Hot Rod Build #120196

[TomH33]

Hi

Made the leap and ordered my 33 yesterday. I have read every post that I could find concerning the 33 and the roadster over the last 4 months and feel prepared to embark on this build.

I already have a rear end and brakes from Gordon Levy, fan shroud, Boyd tank, QA1 shocks/springs, 3 point seat belts, 5 link rear suspension, a few lbs. of grade 8 hardware, and tools.

Just excitedly waiting for my delivery the first week in April.

Thanks to everyone for their Post and Solutions, I have avoided so many pit falls and will produce a better Hot Rod because of each of you.

Thanks again I will keep you posted(ha ha) on my progress with lots of pictures that hopefully will help other builders.

TomH33

[JOP33]

Congrats! Probably coming same truck as mine. Where are you at?

[TomH33]

Gathering parts for the build, here is what I have so far.

BrakeFromGordon.jpg RearendOnStands.jpgRearendW-Bracket.jpg Selves full of Goodies.jpg

[RoadRacer]

Got my ex-FF date of 3/25, so mine might be on that truck too, heading to San Antonio, TX.

Not collected a single part yet

Good luck to all of us..

[TomH33]

I decided to make an engine change since I have a SBC 383/500HP I built for my Sons truck sitting on my garage floor. My Son has decided to keep his pig 396/220HP for some reason.

I will be switching to SBC 383/500HP motor instead of an create LS3/480HP for a couple of reasons. First my wife has threatened my existence if I don’t get rid of that “ ugly motor”, i have to keep moving around the garage and second it will save me $8,500 which I can use to put a nice finish on my 33.

I think the 383 will give a more retro look to the car. Problem is I ordered my kit with LS mounts and I believe Stewart is picking up my kit this week and there is no time to change. I did get the info sheet from FF on SBC install as suggested by someone on the forum. I hope the engine mount problem is easy to fix. The actual mounts look like they just use old style Chevy SB mounts instead of LS mounts.

I think the new motor will sound great due to the Thumper cam and Fast EZ EFI should produce good gas milage (not as good as the LS). Everything else remains the same, T-56 magnum trans and Levy 8.8 TruTrac rear end.

I would like to hear from any other 33 SBC installs on header fitment, power steering, accessories,etc.

[NAZ]

I went with SBC and it's an easy install but I'm not using the larger T-56 trans you are planning. There is room to move the engine back and forth a bit which will help you with the T-56. The motor mounts are easy to deal with as whatever you use it's just a matter of adapting to the FFR chassis mounting points. The FFR adapters are just flat plates moving the typical SBC mounts to the rear a bit where they will bolt to plates coming off the chassis mounting points. Now the bad news -- there is no way to install an adequately sized exhaust for that 500 HP 383 through the chassis. Anything that will fit through the chassis will choke down that 500 HP engine. I built my own headers and ran the exhaust out the side of the engine compartment. Also do yourself a favor and add a driveshaft loop that will protect you in case of u-joint failure. That driveshaft is running right between the seats and the thin tunnel mount that comes with the chassis is not enough to rely on. I've had two driveshafts fail and they can do a great deal of damage. Having one explode just inches from your leg could cause some serious injury.

[TomH33]

Thanks for the information.

I was kind of worried about the drive shaft and so I was going to order a Denny’s nitrous drive shaft ( same as I have in my 69 Camaro). I also dusted off my welder and will weld a couple of 14 gauge loops to the frame.

The exhaust sounds like a problem. I was planing to run my exhaust similar to what you said. Do you have any pictures this would sure help. I can get a header kit and cut and weld as needed. I would like 3/4 primaries with a 3” collector and then 2-1/2” to exit out behind the door. I was thinking of making a 3” Pipe heat shield around the 2.5” exhaust pipe to protect the body. I would love to run the exhaust out the rear but with the prototype 5 link suspension I am planning will not allow any room.

The CAD drawings of the 5 link look good but, I really won’t know what I am up against utill I get my hands on the frame. I got the rear end bracket from Gordon Levy that holds the watts link and the pinion angle link.

I would like to review your build, do you have a gallery or build thread I could browse.

