More progress made on the body : )

[The Stig]

Vidal & Mike,

I got the seatbelt inertia and retractor reels installed today. I really appreciate your pointing me towards Mike, for these brackets. The belts extend and retract exactly as they were designed for the Corvette. My question for either you or Mike, is whether or not the reels are supposed to stick out so far towards the seats.



Also, I noticed that Mike had a cover that fit over the reels very well. Can you give some info on these?

Thanks,

Mike

Mike,

The inertia sensor (circled in yellow, one per reel) is the part of the retractor mech the manual says to remove. However, this thread http://www.ffcars.com/forums/42-fact...ts-work-2.html steered me away from modifying the seat belts. I'm using a set of MikePMS's brackets http://www.ffcars.com/forums/42-fact...ml#post2610100. The brackets put the seat belt retractors in the same relative position as they were in the corvette. So they work as they were designed to.

[VD2021]

Vidal & Mike,

I got the seatbelt inertia and retractor reels installed today. I really appreciate your pointing me towards Mike, for these brackets. The belts extend and retract exactly as they were designed for the Corvette. My question for either you or Mike, is whether or not the reels are supposed to stick out so far towards the seats.


Also, I noticed that Mike had a cover that fit over the reels very well. Can you give some info on these?

Thanks,

Mike

Mike,
The reels end up with a little less intrusion than if they were in the original FFR position (especially the aft reel). The manual has you slit/trim the carpet in that area. Mike (MikesPMS) used the donor's cover. He trimmed it down to fit and cover the opening. I'm sure he'll chime in with more detailed info.

I haven't installed mine yet, but I plan to fab an aluminum panel that will cover the area leaving only the belt slots open.

HTHs.

[mikespms]

006.JPG

Vidal & Mike,

I got the seatbelt inertia and retractor reels installed today. I really appreciate your pointing me towards Mike, for these brackets. The belts extend and retract exactly as they were designed for the Corvette. My question for either you or Mike, is whether or not the reels are supposed to stick out so far towards the seats.



Also, I noticed that Mike had a cover that fit over the reels very well. Can you give some info on these?

Thanks,

Mike

Hi Mike,

The cover is from the corvette,I am having problems posting pictures on this forum. I will take some new pictures today to give you a better view of how they mount and how to trim the cover. I cant see in your picture,if you trimmed the aluminum panel and is the side of the bracket with the nuts even with the outside of the frame. Call me if you like, so I could explain it a bit better

thanks,
mike

[The Stig]

Here are a few more pictures that show how the reels stick out towards the area where the seat needs to be. I checked the seat clearance with the reels in place, and using Mike's brackets. With the brackets, the OEM seatbelts work perfectly. But the 17" wide seats will not fit between the reels and the seatbelt latch.

The first picture shows the bracket and reels bolted into place with the aluminum side cover held into place with clekos. You can see that the reels sit completely outside the aluminum panel.













Mike, as you can see by the pictures, the bracket sits flush against the back of the frame rail. But it still sticks the reels out further on my car, than the pictures show on your car. As I mentioned earlier, I'm pumped about the fact that it allows the inertia reel and the retractor reel to work properly. But if I can't get the seats in, then I'm going to have an issue.

My neighbor (Ralph) was over for a little while today. We're going to look into creating a bracket that takes yours a step further. We want to keep the angles needed to allow the reels to work correctly. But we're going to try to move the reels outward into the rocker area. This will take a little work, since there isn't much room to manuever in that area, but we're going to give it a shot. If it works, there will be plenty of room to install the seats correctly.

We'll see how it goes...

[RumRunner]

Mike (Stig),

Too many damn Mikes in this thread!

I saw your pictures and thought I'd send in what my driver's side looks like with MikePMS's brackets. I did everything I could do without modifying the frame or aluminum panels to move my seat toward the car center, and having done that I have about 2 1/2" between my seat and my reels. I haven't tried the passenger side yet, though I think it will be much tighter. And I should note that I'm only 5'9", and my seat is likely quite a bit more forward than others', which may allow me to move my seat closer to the center than other folks. Don't know if that helps or not.

-Michael

IMG_4986.JPG

[The Stig]

Hi Michael.

Thanks for the picture.

Your reels look like they sit further into the panel, leaving you a little more room. I don't know if there is any difference between the driver's and passenger's sides. I haven't started on the driver's side, because I wanted to come up with a complete solution for my car before I do that side. I really don't won't to have to undo both sides to re-work the belts. But now that you mention it, it would probably make sense to put the reels into the driver's side, and see if they fit the same way.

Then I'll know whether or not I can fix the issue in the same way on each side.

Thanks,

Mike

[VD2021]

Gentlemen,
I haven't installed the seat belt brackets yet, but I can tell you without a doubt that the passenger side seat area has less room than the driver's side once the tunnel panel (the one with the e-brake handle opening) is in place. Mike (MikesPMS) and I were discussing/measuring/comparing this not too long ago, so I put my panel in to take measurements. Mike's solution was to remake the tunnel panel which I will likely be doing the same.

