Seat belt anchor points

[Quiny]

For those of you not using the stock seats where are you anchoring the seat belt ends? Should they be mounted to the seat or is frame mounting ok? Does the DMV have any regulations about it?

[Wayne Presley]

Always the frame.

[Jaime]

BTW, those of us using stock seats have the same problem. The 818S has no outboard lower anchor point.

[RM1SepEx]

weld them in, like I did, details in my thread.

[Triathletedave]

BTW, those of us using stock seats have the same problem. The 818S has no outboard lower anchor point.

Those of us using stock seats have another problem: The slot in the aluminum where the belt passes through is altogether too high for hip restraint. the slot ends up around the middle of the driver's rib cage, not low around the hips. I will be cutting a new pass-through slot for the belt much lower in addition to welding in tabs to anchor both sides of the lower belt ends.

[RM1SepEx]

Those of us using stock seats have another problem: The slot in the aluminum where the belt passes through is altogether too high for hip restraint. the slot ends up around the middle of the driver's rib cage, not low around the hips. I will be cutting a new pass-through slot for the belt much lower in addition to welding in tabs to anchor both sides of the lower belt ends.

pass through slot? do you mean where the belt come out of the rear sedan belt reel? The belt goes out and up to the pivot hung off the roll bar. It's all detailed for my 05 stock seats in my thread. Tho I did use 3/4 high sliders and removed the angle brace...

[Triathletedave]

pass through slot? do you mean where the belt come out of the rear sedan belt reel? The belt goes out and up to the pivot hung off the roll bar. It's all detailed for my 05 stock seats in my thread. Tho I did use 3/4 high sliders and removed the angle brace...

No, the belt reel I used is from the wagon (my donor), is located directly behind the seat. I am referring to the slot in the side aluminum panel where the end of the belt runs back down to the outside anchor point (by the driver's left hip). This slot is just above the 'sedan' belt reel mounting point. I think that the build manual may be missing a bit of detail on how to anchor the ends on a 'wagon' donor seat belt. I'm thinking that I should mount the end of the strap INSIDE the aluminum (no slot needed), and not outside. I'll snap a few pics tonight to get some better detail.

[Quiny]

No, the belt reel I used is from the wagon (my donor), is located directly behind the seat. I am referring to the slot in the side aluminum panel where the end of the belt runs back down to the outside anchor point (by the driver's left hip). This slot is just above the 'sedan' belt reel mounting point. I think that the build manual may be missing a bit of detail on how to anchor the ends on a 'wagon' donor seat belt. I'm thinking that I should mount the end of the strap INSIDE the aluminum (no slot needed), and not outside. I'll snap a few pics tonight to get some better detail.

I am using the wagon belts as well that mount behind the seat. I believe that if you use that style you don't use the side slot, that is only for the sedan belts. We all still need to come up with 2 anchor points on our own. If you look at a current car you will see they usually mount to an area on either side of where the seat back pivots to recline. I am using the Boyd tank so I will cut a piece of aluminum that fills the extra gap as well as the hole for the sedan belts. One mount would be for the seatbelt receiver and the other on the left side for the bottom belt mount. There was just a recent post about center console mounting that showed this.

[RM1SepEx]

correct, that slot is only used for the sedan belts

[CU9DZ]

I have a problem with where the seat belt buckle attaches to the stock drivers seat from my 02 donor. I took out the slider hardware and everything else under the seat including the bar under the rear of the seat. The bolt from the seat belt buckle goes there according to the picture in the build book. But the arm for the buckle is to close to the seat and I can't use a longer bolt because the donor bolt has a shoulder under the head. The arm for the buckle is supposed to swivel on that shoulder area. I will try to get a pic and post it. Anybody else with problems with the drivers seat buckle?
Dave

[Jaime]

Here's what I did for the lower mounts:

[CU9DZ]

Thanks nice pics.
Dave

[dougkirkbride]

image.jpg

Wish they would have put the mount right above the tank hidden behind the firewall. I would get about 2" more of recline if so. Is everyone using a the steel gusset for the spool as a template and drilling the firewall and mounting the spool on top ,sandwiching it?

image.jpg

I will post other anchor points later.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

This is a test I did a long time ago. I think I used the passenger belt on the driver side and vice versa.
I mounted the shoulder spool on the engine side of the bracket allowing my seat to go back further.
See picture
Bob

[GUNS]

So for us non welding types, are there any other areas to mount a 5 or 6 point harness on the S? Specifically the lap and anti sub belts.

[dougkirkbride]

This is a test I did a long time ago. I think I used the passenger belt on the driver side and vice versa.
I mounted the shoulder spool on the engine side of the bracket allowing my seat to go back further.
See picture
Bob

Did you leave it like that?

