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Thread: EdwardBs Mk4 #8674 20th Anniversary Build

  1. #761
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharris2 View Post
    You have the carbon fiber dash; did you install the heater box? if not if i were to move the firewall forward; how much room do you think i would get with the coyote gen3

    Scott
    I don't have the carbon fiber dash. Wasn't offered at that time. The 20th Anniversary came with a pre-made plastic padded dash and glovebox. Didn't care for it. I used a blank aluminum dash, did my open sort of competition layout, then covered with thin padding and leather. Made my own glovebox. The build doesn't have a space heater. Only heated seats. I haven't installed a space heater in a Roadster yet. So no experience there. Also haven't done a firewall forward. I know the firewall forward will fit with the Coyote. I've seen other builds where it's been done. Don't know what that means for a heater and glovebox though. So not going to be much help. Sorry.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  2. #762
    Senior Member mmklaxer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post

    This is the Aeromotive regulator mounted at the firewall, and the supply and return lines in the engine compartment. It’s not obvious in this picture, but I had to make a new bracket for the regulator to stand it away from the firewall one inch. The main harness for the Coyote needs to pass behind it.


    Your master cutoff switch appears to have a round plate riveted into place around it; It this for additional support, or other function?

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  4. #763
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmklaxer View Post
    Your master cutoff switch appears to have a round plate riveted into place around it; It this for additional support, or other function?
    Yes, for additional support. The Ron Francis MS-1 master disconnect I used has a relatively heavy action. So I added the round doubler.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

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  6. #764
    Senior Member mmklaxer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    Some hours later (!), had the leather applied and everything installed. Having done a couple panels in vinyl and now leather, it’s a bit different. It goes from flat to a little wavy when the contact cement is applied. Maybe wouldn’t be as pronounced if the cement were sprayed. But with care it goes down and rolls out nice and flat. It also eats blades. I went through a stack of X-Acto blades. I pulled the leather through to the back with pie cuts on all but a couple openings where there isn't room and there's a sufficient flange or finish washer. The holes were cut taking this into account. These pictures don’t really do the leather justice. The natural grain is pretty cool. I still have work to do on the glovebox. I’m planning to line the interior with leather (have plenty) and then need to cover and hang the door. The grab handle is just bolted through the dash at this point. Once the dash is installed in the chassis, I’ll add braces down to the 2x2 dash tube as I’ve done before.


    ANy recommendations on how to apply the covering to avoid wrinkles and/or wavy results? my initial thought was to put the vinyl (in my case rapper extreme) face down on the ground as it lays pretty flat, spray it and the padded dash, place the dash on top, weight it down and pull the ends up around to the ends of the dash to secure. I assume pulling the ends and holding in place will keep enough tension on the vinyl to prevent wrinkling, but I wouldn't know until ti dries and I turn it over.

    Another option would be to install it finish side facing up to ensure check for waves, but then I have no pressure on the vinyl to ensure it sticks. Thanks for your advice!

  7. #765
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmklaxer View Post
    ANy recommendations on how to apply the covering to avoid wrinkles and/or wavy results? my initial thought was to put the vinyl (in my case rapper extreme) face down on the ground as it lays pretty flat, spray it and the padded dash, place the dash on top, weight it down and pull the ends up around to the ends of the dash to secure. I assume pulling the ends and holding in place will keep enough tension on the vinyl to prevent wrinkling, but I wouldn't know until ti dries and I turn it over.

