Boig Motorsports

Visit our community sponsor

Thanks Thanks:  0
Likes Likes:  0
Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: Coolest/most streetable engine/tranny

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    4
    Post Thanks / Like

    Coolest/most streetable engine/tranny

    So I'll probably take the dive on a 33 kit in the next few months after finally getting the go ahead from the significant other. I'd like to make sure that we can both enjoy this car and will need to keep it an automatic. The only other concern is heat since we live in Phoenix, AZ. So that brings me to my question.

    What is the coldest running engine/trans combo people are running with? I really would prefer to drive it almost daily and need it to be able to cope with stop and go traffic and 120*F ambient temps without breaking a sweat (see what I did there?).

    Physics tells me a smaller displacement motor generates smaller explosions and therefore less heat but then you have to throw compression and differences in cooling characteristics from more efficient coolant paths in the block etc...

    Who can point me in the right direction?

  2. #2
    Senior Member SingleMaltWSKY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    240
    Post Thanks / Like
    In my experience it's hard to go wrong with a basic 302 Ford, tons of guys run them in old Mustangs and other hot rods very reliably and there's a good aftermarket for them. The 302 makes a great sound as well, even in lower spec without the crazy cam's etc.
    If you want simplicity, go with a crate 302 from Blueprint or another reliable source - then go with one of the easy fuel injection kits (Sniper, Atomic, lots of choice) - it will start every time.

    If you really want to guard against heat, go with an oversized or nicer multi core rad.

    EDIT - oh, and some extra fans on that rad never hurt. Some puller fans are a great idea on an auxiliary switch or temp switch for when you hit that hot traffic.

    My 2 cents - hope that helps!
    Last edited by SingleMaltWSKY; 02-07-2017 at 03:26 PM.
    Jonas
    _____________________

    Check out our build blog - https://vjjfactoryfive.wordpress.com/
    FFR Type-65 Coupe 720
    London Ontario Canada

  3. #3
    Senior Member stack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Macedon, NY
    Posts
    320
    Post Thanks / Like
    Hard to beat a 302 and AOD trans for simplicity. FFR has a nice AFCO radiator so it should keep it cool without any problem.

    stack
    FFR MKI Roadster FFR2202K Built in 2000 sold
    FFR Hot Rod #39 under construction

  4. #4
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    4
    Post Thanks / Like
    Good call guys and right on board with where I was heading (radiator shroud, multiple fans, etc..). 302 and KISS it is!

  5. #5
    Ol Skool
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    816
    Post Thanks / Like
    Gee, I thought the cylinder heads with the most coolant per chamber, a Plymouth grille, and a bigger Griffin radiator would surely lead you to a Hemi.
    Stick with the 302 Ford...

  6. #6

    Steve >> aka: GoDadGo
    GoDadGo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Slidell, Louisiana
    Posts
    6,556
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    1
    I'm a big fan of the Fabulous Small Block Chevy with iron heads and a Turbo 350 Transmission.

    Parts are cheap and you can buy them from very basic to totally wild. Prices range from as low as $1,500 for a (New) basic long block and parts tend to be less expensive than other manufacturers. Intake manifold options are all over the place as well, as long as you steer clear of the Tall Port Race Style Heads.

    Transmission choices are easier too since the small and big blocks all fit on the same mounts and have the same bell housing bolt pattern. Should you choose to go with a manual transmission at a later date, then it's nice to know that many of bell housings utilize factory hydraulic clutch set ups.

    Finally, I don't think it really matters what you put in the car as long as the block hasn't been bored past.030" and is in good working condition.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Shawnee KS< KC Burb
    Posts
    844
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by erlihemi View Post
    Gee, I thought the cylinder heads with the most coolant per chamber, a Plymouth grille, and a bigger Griffin radiator would surely lead you to a Hemi.
    Stick with the 302 Ford...
    Only a lunatic would put a Hemi in a 33 FORD replica.
    Duckin and runnin >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    db

  8. #8
    Ol Skool
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    816
    Post Thanks / Like

    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by myjones View Post
    Only a lunatic would put a Hemi in a 33 FORD replica.
    Duckin and runnin >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    db
    Neither Ozzie nor I have been contained by straight jackets!