[dougkirkbride]

Finally got around to mounting the 2 dead ends. 7/16 hardware is tough to find. That what I used for these.
image.jpg
A lot easier to see without the seat, this is the drivers side only in the pics. The latch side had to be flattened, but it fits nice with my 06 stock seats.
image.jpg

This is a view looking in from the outside. The spool dead end has a bend at the end that fits right under the 1.5" tube.

image.jpg

Bolt just fits between my brake lines.......exactly how i planned it.....

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Did you leave it like that?

It's like that right now, but I'm going with a 5-6 point harness.

[Goldwing]

FFR just announced a harness bar if your looking for a supported solution on the 5-6 PT harnesses.

Doug, I bolted my dead end in a similar spot. The buckle end I bolted to the 1" bar going across the front of the fuel tank tray. I like the welded mount above, but I don't weld yet. The buckle pigtail isn't in a ideal spot. It likes to fall in the space between the seat and the center console. Some sort of device to hold it up without damaging the belt will be a big help.

[GUNS]

The harness bar is nice, but I'm more interested in the lap belt and anit-sub mounting...

[RM1SepEx]

I went through that starting on page 14 of my build thread, be sure to have a beer in hand, it was frustrating between poorly developed seat brackets and no mounting points for belts...

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showt...-Thread/page14

[dougkirkbride]

Ya, at this point in my build, I don't want to weld either, lots of stuff to cover up. I had second thoughts on drilling the main frame tube runners, due to the large hole and frame integrity. (Hole was for 7/16 bolt). Oh well it's done now. I would think that Ffr would have planned something for this's due to safety but if one is building a car your life is in your hands so to speak..

The big thick welded in plate with the hole and small slot on the side was useless to me. Probably should ditch it for a speaker or something.

I really want to come up with a bolt on bracket to attach to existing welded in bracket that lowers the spool to be just above the tank, with a slot for the belt in the Ffr firewall, so I can utilize the full recline. Wouldn't be that tough but that's just more time.... The story of my life so says my wife..

[dougkirkbride]

Ok, I won't leave this alone, bugs me knowing I can get some more recline out of it. Can someone send a pic of the spool mounted to the side. Even though my donar was an 06 wagon I wonder if I can still mount spool on the side. I think I may still be able to use the slot but need to drill a new hole, the hole I am pointing to in the pic, is that the spool mount hole or for something else.

image.jpg

[Frank818]

Are you guys using the front or rear belts from the donor?

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Ok, I won't leave this alone, bugs me knowing I can get some more recline out of it. Can someone send a pic of the spool mounted to the side. Even though my donar was an 06 wagon I wonder if I can still mount spool on the side. I think I may still be able to use the slot but need to drill a new hole, the hole I am pointing to in the pic, is that the spool mount hole or for something else.

image.jpg

You cannot use wagon belts mounted on the side. There is a mechanism in them that if not pointed straight up, the belt spool locks.
You should be able to find someone on here to give you sedan belts if that the way you want to go.
Depending on the width of your seats, some have had trouble getting sedan belts to work.
Bob

[Goldwing]

If I didn't modify the firewall, I'd prefer the wagon belts. They're a cleaner installation I think. In my setup, the sedan belts were my only option. The belt slot in the aluminum seems awkward. I added a little bend to the slot area to help it feed better.

Doug , if you get a set of sedan belts in the mail, the spools will be locked. Loosely bolt them into position and give them a strong pull, then release. That should unlock the seat belt spool. It's what I had to do. TK, in Akron, has a box of belts if you come up empty. Somehow I had one extra, but it is damaged with missing parts.

[dougkirkbride]

Are you guys using the front or rear belts from the donor?

Rears from a wagon donar.

[dougkirkbride]

You cannot use wagon belts mounted on the side. There is a mechanism in them that if not pointed straight up, the belt spool locks.
You should be able to find someone on here to give you sedan belts if that the way you want to go.
Depending on the width of your seats, some have had trouble getting sedan belts to work.
Bob

Great to know! Thanks bob, you saved me a lot of grief. I am back to the bracket design for dropping it Behind the firewall.
My seats are really tight with the sides and tunnel. I would be hard pressed to have an 1/8" clearance on each side. The back is the best place for the spool for my seats.

Thanks for the info.
Doug

[dougkirkbride]

If I didn't modify the firewall, I'd prefer the wagon belts. They're a cleaner installation I think. In my setup, the sedan belts were my only option. The belt slot in the aluminum seems awkward. I added a little bend to the slot area to help it feed better.

Doug , if you get a set of sedan belts in the mail, the spools will be locked. Loosely bolt them into position and give them a strong pull, then release. That should unlock the seat belt spool. It's what I had to do. TK, in Akron, has a box of belts if you come up empty. Somehow I had one extra, but it is damaged with missing parts.