[mikespms]

Hi Mike,

I am still unable to post pictures on this forum,if you look at the pictures I emailed you of the brackets installed in my car, the amount the brackets stick out into the car is about the same on both sides. There is more space on the drivers side than the passenger side, but in my car the seat belt retractors are behind the seat bracket and don't interfere with the seat.
I made a new tunnel panel that gained me about 1 3/4" more space on the passenger side,allowing me to reach my hand on the side of the seat to work the power seat control.
Looking at your pictures is hard to see how much space is between the back side of the seat belt bracket and the inside of the body in your car,it looks like the bracket is angled in towards the inside of the car. The back side of the bracket needs to be upritgh and parallel to the aluminum panel. Mike check the distance between the back of the bracket where the nuts are welded and the body of your car and call me I think I have an easy fix for you.
Thanks Mike

[The Stig]

Hi Mike,

I am still unable to post pictures on this forum,if you look at the pictures I emailed you of the brackets installed in my car, the amount the brackets stick out into the car is about the same on both sides. There is more space on the drivers side than the passenger side, but in my car the seat belt retractors are behind the seat bracket and don't interfere with the seat.
I made a new tunnel panel that gained me about 1 3/4" more space on the passenger side,allowing me to reach my hand on the side of the seat to work the power seat control.
Looking at your pictures is hard to see how much space is between the back side of the seat belt bracket and the inside of the body in your car,it looks like the bracket is angled in towards the inside of the car. The back side of the bracket needs to be upritgh and parallel to the aluminum panel. Mike check the distance between the back of the bracket where the nuts are welded and the body of your car and call me I think I have an easy fix for you.
Thanks Mike

Hi Mike.

It's hard to get a good picture of the reels, showing how far they intrude into the seat area. The bracket is actually upright, and parallel to the aluminum panel. Although, when the reels are mounted, the back side of them are pretty much even with the aluminum panel. That's what I've been trying to show in the pictures. I've taken it out a couple of times, thinking that I must have something aligned wrong. But it all looks correct.

I have about 1/2" behind the bolt that mounts through the forward reel. There is quite a lot of room behind the rear reel.

I'm begining to think that I may need to cut all of the original mounting brackets off of the frame, and make a new mount for your bracket that positions the reels further back and into the "rocker" opening. That would get them out of the way of the seats as well.

I'm also thinking of doing as you've done, and making another aluminum panel for the tunnel that allows for more room for the seat. I really hate to have to pull the tunnel sections out and start re-working that though.

[The Stig]

I used my 18" crescent wrench, and persuaded the reel bracket towards the outside of the car by about 3/8". It helped to move the reels outward, a little. I'm now able to get the seats into position, but it's VERY tight.

The brackets that "Mikespms" made allow the reels to work perfectly, and he's been great about helping to work through the issues that I've had trying to get them to fit my car. He took time to talk me through a couple of ideas, while putting much more important work on hold. He was in the process of preparing his house for hurricane Issac's approach.

Mike, thank you for your help. I hope you were able to weather the storm safely.

Take Care,

Mike

[mikespms]

001.JPG003.JPG

Thanks Mike,

The storm turned out to be rain and wind ,no damage. Hope it will stay weak and spare the gulf.

I am glad to see that you where able to make it work with a little persuation. If you need more room let me know, we can try a few other things on the brackets. And if you want more space between the seat and the door and tunnel. Here are some pictures of how I modified the tunnel panel and gained 1 1/2"to 1 3/4" it lets you move the seat in for more room. You can see the white line on the original panel thats how much room you gain.

Mike

[VD2021]

Mike,

Any progress updates?

[The Stig]

Mike,

Any progress updates?

My neighbor has "welder" in his list of things that he can do. Sooo... We took the passenger door off and completely disassembled it. The electric windoe motor bracket was cut off of the lower back side, as well as the forward brace between the two door bars. The motor bracket was re-welded between the door bars, which gives plenty of clearance for the window to slide all the way down, instead of 3/4's. The cables within the motor had to be rerouted, but that wasn't the big of a deal. The motor doesn't seem to run as quickly as it did though. I don't know if the motor is bad or if the cables are too tight.

The windshield is coming out next, for two reasons; to make it easier to finish up the wiring or the gauges, and to have it re-installed correctly, with the gasket seal that should have been installed the first time.

Other than that, not much...

I'll take some pictures this weekend, and post them.

Take care Buddy!

Mike

[mikespms]

009.JPG001.JPG003 (2).JPG

HI Mike,

These are some of the mods I made to get my windows to go down all the way. First I relocated the motor allowing to replace the motor with out taking the door apart. And notched the door frame to give the front track more room for adjustment and clearance for the window.

[VD2021]

My neighbor has "welder" in his list of things that he can do. Sooo... We took the passenger door off and completely disassembled it. The electric windoe motor bracket was cut off of the lower back side, as well as the forward brace between the two door bars. The motor bracket was re-welded between the door bars, which gives plenty of clearance for the window to slide all the way down, instead of 3/4's. The cables within the motor had to be rerouted, but that wasn't the big of a deal. The motor doesn't seem to run as quickly as it did though. I don't know if the motor is bad or if the cables are too tight.

