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Thread: SixStarCars' 818R - NASA ST3 - SCCA Solo X Prepared Build Thread

  1. #1
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    The AEM 818R #85

    Follow us on our road to SEMA 2014 with the AEM 818R #85

    Goal:
    To build an 818R that is street legal, safe, and competitive for NASA TT road racing and SCCA Solo.

    Donor:
    There really isn't one for this build. I've been hoarding parts for a while and have just enough laying about to not need to take anything off any one car. The harness and some misc. parts will come from one of the WRXs at Go Green Automotive in Greeley. Front LCA's are 2004 STI, rack is 2006 WRX Wagon (better ratio than 02-05 and theoretically better mounting)

    Aftermarket parts:

    Tires & Wheels:
    -295/30-18 Hoosier R6 on 18"x10.5" Custom CCW C14s - Gold
    -245/40-17 Hoosier A6 on 17x9 Enkei RPF1 - Gold

    Clutch - Exedy Twin Disc

    Transmission - Rallispec Type RA gears with a Modena GT TBD

    Brakes - TBD

    Cooling - CoRaceFab Catch Can, Koyo Legacy SS radiator

    Tuning - Cobb AP V3

    Engine - EJ257, Killer B Optimal Oil Pan kit, ARP head studs, combustion chamber matched 2.0 heads with 0.5mm oversized flat face black nitride valves, BC springs and retainers, BC Stage 2 272 cams

    Turbo - Garret GTX3071

    Steering - NRG quick release hub, Momo wheel, 06 wagon rack

    Seats - Sparco Sprint V with ZFD mounts

    Exhaust - GrimmSpeed PnP manifolds and crossover, EWG up pipe, custom 3" stainless and aluminum exhaust from CoRaceFab

    Fuel - ID1000 injectors, AEM E85 intank pump, Perrin top feed rails

    Intercooler - CX racing core with custom end tanks and piping by CoRaceFab

    Gauges - AEM Uego wideband, AEM Oil Temp

    Intake - GrimmSpeed PnP intake manifold and TGV deletes with 3mm phenolic spacers, Agency Power 3" turbo inlet, prototype AEM intake

    Hubs - ARP wheel studs with custom spacers front and rear

    Rear Aero - Zebulon MSC road racing wind with XL end plates


    After getting the boxes and boxes and boxes of parts out and tearing down the crate:

    IteYDRf.jpg

    Here's the R after pulling all the panels to get started:

    CoTiFM5.jpg

    Here's the back 1/4 of the R after disassembly:

    0puNjdy.jpg

    Here's the hand built prototype coolant catch can from CoRaceFab - the goal was to make a direct replacement for the ugly plastic tank that comes with the donors.
    equEMvv.jpg

    Here's the R after suspension, I needed to make it a roller ASAP to get some of my shop back!!! It's headed to Colorado Race Fabrication today to add some bracing and box in some frame members that I'm not happy with:



    And here's a test fit of the 18x10.5 wheels with 295 Hoosiers, kinda silly.....

    Last edited by SixStar; 01-13-2017 at 11:08 AM.
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  2. #2
    Are those door mounting brakets? Or is that for a windshield? The early R's do not have them...
    Thanks- Chad
    818R-SOLD!!!- Go Karted 7/20/14/ Officially raced NASA ST2- 2/28/15
    2016 Elan NP01 Prototype Racecar Chassis #20
    1969 Porsche 911ST Vintage Race Car
    1972 Porsche 911T (#'s matching undergoing nut & bolt resto in my garage)

  3. #3
    Senior Member RM1SepEx's Avatar
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    Those brackets allow you to bolt on a windshield
    Dan

    818S #17 Picked up 8/1/13 First start 11/1/13 Go Kart 3/28/14

  4. #4
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Yeah, once I get the Lexan windscreen from FFR I'm going to do the front dash and see about removing those. We'll never use them.
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  5. #5
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Towed the R over to Colorado Race Fabrication today for some boxing and gusseting on the frame. There were three key points that we located that needed some extra support. One tab was actually bent by someone running into it with their shin...

    Album of high res pictures - http://imgur.com/a/ASBPB
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  6. #6
    I like what you have done, the gussets. SEEMS TO MAKE SENSE
    Without them, it really looks like there would be flex or susceptible to damage in a light impact

  7. #7
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THE ITALIAN View Post
    I like what you have done, the gussets. SEEMS TO MAKE SENSE
    Without them, it really looks like there would be flex or susceptible to damage in a light impact
    The front front control arm one was flimsy, you could tell just looking at it. I don't want to hit a tire wall and have to replace the frame. The rear control arm mount... eh, the way I see it there's room for it to twist down and that's going to happen under hard braking. Running big sticky tires can do bad things.

