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8 stack efi systems
I would appreciate any recommendations on 8 stack efi inductions systems. Is there a system that is reasonably priced with good reliability and performance or there is no choice but to spend the $6/7K to get borla, inglese, etc????
Thank you!
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I'm using the Speedmaster system with Holley HP ecu. I'm very happy with it. If you are not very mechanical then you should probably stay with the higher end stuff and their programmed ecu. I am an experienced efi tuner. I built a tune from scratch on the dyno and then fine tuned it in the car. It took quite a bit of tweaking but runs flawlessly now. The linkage on the Speedmaster system is a bit flimsy and I thought I would have to build something better, but so far it's worked great so I haven't messed with it. Performance wise, it is awesome. My 347 made well over 500 HP at 6500 rpm and drives great. It will lug down to 1200 rpm in high gear even with a pretty big cam.
Bob
Mk IV Roadster, 347/516 HP, 8 stack injection, Holley HP ECU, Astro Performance T5, 3-Link 4.10 gears, A/C, PS, PB Purchased 08/2015, Graduated 02/2017
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A good 8 stack system is expensive. Don't cheap out here. If you try and go cheap, you'll regret it. I always say, don't buy cheap parts, they're too expensive.
Generally speaking, any EFI system can divided up in to the three basic systems - the fuel delivery, the hard parts, and the actual electronic components.
For the hard parts, I always avoid speedmaster and associated components. They are cheap off shore copies of real performance parts. No room on my garage for that stuff. http://www.coloradospeed.com/speedmaster79-ezp-88.html Buy the good stuff once and be done with it.
For the fuel system , no need to be crazy. But again, buy the good stuff. Don't be cheap. You'll want at least -6 feed and return. You could use -8, but you really don't need it unless you're racing and plan to use alcohol.
The computer is the heart and soul of the system. You could use something like a Big Stuff. But it has a LOT of features that you probably don't need, so no sense paying for that if you don't need it. FiTech is a lot cheaper, but seems to be hit or miss. Some people are happy, and some are not. I used Haltech and it was a real hassle and it didn't work all that well. Then I used Megasquirt, and that was great. Worked really well and easy to set up and tune. Lots of adjustability and features.
Don't be fooled, though. There is no such thing as a self learning computer. The self learning feature will get you about 80-85% there. But the fine tuning has to be done by hand. You can do it yourself if you're willing to learn. Or take it to a pro and pay for dyno time. If you're going to do that, then check with a couple of local tuners and find out what computer they have had the best success with. You don't to install a computer that you can't get tuned locally.
Talk with Wayne at www.verycoolparts.com He's very well known around here. He knows what he's doing doing, and he provides top notch after sales support. That alone is worth it's weight in gold. Talk with him about what you want and need, and he'll hook you up.
The engine build has a big role in the performance, too. There is no common plenum to pull from, and you're dealing with 8 individual runners. if you want best performance, you have to build the rest of the intake to match IR system.
The heads cannot be bigger than the IR. My throttle bodies were 50mm, and I was using Dart 195 heads with a mild port job and 2.02 valves. The torque curve was excellent - long and flat from 2,200 rpm's to redline. On a whim, I installed bigger heads with 2.08 intake valves. I lost all of my low end torque. Put the old heads back on, and the torque was back.
Also, you want a cam with a very wide lobe separation angle, like 114-116*. A narrow LSA will cause reversion at the bottom end, which is OK with a common plenum. But with IR it will cause the dreaded fuel cloud that the Webers were known for. Comp Cams and Ingelese have a number of choices that work nicely.
Last edited by Bob Cowan; 08-30-2017 at 01:41 PM.
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Post Thanks / Like - 1 Thanks, 0 Likes
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While I generally agree with Mr. Cowan on import parts, I have to say the quality of the Speedmaster unit is not too bad. The manifold fit perfect and has no casting flaws. The throttle bodies appear to be decent pieces and work fine. The weak link (if there is one) is the linkage. It also has a common plenum cast into the manifold that gives a good map sensor signal. I have yet to hear of anyone that has one, actually complain about the system. Just speculation that it is a cheap knock off. The real key is the electronics. Holley and Fast make good units that are reasonably priced. But, you either need to have the ability to tune and tweak it or the money to pay someone. It is no where near a plug and play system.
Bob Lloyd
Mk IV Roadster, 347/516 HP, 8 stack injection, Holley HP ECU, Astro Performance T5, 3-Link 4.10 gears, A/C, PS, PB Purchased 08/2015, Graduated 02/2017
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Senior Member
In no way can I comment on any particular 8 stack or EFI. What I can say is that BobL's egine is AWESOME! I got the pleasure to take a ride and there were three things I noticed.