    Another option would be to install it finish side facing up to ensure check for waves, but then I have no pressure on the vinyl to ensure it sticks. Thanks for your advice!
    In this case, because it's leather and not particularly stretchy, I taped the leather piece back side up on my workbench. Then brushed contact cement on both surfaces and made sure the leather was as flat as possible. When both sides dry to the touch carefully dropped the dash onto the leather. The adhesion is instant but still removed and rolled out to make sure. Plus pulled around and adhered the curved ends. There were no wrinkles and all good. I'm not sure this process would be the best for yours though. I've used that rapper extreme vinyl before and it's quite stretchy and might not lay flat enough to use a similar process. I'd recommend having the dash on the bench face up and drop the vinyl onto it. I'd also recommend having a helper. Hold the vinyl piece in the air by the four corners. Drop one end and start pushing it into place holding the rest above the surface. Work to the other end slightly pulling as you go and pressing into place. If you use contact cement (spray or brush) the adhesion is instant and you shouldn't get any wrinkles. No dry time required. But you want it placed exactly right when making the first contact. My experience is if you pull it up and try to reposition, enough glue and/or foam (if you're using it) will stick and make the contacting surfaces rough enough that it shows through. Not nice. Hope that helps and good luck.

    One other hint based on experience with several builds. I regularly see guys trimming the holes in the dash (gauges, switches, glovebox, etc.) to the outline of the holes. Then struggle sometimes to hide the cut edges. Don't do it that way. Make all the holes just oversize enough to pie cut the material, pull through the holes, and glue on the back side. You don't need the pie cuts to be right to the edge of the holes either. Within 1/16" or maybe a little more. Especially with the stretchy material you're using. When you pull around to the back side you'll end up with a nice clean hole, no cuts visible, and the gauges, etc. cover perfectly and will stay that way over time.
    Last edited by edwardb; 02-14-2023 at 06:31 AM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

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  9. #766
    Senior Member mmklaxer's Avatar
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    Very helpful, thanks. The weld wood landau blue high heat contact cement I used for the pad to aluminum took a while to take a set, so good to know it’s more instantaneous when attaching two “soft” materials. That coulda been bad….

  10. #767
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmklaxer View Post
    Very helpful, thanks. The weld wood landau blue high heat contact cement I used for the pad to aluminum took a while to take a set, so good to know it’s more instantaneous when attaching two “soft” materials. That coulda been bad….
    Slightly confused by your response. Any contact cement should be allowed to be dry to the touch on both surfaces before joining. Different surfaces will flash dry at different speeds. Also depends on how thick you put it on. Doesn't have to be thick at all. When dry, there should be just a slight shine to it and you're good to go. If it dries dull (like it does on leather BTW) a light second coat should be applied. In all cases, applied this way, the bond is instant and weighing down, waiting for it to dry, etc. isn't required. In fact, doesn't do anything. Use a roller to make sure it's firmly down and that's it. Note this Weldwood Landau product is actually intended to be sprayed, and that's what most pro shops do. But brushing it on for our projects works fine in my experience.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  11. #768
    Senior Member mmklaxer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    Slightly confused by your response. Any contact cement should be allowed to be dry to the touch on both surfaces before joining. Different surfaces will flash dry at different speeds. Also depends on how thick you put it on. Doesn't have to be thick at all. When dry, there should be just a slight shine to it and you're good to go. If it dries dull (like it does on leather BTW) a light second coat should be applied. In all cases, applied this way, the bond is instant and weighing down, waiting for it to dry, etc. isn't required. In fact, doesn't do anything. Use a roller to make sure it's firmly down and that's it. Note this Weldwood Landau product is actually intended to be sprayed, and that's what most pro shops do. But brushing it on for our projects works fine in my experience.
    I'm using the spray cans of weldwood landau, and I waited the 1-3 minutes to allow the product to tack up prior to applying the foam - even still, it was not adhering as you describe. I don't feel that I laid the product on too thick, so not sure what went wrong.

    I have a fresh can of weldwood that I'll practice on some scrap padding/vinyl before the real application.

  12. #769
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmklaxer View Post
    I'm using the spray cans of weldwood landau, and I waited the 1-3 minutes to allow the product to tack up prior to applying the foam - even still, it was not adhering as you describe. I don't feel that I laid the product on too thick, so not sure what went wrong.