  9. #9
    Ol Skool
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    816
    Post Thanks / Like
    BTW, an automatic does increase the heat load. If you can tolerate a manual trans the 302 with the T5 may run a little cooler.

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    90
    Post Thanks / Like
    GoDadGo and I are on the same page in our affinity for the Small Block Chevy, but we might be outliers on this forum. From there, the fan provided is pretty good, but you could add a shroud, high flow thermostat, water wetter or whatever that stuff is that helps heat transfer, and run without side panels.

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    831
    Post Thanks / Like
    I live out here near Phoenix, and I don't think it will be a problem with an appropriately sized radiator and a decent fan. For what it's worth, my Hyundai starts to overheat in summer traffic because I haven't bothered to change the temp sensor and neither of the fans turn on. When I cut on the AC, the fans kick in on low and within a minute the temp drops from 215 to 188. Granted, this is a tiny 4 cylinder, but it's also a tiny radiator and tiny fans. Other guys out here drive large pickups (even I used to drive a Dodge Ram with the Hemi) and nobody worries about overheating unless they don't maintain their vehicles and split a hose or something. Even at 120*, you're still 60-80 degrees cooler than your engine needs to be.

  12. #12
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    10
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by GoDadGo View Post
    I'm a big fan of the Fabulous Small Block Chevy with iron heads and a Turbo 350 Transmission.
    I do like the SMC, but aluminum heads are so much better, run higher compression, more power, and less chance for detonation. Not to mention lighter! Aluminum heads and intake will lower the CG of the car. =)

    I think what is "cool" depends on the person. I am personally thinking of doing a 427 stroker engine, but I go back and forth on whether it'll be fueled by a carb or EFI. I like the ease of startup with EFI and tuning capability, but like the old school of the carb. We will see when I get there!

  13. #13
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    4
    Post Thanks / Like
    I meant cool from a temperature perspective only. My last build was a desert toy but only 30 minutes at a time because it ran so hot.

  14. #14
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    10
    Post Thanks / Like
    Haha....okay, my bad! Was speed reading with my cup of coffee in the morning!
    Think I will head for my second cup.

    A more modern engine with over head cams would be better than a old school push rod engine. Of course an all aluminum engine would all dissipate the heat better than iron.

    The bigger displacement and more power would just require bigger radiator than the smaller ones.

  15. #15
    Ol Skool
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    816
    Post Thanks / Like
    Somebody mentioned water wetter (like redline). That works as long as all gaskets and seals are new and compatible. Very good with aluminum heads and radiators. Caveat: I have added it to engines that have been run awhile and sprayed coolant all over the place!! It changes the capillary stickiness of water and it sneaks out of water pump seals, front cover gaskets, threaded fittings etc. I've even seen it crawl right up the head bolts on a Flathead with sealer on the threads. I do use it, but only on modern engines I've assembled, with sealer on all the threads exposed to the water jacket, and new gasket material.
    Ive found that good idle speed, correct ignition timing, proper fuel mixture, and a big fan cure most of the hot idle problems. Don't run the undersize pulleys on the crank.

  16. #16
    Jazzman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Scottsdale, AZ
    Posts
    1,164
    Post Thanks / Like
    Unless you plan to put AC into your 33, you're not going to drive it here in Phoenix in the summer!! I am certainly biased, but I am very pleased with my Coyote. If you would like to see it before you take the plunge, PM me. I am not sure exactly where you live, but I am in Scottsdale. Would be glad to meet and help another Factory Five builder. I may even have a few parts to share with you.
    Jazzman

    MKIV #8745 "Flip Top" Roadster, Custom Tilt front, Coyote Engine, Tremec TKO600, Custom Interior. Best of Show winner, Huntington Beach Cruise In 2018.