Thanks for the info rich. I think I will stick with my wagon belts, I agree they are pretty clean especially If I can drop them below the firewall.

[Frank818]

Doug, if we use the rear seat belts, aren't we going to be stuck with a belt buckle lock (the component on your right side of the pelvis where the buckle buckles up) that is made of nylon and won't stay up in the air? What I mean is that the rear belts look like #7 in the pic

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detai...showimage.html

But the front ones look more like #6. Aren't we going to be chasing after the lock that slid underneath the seat? As far as I know, the rear belts shouldn't lock using the front lock. Never tried on a Subaru though.

[dougkirkbride]

Doug, if we use the rear seat belts, aren't we going to be stuck with a belt buckle lock (the component on your right side of the pelvis where the buckle buckles up) that is made of nylon and won't stay up in the air? What I mean is that the rear belts look like #7 in the pic

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detai...showimage.html

But the front ones look more like #6. Aren't we going to be chasing after the lock that slid underneath the seat? As far as I know, the rear belts shouldn't lock using the front lock. Never tried on a Subaru though.

Yes your correct. It's nylon but with my stock seats and the way I have it mounted there is no where for it to go. It lays on the corner of the seat pretty nicely.

image.jpg

image.jpg

[Frank818]

Ha! Nice point! I forgot how tight that area is, it's probably the same with my seats too. Might even be quite tight with the tunnel aluminum.

Well you answered my concern the best way possible, tnx for that.

[Goldwing]

I've been mulling over that exact issue. The buckle slides down pretty easily in my case, but a royal pain to get it back out. I just can't leave that issue as is. Possible thoughts?
1 replace buckle with a metal strap version.
2 experiment with a bungee strap attached to the strap loop hole of the buckle and looped invisibly back down the crack between the seat back and bottom and attached somewhere down there. Could wear out over time, but nearly invisible. Cheap, effective.
3 attaching a parallel stiff strap to the tunnel such that it can pivot with seat sliding that passes through the belt loop hole with two 90 degree bends to create a landing on the buckle and glued to the backside of the buckle. Shouldn't interfere in an accident, but could be a rattle issue, which generated the glue thought. More visible, so would have to be done in an aesthetic manner.

I'll at least try 2 first since it's easy and cheap to try.

[GUNS]

For a 6 point harness, I think I'm going to try to use the supplied seat brackets as lap belt brackets. We'll see..

[dougkirkbride]

2 weeks later, finally done with seat belt locations. very happy with the results, gives me maximum recline as you can see in the pics. i came up with a bracket to mount the spool to and drop it out from behing the seat. (bracket not pretty but sandwiched between firewalls) my upper piece of ffr firewall was bent down 15 degrees further than original to gain leg room and move seat back with the boyd tank. with this piece bent further down I had to drop the spool so it would fit in the depth that was available. i strung the belt thru the firewall ( I also have another wall on the other side of the tube behind the tank) only draw back i see is that the space i used may have been good for speakers. i will need to find another area.

image.jpg
image.jpg
image.jpg

[Samiam1017]

Doug do you happen to have pics of the spool mounted from strait on with out the aluminum cover on it?

[dougkirkbride]

Doug do you happen to have pics of the spool mounted from strait on with out the aluminum cover on it?

I would need to undo the belt from the spool to get it out so i can remove the ffr firewall. what are you wanting to see? i can take a picture from the back but you will only see my bracket.

[Samiam1017]

From the back will help. But I really don't know what the wagon rear belts look like and I have about 6 cars worth of belts and can't seem to locate my 05 wagon belts thx

[dougkirkbride]

From the back will help. But I really don't know what the wagon rear belts look like and I have about 6 cars worth of belts and can't seem to locate my 05 wagon belts thx

Here is a pic from the back but the way i understand the difference between the wagon and the sedan, the wagon unspools vertical, the sedan can be at an angle. my spool will not unspool unless you are pulling straight up with the mount plate vertical. hope this helps.
image.jpg

[Frank818]

Finally got around to mounting the 2 dead ends. 7/16 hardware is tough to find. That what I used for these.
image.jpg
A lot easier to see without the seat, this is the drivers side only in the pics. The latch side had to be flattened, but it fits nice with my 06 stock seats.
image.jpg

This is a view looking in from the outside. The spool dead end has a bend at the end that fits right under the 1.5" tube.

image.jpg

Bolt just fits between my brake lines.......exactly how i planned it.....

Doug, this is really nice. Do you have a pic of the hole for the belt anchor point (not the knuckle)? When I mock up mine the same way, the hole seems to be so high that I am not sure it will be under the top of the 1.5" lower tubing.

Besides, what length bolts you used? 2.25?
Never thought of using M12x55 instead? Might be easier to find for the others who have not installed it yet.

tnx