Thanks again for the help.
TomH33

[myjones]

I would be surprised if you could prove more than 15hp difference, I'm not worried about it with my 550 hp stroker Hemi. It's not ideal but in such a light car you won't feel it.
I do have a couple ideas on the exhaust size vs chassis for you Naz so shoot me an E-mail sometime.
7L Hemi 33

[TomH33]

Yeaaa!! I just got a call from Stewart and my 33 will be here on Sunday. Now the fun begins.

Any suggestions on how to inventory parts. How to handle back orders, or any other organizational tips. I have all my tools and extra parts on hand.

[NAZ]

Make a copy of the inventory sheet you can scribble on as you go. It's best to have a large area where you can spread things out when opening boxes and several tables so you don't have to bend over so much. Use a magic marker to list everything (or at least themes, i.e. cooling sys, chassis, etc.) on the top & sides of the boxes to make finding the parts easier down the road. Keep after Jay on backordered items. And now is the time to figure out where you're going to store all this stuff where it's out of the way but easily accessed. My race car trailer is still full of boxes and is completely unusable as a trailer. That's just the overflow from what's stored in my shop on pallet racks and cabinet tops.

[RoadRacer]

Yeaaa!! I just got a call from Stewart and my 33 will be here on Sunday. Now the fun begins

Good Luck!

[NAZ]

Tom, I'm building the "B" model that FFR should have made so my chassis is different than yours. However, you can look at the gallery section for 33HR Roll Cage Build and I believe I have some photos of the headers I made. They have 3.5" collectors that turn down at ~80-degrees and slanted slightly to the rear. I then took some 3.5" open side pipes and made them into mufflers using screw type baffles that minimize back pressure. They dump pointed at the ground at an angle so the exhaust wave is dampened by the ground. The mufflers terminate just in front of the doors. Time will tell if I leave them this way or make another version. One of the guys up here has a real deal 33 coupe with BBC power and has a similar exhaust and out in the open they are not that loud. I'm betting that in a parking structure they are top fuel loud but then we don't have parking garages up here. You should consider going 3" all the way with the power you're planning. There is a significant pressure difference between 2.5" & 3.0" and the longer the length the more difference.

[TomH33]

My 33 arrives tomorrow and I was wondering if and how much I should tip the truck driver. Any suggestions?

Thanks

[JOP33]

I had heard $100 bucks was a decent tip.

[myjones]

My 33 arrives tomorrow and I was wondering if and how much I should tip the truck driver. Any suggestions?
Thanks

I felt like $50 was a decent tip, that will buy the driver a good steak dinner in most places, so that seemed right to me since he's already paid for the basic tailgate delivery.
DB

[TomH33]

Delivery from Stewart was painless. The driver was a really nice guy who enjoys putting smiles on client faces. Unpacked and inventoried all parts. Missing wiring harness and steering column.

I installed the front suspension and shocks Was an easy install so far will put the brakes on tomorrow. Here's a pic of the front suspension nothing painted or powder coated yet. I will disassemble the entire car after Go Karting, and coat what ever I think needs it. Really great to have the car in my hands. I done so much prep work and reading I feel like I built this car a few times already. All for now. FtSuspension1.jpg

[Arrowhead]

Hate to be a buzz kill and not trying to bust your stones - but I think you have your lower controls arms on the wrong side. Unless there's been a design change or your trying some thing new, the adjustable tubes go to the front, the solid tubes with the short adjusters go to the rear.

[TomH33]

Thanks for the heads up. You are correct. I noticed just before installing the brakes. Not a hard change, thanks for checking.

[erlihemi]

Don't forget the bicycle fender mounts if you chose those while your on the spindles too.
Enjoy!

[TomH33]

Hi and thanks again. I also had the eurathane bushings on the lowers flipped, so I fixed that too. I installed the big wilwoods on the front. I had to grind the spindles to get the bracket to mount correctly. Had to shim .110 to center rotors but all went well. I'll take some pictures and post tomorrow.

I'm running full fenders and running boards. I have gotten some great ideas on supporting the fenders from Myjones but that's a ways down the road.

Next is the 5 link watts rear suspension. I'll start laying out the rough dimensions and cutting steel next week. I have no idea how long this will take.