    I have a fresh can of weldwood that I'll practice on some scrap padding/vinyl before the real application.
    My experience and advice was completely based on the non-aerosol version, e.g. out of a gallon can. I've heard mixed reviews on the aerosol product. Can only suggest lots of experimentation before committing to the real thing. If it's not tacking up and providing instant bond then much of what I described doesn't apply. Good luck.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

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    Hi Paul, just wondering if you any information on the MAF intake tube required. I'm at the the point where I'm installing the elbow and realised I don't have the Spectre intake tube thats recommended. Would happen to have a part number for thye one you got?

  14. #771
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redlinejoev View Post
    Hi Paul, just wondering if you any information on the MAF intake tube required. I'm at the the point where I'm installing the elbow and realised I don't have the Spectre intake tube thats recommended. Would happen to have a part number for thye one you got?
    I've done three builds that required a MAF intake tube. This one uses these parts:

    Spectre SPE-9705 Mass Air Sensor filter adapter, Spectre SPE-9741 4” to 3.50” Reducer adapter, Spectre SPE-9771 4” hose coupling, Spectre 4” 90 ° intake tube, Spectre SPE-9799, Spectre Performance 8130 Small Air Filter Heat Shield

    My Coupe (Gen 3 Coyote) uses these parts:

    Treadstone Performance MAPHL35 MAF Mass Air Flow Adapter Pipe 3.5", Treadstone Performance ACCH35 HoneyComb MAF Mass Air Meter Airflow Straightener - 3.5", Treadstone Performance S35090BLK 90 Degree Silicone Hose Couplers 3.50" - 3.50"

    My Truck build, although an LS3, uses similar parts and the Performance MRP MAF adapter pipes have been used in Coyote builds:

    Performance MRP HA-SS-400D6 Mass Air Flow Housing with Air Straightener, 4.00" OD, 3.75" ID, Summit Racing SUM-294068 90 Degree Elbow, Silicone, Black, 4.00 in. Inlet, 4.00 in. Outlet, 6.00 in. Legs

    So it's been kind of a mixed bag and you have various options. Spectre parts weren't available during certain periods, so the Treadstone Performance parts were referenced as an alternate in the Factory Five instructions. Those also started to be more difficult to obtain, so Performance MRP because an alternate. The Performance MRP part I purchased for my truck build was in stock and shipped immediately.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  15. #772
    25th Anniversary #9772 toadster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    I've done three builds that required a MAF intake tube. This one uses these parts:

    Spectre SPE-9705 Mass Air Sensor filter adapter, Spectre SPE-9741 4” to 3.50” Reducer adapter, Spectre SPE-9771 4” hose coupling, Spectre 4” 90 ° intake tube, Spectre SPE-9799, Spectre Performance 8130 Small Air Filter Heat Shield

    My Coupe (Gen 3 Coyote) uses these parts:

    Treadstone Performance MAPHL35 MAF Mass Air Flow Adapter Pipe 3.5", Treadstone Performance ACCH35 HoneyComb MAF Mass Air Meter Airflow Straightener - 3.5", Treadstone Performance S35090BLK 90 Degree Silicone Hose Couplers 3.50" - 3.50"

    My Truck build, although an LS3, uses similar parts and the Performance MRP MAF adapter pipes have been used in Coyote builds:

    Performance MRP HA-SS-400D6 Mass Air Flow Housing with Air Straightener, 4.00" OD, 3.75" ID, Summit Racing SUM-294068 90 Degree Elbow, Silicone, Black, 4.00 in. Inlet, 4.00 in. Outlet, 6.00 in. Legs

    So it's been kind of a mixed bag and you have various options. Spectre parts weren't available during certain periods, so the Treadstone Performance parts were referenced as an alternate in the Factory Five instructions. Those also started to be more difficult to obtain, so Performance MRP because an alternate. The Performance MRP part I purchased for my truck build was in stock and shipped immediately.
    always a treasure trove of info Paul!

    did you use the 2 flow calibration tubes - (76 millimeter and 89 millimeter) which reduces the 4 inch intake system to the correct diameter at the sensor to retain calibration. from here: https://www.spectreperformance.com/9...or-adapter-kit
    Todd
    25th Anniversary MkIV | #20 of 25 | Build #9772
    https://cobradreams.com/ <- my build!