1. It was smooth at lower speeds and didn't "buck" like some complain about.
2. It looks cool. I mean come on, 8 pipes sitting on top sucking in all that HP generating air. Who isn't interested in looking good?
3. An the most important.......that thing will flat out run. It is MEAN when he wants it to be.
FFR MK4 Complete Kit #8952
Build Thread
Bodywork Thread
3 Link Rear Suspension, Gordon Levy 347 SBF with T5
First start Feb 20, 2017, First Go Kart March 5, 2017, Registered & Title April 25, 2017
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Senior Member
I have used pretty much all the systems available. The speed master is OK. The intake does take some clearancing and once you add a FAST 2.0 or sportsman to it total cost is around $4K. The Eightstack is very cool and look like a weber carb set up and add the FAST ECU you are around $6200. The big bore borla stuff is great for big engine. The 52mm throttle bodies flow really well. Total cost on that system is about $6800. I am a dealer for pretty much all of this. You can give me a call and we can talk at length if you like.
99/2000 NASA PSO Champion-2005 west coast FFR challenge series Champions
Sponsor Tony B's 2007 ST2 National Championship
2009 NASA TTC runner up-2010 NASA TTB runner up
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Senior Member
99/2000 NASA PSO Champion-2005 west coast FFR challenge series Champions
Sponsor Tony B's 2007 ST2 National Championship
2009 NASA TTC runner up-2010 NASA TTB runner up
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Gordon, If a person were to buy a system from you, does that include a suitable base tune for his particular engine and tuning support, or would they still need to have a professional tune it? Just asking for the benefit of the OP or others considering one of these systems. Obviously they could bring it to you for the install and tuning, which would probably be the best route.
Thanks for your input,
Bob
Mk IV Roadster, 347/516 HP, 8 stack injection, Holley HP ECU, Astro Performance T5, 3-Link 4.10 gears, A/C, PS, PB Purchased 08/2015, Graduated 02/2017
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Senior Member
I can help them set parameters and I do have several base tunes that work well. It will need some work if I didn't build the engine. I am familiar with the needs of my engines but not necessarily others.
99/2000 NASA PSO Champion-2005 west coast FFR challenge series Champions
Sponsor Tony B's 2007 ST2 National Championship
2009 NASA TTC runner up-2010 NASA TTB runner up
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Brrgy-
Call Wayne at Very Cool Parts, and get everything you need. His system is beautiful, and price is not crazy high; not inexpensive, but not as high as many others! Wayne is a stand up guy, and will get you what you need.
No need to look any further. Call Wayne, and be done!
Regards,
Steve
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Holley HP tune?
Originally Posted by
bobl
I'm using the Speedmaster system with Holley HP ecu. I'm very happy with it. If you are not very mechanical then you should probably stay with the higher end stuff and their programmed ecu. I am an experienced efi tuner. I built a tune from scratch on the dyno and then fine tuned it in the car. It took quite a bit of tweaking but runs flawlessly now. The linkage on the Speedmaster system is a bit flimsy and I thought I would have to build something better, but so far it's worked great so I haven't messed with it. Performance wise, it is awesome. My 347 made well over 500 HP at 6500 rpm and drives great. It will lug down to 1200 rpm in high gear even with a pretty big cam.
Bob
Hello there.
I'm also using a Speedmaster system but I'm just getting around to setting it up this weekend.
I don't suppose you'd consider sharing your tune with me to give me a starting point?
Thanks for considering my request either way.
Have a great day!
Geoff H.
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Originally Posted by
GeoffnWpg
Hello there.
I'm also using a Speedmaster system but I'm just getting around to setting it up this weekend.
I don't suppose you'd consider sharing your tune with me to give me a starting point?
Thanks for considering my request either way.
Have a great day!
Geoff H.
I don't mind at all. The first question that comes to mind is injector size. I'm running 39 lb. injectors at 43 psi. If yours are much different the tune could be quite a bit off. PM me your email and I'll send it to you. I've got a number of unique features that won't apply to your application. I'll go in and modify it to be more applicable for you. I'll try to upload a copy of it tomorrow. If you could give me your engine specs, what cam and cylinder heads I can tweak it a bit more. What ignition are you running? I'm running a Ford TFI, so that needs to be correctly defined.
Bob
Mk IV Roadster, 347/516 HP, 8 stack injection, Holley HP ECU, Astro Performance T5, 3-Link 4.10 gears, A/C, PS, PB Purchased 08/2015, Graduated 02/2017
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