    The main concern was the rear lateral link mount, with the frame on the lift my photographer walked into it and actually bent it in about a 1/2". Plans to box it out were immediately discussed.
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  8. #8
    Senior Member Xusia's Avatar
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    I hadn't given those areas much thought (I won't be racing), but what you've done makes sense.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    I like the added webbing on the suspension mounts. Gives me ideas.

  10. #10
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    Definitely like the boxing done here.

    Question on your proposed tires - you have two sizes you're hoping to run. I know why you're looking at 245s for STR3 (not sure if the 818R will be admitted into ST3), but are you hoping to run the monster 295s in another class?

    I'll definitely be following this build.

    Best,
    -j

  11. #11
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santiago View Post
    Definitely like the boxing done here.

    Question on your proposed tires - you have two sizes you're hoping to run. I know why you're looking at 245s for STR3 (not sure if the 818R will be admitted into ST3), but are you hoping to run the monster 295s in another class?

    I'll definitely be following this build.

    Best,
    -j
    Yes, we're limited to the 245s for ST3 THIS year. I'm sure it won't be enough for me but when I pick a class I stick with it and always do a full season before moving up. It's not for me so much as for the untested car and my co-driver. He has a TON of AX experience but not much track time.

    For Solo you typically want as much tire on the car as possible. I came across these wheels and just love the loonacy of them. The tires that are on there won't be run more than once. We have a few sets of 285/30-18s that we were planning on running in the rear and some 255/40-17s up front. Honestly we will do what the car wants. If one setup sucks I'll just switch. I plan on bringing several sets with us when we rent the backside of PPIR for testing. Should be lots of fun!!!
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  12. #12
    Nice work. I'm going to be firing up my welder now too.
    Thanks- Chad
    818R-SOLD!!!- Go Karted 7/20/14/ Officially raced NASA ST2- 2/28/15
    2016 Elan NP01 Prototype Racecar Chassis #20
    1969 Porsche 911ST Vintage Race Car
    1972 Porsche 911T (#'s matching undergoing nut & bolt resto in my garage)

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by C.Plavan View Post
    Nice work. I'm going to be firing up my welder now too.
    I'm debating.... Do I want to ruin more powdercoat on a mostly street car?

    choices....
    Zero Decibel Motorsports
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  14. #14
    Senior Member Xusia's Avatar
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    If I do the boxing, I won't be powder coating those spots. I'll use that tough-as-nails spray on enamel I mentioned previously.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Rasmus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xusia View Post
    I'll use that tough-as-nails spray on enamel I mentioned previously.
    I searched your post history but gave up. Could you link it again or post it's name?

  16. #16
    Senior Member Xusia's Avatar
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    I didn't have a name or a link to provide (I get it from my Father-in-law, who gets it from a former student of his, blah, blah, blah). Based on the discussion here, it sounds similar to Dupont Imron. You use a hardener, but no thinner, and it cures to about as tough as powder coat.

    Anyway, my suggestion was to find a local place that paints heavy equipment (dump trucks, garbage trucks, bulldozers, etc. - this is the kind of place that is apparently the source) and talk to them. Selling a gallon or two of a paint like that isn't how they make their money, so if they are cool people, you won't get raped on the price like a "specialty" store, but it still isn't cheap (~$100/gallon with hardener).

    If you can't find any, I can track down the name of the place here and provide you their number - it just might take me a bit.

  17. #17
    I like the bracing on the suspension mounts. That was one of my biggest concerns with the kit.
    ----------------------------------------------------------
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  18. #18
    Senior Member Canadian818's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xusia View Post
    I didn't have a name or a link to provide (I get it from my Father-in-law, who gets it from a former student of his, blah, blah, blah). Based on the discussion here, it sounds similar to Dupont Imron. You use a hardener, but no thinner, and it cures to about as tough as powder coat.

    Anyway, my suggestion was to find a local place that paints heavy equipment (dump trucks, garbage trucks, bulldozers, etc. - this is the kind of place that is apparently the source) and talk to them. Selling a gallon or two of a paint like that isn't how they make their money, so if they are cool people, you won't get raped on the price like a "specialty" store, but it still isn't cheap (~$100/gallon with hardener).

    If you can't find any, I can track down the name of the place here and provide you their number - it just might take me a bit.