  16. #773
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toadster View Post
    did you use the 2 flow calibration tubes - (76 millimeter and 89 millimeter) which reduces the 4 inch intake system to the correct diameter at the sensor to retain calibration. from here: https://www.spectreperformance.com/9...or-adapter-kit
    For the Spectre intake I used the reducer as described in the FF Gen 2 Coyote installation instructions. I can't tell you exactly which one it was because it was some years ago. But just to set your expectations, nothing you're going to do with the MAF tube is going to retain calibration. Without the OE stock airbox, the MAF calibration will not be correct. The custom tune required for best running Coyote installations addresses this. The Gen 3 Coyote in my Coupe was undriveable with the stock tune and was fixed by the Lund Performance custom tune. The guy that did the work said a high percentage of the tune adjustment (and the cause of my undriveable condition) was the MAF calibration.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  17. #774
    25th Anniversary #9772 toadster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    For the Spectre intake I used the reducer as described in the FF Gen 2 Coyote installation instructions. I can't tell you exactly which one it was because it was some years ago. But just to set your expectations, nothing you're going to do with the MAF tube is going to retain calibration. Without the OE stock airbox, the MAF calibration will not be correct. The custom tune required for best running Coyote installations addresses this. The Gen 3 Coyote in my Coupe was undriveable with the stock tune and was fixed by the Lund Performance custom tune. The guy that did the work said a high percentage of the tune adjustment (and the cause of my undriveable condition) was the MAF calibration.
    awesome thanks - there is no mention of the Spectre intake in the gen3 documentation, just the silicon hose that FFR provides, good to know there's historical content to review too!
    I'll reach out to Lund to get their recommendations too -thanks!
    Todd
    25th Anniversary MkIV | #20 of 25 | Build #9772
    https://cobradreams.com/ <- my build!

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    Thanks Paul, as usual you're a wealth of knowledge. I've used your build threads to build my car so I owe you a great debt of gratitude. It's also nice to see your answer helped others too.

    Joe

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  20. #776
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    EdwardB (Paul),

    I re-read your build threads repeatedly to ensure I get sanity from all the different opinions on building this car. What I noticed in your threads is no mention of trimming the UCA back side sleeves and threads like so many others do for the power steering setup. Is that just an omission on your part of the write up or you get sufficient play to get to the front alignment numbers Caster & Camber).

    Thanks

    Bill

  21. #777
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maclonchas View Post
    EdwardB (Paul),

    I re-read your build threads repeatedly to ensure I get sanity from all the different opinions on building this car. What I noticed in your threads is no mention of trimming the UCA back side sleeves and threads like so many others do for the power steering setup. Is that just an omission on your part of the write up or you get sufficient play to get to the front alignment numbers Caster & Camber).

    Thanks

    Bill
    Trimming the UCA's isn't required 100% of the time. Sometimes it's possible to get the power steering caster setting without trimming. Some feel that it's easier to just trim during assembly and then it's not an issue. I chose to wait and see because IMO it's not that hard to take apart if necessary. In this case, I didn't have to.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

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  23. #778
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    Edwardb,
    After completing the IRS assembly, did you torque the CV axle nuts to spec at this time?
    If yes, what procedure did you use to keep the axle from spinning while you apply torque? Thanks.

    Josh.

  24. #779
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsingh View Post
    Edwardb,
    After completing the IRS assembly, did you torque the CV axle nuts to spec at this time?
    If yes, what procedure did you use to keep the axle from spinning while you apply torque? Thanks.

    Josh.
    During the initial assembly, there's no way to hold things enough to get the spec torque amount. Snug them up the best you can. Once you get the brakes installed, you may be able to hold the disk with the e-brake enough to torque. Or with the brakes bled, holding the brake pedal down may do the job. The easiest is with the tire/wheel installed and on the ground. Then they torque without much drama. So you can save the step until later when it's a roller. Just don't forget.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

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