters for the dry sump set up. (it has a fan to pull or push air) They make different sizes. I have one and used them in the past. They are great.
    Last edited by C.Plavan; 10-20-2014 at 06:37 PM.
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  37. #797
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    Problem with a kit for a Subaru is it'll fit a Subaru "okay". Then you want to try to get it to fit in a kit-car with a custom dry sump system based around a Subaru power train and it'll never fit correctly. You'll have to piece-meal this. No way around it.

    Setrab is the only air-oil heat exchanger I'm familiar with. I'm sure there are others that are just as good. Setrab air-oil heat exchangers come in two fittings AN16 or M22. If your dry sump is already plumbed in AN16 you're golden.


    If not, there are a variety of M22-AN fittings.


    Or you could just go M22-barbed. I'll probably just go M22-barbed. AN fittings are cool and all, but do they ever add up. I don't envision myself having to remove the fittings from the heat exchanger often.
    Last edited by Rasmus; 10-20-2014 at 06:53 PM.
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  38. #798
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    Setrab for sure. Tough, extremely wide range of sizes, & easy to mount.

    Plan the line route well before ordering your fittings (yeah, "add up" is an understatement). You might want to use some cheap hose to mock up your line length before cutting whatever final hose you use. If you go with braided line, I'd suggest looking into the Koul Tool installation clamps. They make very quick work of assembling your lines.

    Also, as much as possible, try to use the same manufacturer for your fittings. Everything is supposed to be interchangeable since it's all spec'd out the same, but that's only on paper. Folks who have done many more lines than I have made the same recommendation to me to avoid slight production variations which can lead to leaks. Sure, a single manufacturer may have production variations, but the chance of that only gets multiplied across different manufacturers.

    Best,
    -j
    "Weight transfer is the enemy."

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  39. #799
    Tazio Nuvolari wannabe Scargo's Avatar
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    I'm not understanding who's doing the engine building. Are you reworking the same engine each time? An experienced builder should not have missed the contaminated oil heater and it should have been ditched with the dry sump install. Was everything vatted? And why no oil cooler? I can't believe the oil was not getting very hot.
    While I'm being critical, you should have everything checked before building it again. Check the crank and rods. Bolt the case together with torque plates or heads on and check journals for straightness, roundness and size. It may need to be line bored if it's never been done and it needs to be done the right way, with torque plates in place. Changing from stock studs and adding higher torque will distort the case.
    Best of luck. Thanks for sharing.

  40. #800
    Senior Member Brando's Avatar
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    Only a few seconds behind the Arial Atom. Definitely within reach. Next time
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    Scargo will do, thanks for the tips

    Met a fellow FFR builder who had a very well built cobra packing 600HP. He was running 2:15's. The 818 drew a lot of conversations and was definitely a good time.
    To bad I had to push it back on the trailer after my last run.







    Last edited by Brando; 10-22-2014 at 12:19 PM. Reason: Added a few pics

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