    I plan to use a similar product called Endura. All the tanks and trailers I work on are painted with it, tough as nails. I'm going to paint all my aluminum with it, and would've done the chassis too had I known about the powder coating issues. Be careful with these industrial paints, they're usually extremely toxic. I'll only do touch ups at home with a face mask and charcoal filters. The panels I'll paint at work, where I can spray and leave.
    Adam __________________ Instagram @brap818
    818 SRX - #91
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  19. #19
    Senior Member Xusia's Avatar
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    I'm going to find out the name here shortly. I did find out its not Imron. Stay tuned...

  20. #20
    Especially for the R, do you think that Factory Five should do those supporting "mods" as standard? Maybe contact them about it.

  21. #21
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricScottZehnder View Post
    Especially for the R, do you think that Factory Five should do those supporting "mods" as standard? Maybe contact them about it.
    My experience from FFR at this point has been, they have their money, we're all on our own (with a few exceptions, GRM, Snap-On, Wayne, Wilwood). They're not interested in helping after the sale is complete, they don't care that I'm making it better, they refuse to offer assistance for set-up and design of the R.

    Short version - they wouldn't care.
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  22. #22
    SixStar, there are a LOT of guys on the Roadster forum who don't agree with you and they have years and years of experience with Factory Five.
    818S/C : Chassis #25 with 06 WRX 2.5 turbo, ABS, cruise, PS, A/C, Apple CarPlay, rear camera, power windows & locks, leather & other complexities.
    Mk3 Roadster #6228 4.6L, T45, IRS, PS, PB, ABS, Cruise, Koni's, 17" Halibrands, red w/ silver - 9K miles then sold @ Barrett-Jackson Jan 2011 (got back cash spent).

  23. #23
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Fair enough. My main gripe right now is I have a car that is sold knowing its unstable at speed without the aero yet I can't get any help on how or where I'm supported to bolt this $1,600 wing.

    I'll figure it out but what happens when someone that isn't as competent builds one and it fails and causes an issue?
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  24. #24
    Senior Member flynntuna's Avatar
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    Theirs a unique relationship between F5 and the F5 community that I've observed over the years, they build the kits and the community builds the cars. The community does most of the innovation,custom work and breathes life into the raw materials FFR sells. Just my 2 cents.

  25. #25
    I agree. I have never seen a question not answered. Maybe John George can help you (the man that raced the R)
    the R won't catch up for some time, you are one of a few, so hang in there. Hell, we are watching YOU build this, I like what you have done so far, but don't get discouraged this early. I was thinking the same thing that you are confronted with, where does it attach? It has to be extremely strong to stand the force.
    Will you have to remove it when you need to get at the engine??
    Will my hair keep falling out?

  26. #26
    I did all the set-up on the R for every test we did and just like with the challenge cars I will always share any set-up or tuning info we learned (both what worked and just as importantly, what didn't). In my opinion sharing set-up data among a group of racers and track guys is what makes the cars truly fast even if not everyone agrees on the perfect set-up. I couldn't disagree more that Factory Five doesn't care about the cars once they have left here, to me there is nothing more enjoyable than seeing the owners and builders out in the cars hammering around the track and outrunning cars costing 3-4 times as much.

    I also did a summary of our aero set-up and wind tunnel test results for the wing/splitter/diffuser on the forum here but I can give you more specific answers if you shoot me questions in an email.

    my email is Jim(at)factoryfive.com
    Jim Schenck
    Factory Five Racing

  27. #27
    818 builder metalmaker12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixStar View Post
    My experience from FFR at this point has been, they have their money, we're all on our own (with a few exceptions, GRM, Snap-On, Wayne, Wilwood). They're not interested in helping after the sale is complete, they don't care that I'm making it better, they refuse to offer assistance for set-up and design of the R.

    Short version - they wouldn't care.

    I disagree , they have answered all my questions and sent me anything I needed in a timely manor. They have lend me advise and even offered to drive over to my home to look it over. I have corresponded countless issues and as a group we have resolved many issues for all future builders. Sure not everything with the kit is perfect, but it is all manageable and part of building any car. If anything this is easier to build than most of my other previous builds and restorations.

  28. #28
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Got started on mounting the brake lines and running the hard lines for the brake system. We had to almost start from scratch so it's been slow going. Finished next week sometime.

    Picture Album - http://imgur.com/a/lox5Q#0
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  29. #29
    FYI- the brake line tabs up front need to go on the inside of the frame. Not like they show in the manual. There is an aluminum piece that goes on the outside and it interferes when you mount the tab on the outside. I can't remember who posted and warned us about it.