[NAZ]

Grinding the spindles to make the brake mounting brackets fit is a red flag. There should be no need to grind anything, the spindle brackets easily fit. Are you sure they sent the correct brackets? As for the time it takes to fabricate a watts link I can tell you it took me roughly 80-hrs to design, engineer, and fabricate all the pieces from scratch. And figure another week waiting for all the materials to show up. Mine had to be integrated into my modified parallel 3-4 link. But you might look at what some of the vendors here have to offer for a watts link that will fit your application. Could save lots of time if a store-bought unit will work for you.

[bakerboerne]

Hi Tom
I am going the other way on the motor. My kit was ordered for the SBC and I just got an LS1 crate motor so I am looking at buying the LS motor kit from FF.
If you have not already ordered your SBC install kit maybe we can switch motor kits ? I am in Houston email is [email protected]

thanks

[TomH33]

I talked to Gordon Levy whom I purchased the brakes from and he said they often have to grind the spindles to make the wildwood brackets fit. I only had to take 1/8’ off the top only.

The 5 link will be built around the bracket I got from Gordon Levy (same as for the Roadster). I will be adding the frame brackets for the links. Look at my early photos of the rear end for the bracket and bell crank. I keep you posted on the rear suspension.

Thanks

[NAZ]

Tom, if not too much trouble can you post a picture of where you had to grind the spindles? I'm still amazed you'd have clearance issues. I'm running the 12.88" Wilwood brakes with the 6-piston Dynapro calipers and there is plenty of room for the mounting brackets to attach to the spindle assemblies.

Here's a photo of my watts link. A bit different than yours as my suspension is convertible from an off-set three-link to a parallel 4-link but the basic watts link mounting is similar. I have a total of 10" of roll center adjustment available with this design.
IMG_0637.JPG

[TomH33]

Thanks NAZ for the photo of your 5 link. Sorry I can’t show you the grind but I have 13” front rotors (brackets maybe different?) and the grind is behind the top of the Wilwood bracket.

How long did you make your bell crank (center to center) and the links. I posted a pic of the bracket and the old proto type bell crank I made. The new bell crank is 6” center to center and is two piece allowing the links to install in the center see CAD drawing. RearendW-Bracket.jpgBell Crank_RodCon.jpg

[NAZ]

13" brakes -- that's likely the difference. I was scratching my head trying to figure out where the clearance issue was as the 12.88" brakes have so much room for the bracket there is no way that I could see any interference ever becoming an issue. As for my bell crank, the center to center distance where the rod ends attach is 3". The bell crank is made of 1" x 1.5" 7074 T651 aluminum that has a tensile strength of 83ksi and yield of 73ksi and rotates on a 5/8" shoulder bolt with 84ksi shear strength which makes it 25,770 lbs shear. The weakest link in the system is the grade-8 fasteners that hold the rod ends as they are in single shear but still have a safety factor of 10. The links are ~12 3/16" eye to eye which are probably shorter than you're planning. My down tubes that the links attach to are 30 1/8" wide leaving room to add wheelie bars as this car is destined to be a drag racer as well as a great handling street car. The down tubes are designed to yield before any element of the system reaches its ultimate strength.

[TomH33]

CorrectFtSusp.jpgCorrectFtSusp2.jpgNewBelCrank.jpg

Well I finished up the front suspension. Corrected all my errors (I hope) and added the ft brakes.

I redesigned the bell crank to even the bolt sheer and stress. I welded up my LCAs so the rear end goes in tomorrow. I will then establish ride height and strap it there using plate stock for shocks. This should allow me to have a hole for full droop and one for full compression also. With this set I can establish the length of the down supports and the watts links to be parallel to the ground. Since I added an inch to the LCAs I may have to run a second bar across the top for the down supports, I’ll see how it goes.

The 33 is not for drag racing, but built to enjoy the curvy Rocky Mountain roads.

All for now.

[Gordon Levy]

Tom, is using a superlite 6 front kit and not a dynapro. The superlite is about 40% larger and minor clearancing need to be done to fit FFR spindles.

[NAZ]

Thanks Gordon. That satisfies my curiosity.

[Gordon Levy]

It is a kit we designed and carries a Levy Racing part number

[TomH33]

I finally got around to mounting my master cylinders and finishing my peddle linkage. This is my take on eliminating the dual forward facing masters, for a more conventional system. This clears my valve covers and allows for a hydraulic clutch. I also have tons of room for my gauges and other electronics. All for now.Belcrank and masters.jpgMastersFirewall.jpgMasterSide.jpg