    1967 Ford Mustang Coupe build thread updated 1/22/2021

    Roadster Frame Dolly Plan

  17. #17
    Seasoned Citizen NAZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    "The High Country", beautiful Flagstaff, AZ
    Posts
    2,443
    Post Thanks / Like
    I vote for the SBC backed by a TKO600, hard to beat the variety of low cost parts available for the mouse motor. It's the same radiator no mater which engine you choose and the heat input to the radiator (BTUs) is generated by how much fuel you burn not the displacement. SBC, SBF, old school hemi power, flat head Ford -- the heat is generated by burning fuel not because one engine runs hotter than another. Pick your favorite power plant and don't worry about the heat.

  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    54
    Post Thanks / Like
    The quoted post is pretty much it. When we burn fuel about 1/3 of the energy goes out the tailpipe, 1/3 into the cooling system, and 1/3 to the drivetrain. The actual heat load depends on how much power we are generating and how efficient the engine is. Fuel injection and variable valve timing probably boost the efficiency a good bit as evidenced by the increase in fuel economy.

    At normal road speeds the power is probably less than 100 hp and maybe less than 50 hp if the car is reasonably aerodynamic.

    Quote Originally Posted by NAZ View Post
    It's the same radiator no mater which engine you choose and the heat input to the radiator (BTUs) is generated by how much fuel you burn not the displacement. SBC, SBF, old school hemi power, flat head Ford -- the heat is generated by burning fuel not because one engine runs hotter than another. Pick your favorite power plant and don't worry about the heat.

  19. #19
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    4
    Post Thanks / Like
    Hey Jazzman,

    I'm actually in Scottsdale as well, Miller and Cactus and I'll have to take you up on that offer sometime. AC is definitely a must. The only way I'll get away with this "toy" is by making it as comfortable as possible so both of us can enjoy it.

  20. #20

    Moderator
    RoadRacer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Manor, TX
    Posts
    2,235
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthTedious View Post
    GoDadGo and I are on the same page in our affinity for the Small Block Chevy, but we might be outliers on this forum.
    We're less and less "outliers" every day
    James

    FFR33 #997 (Gen1 chassis, Gen2 body), license plate DRIVE IT says it all! build thread
    My build: 350SBC, TKO600, hardtop, no fenders/hood, 32 grill, 3 link, sway bars, 355/30r19
    Previous cars: GTD40, Cobra, tubeframe 55 Chevy, 66 Nova, 56 F100

  21. #21
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    75
    Post Thanks / Like

    302 EFI Engine

    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRacer View Post
    We're less and less "outliers" every day
    If your in the market for an engine, we'd love to help you. Here is one of the newer setups with the Sniper EFI
    http://www.fordcobraengines.com/prod...mplete-engine/

    Any questions feel free to call Engine Factory 1-800-704-5385

  22. #22
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Loveland, CO
    Posts
    318
    Post Thanks / Like
    deleted
    Last edited by DaveS53; 04-27-2017 at 04:00 PM.

  23. #23
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Loveland, CO
    Posts
    318
    Post Thanks / Like
    You can't beat an LS3 when it comes to bang for the buck. Whether the engine over heats depends more on the radiator and fan setup than anything else. A better radiator and fan with a full shroud may be needed. You can also improve cooling with a coolant that does not use glycol, or a mix with some glycol. The '33 has a lot of room behind the radiator, so it might be possible to get a thicker core, for more cooling.

    The hard top is made so it's nearly impossible to insulate. The aluminum firewall and floor insure that there will be lots of heat in the cockpit. A thin layer of dynamat won't do the job. I custom made a well-insulated headliner in my car by bonding ¾” core foam to the top and covering it with fiberglass. The headliner remains cool, even with the black car in the sun.

    The custom radiator for my LS3 powered '37 came from Performance Rod and Custom. The fan only runs briefly at stop lights, but it's never seen 120 degree outside air either. I switched to a different model of SPAL 16" fan with curved blades that flows more air, with less noise than the straight blade model.

    Someone mentioned that 1/3 of the fuel energy is waste heat in the cooling system. If you have an engine that gets 20 mpg or better, like an LS3, it should be easier to cool than an old style engine with a carb or EFI car substitute, that uses far more fuel.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Replica Parts

Visit our community sponsor