    I plan on making all lines go through the center tunnel also. Looks cleaner, and keeps them away from the hot coolant lines.
    Thanks- Chad
    818R-SOLD!!!- Go Karted 7/20/14/ Officially raced NASA ST2- 2/28/15
    2016 Elan NP01 Prototype Racecar Chassis #20
    1969 Porsche 911ST Vintage Race Car
    1972 Porsche 911T (#'s matching undergoing nut & bolt resto in my garage)

  30. #30
    818 builder metalmaker12's Avatar
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    Yea the inside bro

  31. #31
    Senior Member Xusia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.Plavan View Post
    I plan on making all lines go through the center tunnel also. Looks cleaner, and keeps them away from the hot coolant lines.
    I was thinking alone those lines myself.

  32. #32
    East Coast Speed Machines Erik W. Treves's Avatar
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    oh ...I don't know....you can do it if you think outside the box....

    FFR 1879, Blown DSS 306,REDLINE management, VeryCoolParts Tuned 460RWHP

    FFR 818S, The Flash, Chassis #5, 2.0L, LSD, Electromotive TEC-S, VCP Tuned, 278RWHP 265 RWTQ

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  33. #33
    i keep seeing it and i have to ask:

    why the coils of brake/clutch hard lines? room for vibration or movement?

  34. #34
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    You mean to say the manual is wrong? Can't be? They spend hundreds of hours pining over this build manual so we would have a pleasurable build experience.

    We don't plan on using most of the "tin" that comes with the kit. Nothing pisses a race car owner off like having to drill rivets out just to work on something, but I'll check and see when I feel like sorting through that box of death again.


    The worst part about the manual constantly being wrong/off/different is you can't build A without B without C without D. A wasn't shipped with my kit, B won't fit without A, C is on eternal backorder, D just won't work in a real race situation. I'm trying NOT to have to build this thing 2,3,4 times but it's not turning out that way. One step forward, 2 back. Barf....
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  35. #35
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apexanimal View Post
    i keep seeing it and i have to ask:

    why the coils of brake/clutch hard lines? room for vibration or movement?
    Yep, damping. They'll even work loose at the fittings if you have enough movement/leverage.

    Also, I didn't mention this in the post, for our builds the SAE -> Metric adapters were filed in the bin. We just cut all the fittings off the donor and used those. Every junction is a potential leak. We're trying to simplify and add lightness.
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  36. #36
    Are you going to move the front to the "R" height at some point? I have an extra set of spacers if you need them.
    Thanks- Chad
    818R-SOLD!!!- Go Karted 7/20/14/ Officially raced NASA ST2- 2/28/15
    2016 Elan NP01 Prototype Racecar Chassis #20
    1969 Porsche 911ST Vintage Race Car
    1972 Porsche 911T (#'s matching undergoing nut & bolt resto in my garage)

  37. #37
    Senior Member RM1SepEx's Avatar
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    I just looked at your pictures

    R height in the rear, S height with rear LCA on top of the brackets in the front... You need Chad's spacers

    also noticed two fixed length transverse arms in the rear, that won't work. You need adjustables for the rear transverse lower arms
    Last edited by RM1SepEx; 01-09-2014 at 02:02 PM.
    Dan

    818S #17 Picked up 8/1/13 First start 11/1/13 Go Kart 3/28/14

  38. #38
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.Plavan View Post
    Are you going to move the front to the "R" height at some point? I have an extra set of spacers if you need them.
    Wasn't planning on it. I like the UCA being trapped up there and from what we measured there won't be any issue with the inner mounting point being slightly lower. The massive bolt and added spacer don't seem worth it from a structural POV IMO.
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  39. #39
    Senior Member SixStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RM1SepEx View Post
    I just looked at your pictures

    R height in the rear, S height with rear LCA on top of the brackets in the front... You need Chad's spacers

    also noticed two fixed length transverse arms in the rear, that won't work. You need adjustables for the rear transverse lower arms
    We know. Placeholder stuff off the S donor.
    Owner/builder - AEM Intakes 818R #85

  40. #40
    Senior Member D Clary's Avatar
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    I was thinking about the upper control arm mounting. Lowering the inside mount should give you more camber gain and allow you to run less static camber, which should give you better tire patch entering corners and braking. I am not a fan of big bolts and spacers. My concern is that with the added camber gain you bump steer also increases. Have you investigated the effect from the s mounting?

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