The windshield is coming out next, for two reasons; to make it easier to finish up the wiring or the gauges, and to have it re-installed correctly, with the gasket seal that should have been installed the first time.

Other than that, not much...

I'll take some pictures this weekend, and post them.

Take care Buddy!

Mike

Mike,
Cool. Any pictures yet? I definitely would like to see where your motors are now.

[The Stig]

Mike,
Cool. Any pictures yet? I definitely would like to see where your motors are now.

Hi Vidal,

Pam and I got back into town last night around midnight. We used our points for Airfare, Hotels, and Rental Car, and spent some time away from Charlotte, to get away from the mess caused by the Democratic Convention... I'm far from being an Obama fan...

I'll post some pictures of the window motor placement later tonight. It's nothing major. Just moved the brackets between the bars which allowed the motor to sit closer to the interior, allowing the windows to move all the way down.

[VD2021]

Hi Vidal,

Pam and I got back into town last night around midnight. We used our points for Airfare, Hotels, and Rental Car, and spent some time away from Charlotte, to get away from the mess caused by the Democratic Convention... I'm far from being an Obama fan...

I'll post some pictures of the window motor placement later tonight. It's nothing major. Just moved the brackets between the bars which allowed the motor to sit closer to the interior, allowing the windows to move all the way down.

Thanks Mike.

The President is definitely making his campaign rounds. He was here in downtown Kissimmee yesterday. I was on I-4 in 2008 when McCain was here and his motorcade was large. I witnessed the presidential motorcade (not on purpose) yesterday and it was HUGE and coolin a way. For anyone who has not see it before, just imagine a parade with 17 times the police, primarily on motorcycles, and a train of all black vehicles.

[The Stig]

Mike,
Cool. Any pictures yet? I definitely would like to see where your motors are now.

Here are a few pictures of the electric window motor bracket relocation...









Putting the motor in between the door bars gets it out of the way of the glass, and allows much more room to situate the window tracks as necessary.

The original "machine screws" that are used with the corvette, can be reused. I thought it made sense to cut the studs off the top section, for clearance.

[The Stig]

Here are a couple pictures that show the original location. The motor hangs below and outside towards the glass, which takes away from the usable room that the glass can move freely from top to bottom.

Of course it helps that the driver's side door is deeper than the passenger's side. My driver's side door had just enough room to get the window all the way up and down... But I think I may take this one apart and move the window motor in between the bars as well...

[The Stig]

A new bracket was made that holds the seat belt latch a little closer to the console, to get it out of the way of the seat. The bracket leans into the console, and then twists a few degrees to position the latch and buckle a little better...





A 1/2" nut was welded on to the back side to make it easy to mount the bracket inside the floor mount.

I also had to rework the seat belt retractor bracket that I bought from Michael on this forum. It works beautifully, and is a very nice piece. But for some reason, my passenger's side of my car is OFF by quite a bit. Ralph and I looked at it and both came to the same conslusion that it would be much better to take it apart and make it right, than to "work-around" the problem. So that's what we've been doing.

(I say "I")... Ralph Warner, my next door neighbor has been doing the welding, heating and re-shaping of metal and more wiring that hadn't been finished... Thanks Ralph! Your help has been tremendous and very much appreciated! Your friendship is invaluable. Still looking forward to learning to weld with your new Miller 210 MIG though...

Now the seat fits nicely.

[narkosys]

Your window motor mount mod is such a great idea! Definitely going to be a consideration when I build my GTM.

now to add a welder to my shopping list :P

P

[VD2021]

Mike,
Nice work.

Its hard to tell from the pictures, but it looks like the motor is positioned just right to allow clearance of the interior door handle?

[sk7500]

That's some really great work Mike. I thought about doing something like that but then I looked at all the other things I needed to do and decided that was going to "later" list

[sk7500]

I really really like this seat belt extension idea. That nut is such a pain. The only one worst is the one by the back window.

[The Stig]

Mike,
Nice work.

Its hard to tell from the pictures, but it looks like the motor is positioned just right to allow clearance of the interior door handle?

Vidal, I just positioned the motor so that the bracket was fluch with the door bars. This Stig allowed plenty of room for the window to be positioned to move up and down as needed.
The interior guy will eventually detemine what goes where when he designs and builds the new door panels.

That's some really great work Mike. I thought about doing something like that but then I looked at all the other things I needed to do and decided that was going to "later" list

I really really like this seat belt extension idea. That nut is such a pain. The only one worst is the one by the back window.

I agree with you in regard to the awkwardness of the access of those two particular nuts. Some, we can't do anything about. But for those that we can change, it sure helps. It's a real PITA to hold a lock nut with needle nosed pliers while trying to thread that bolt. I also noticed that the bolts were a bit too long, so I ended up goingto NAPA to by some that were a little shorter. Welding the nut to the back side of the bracket helped a ton!

I saw the pictures that you recently posted of your interior... All I can say is Whoa!... Very nice work.

[mikespms]

Mike,
Nice work.

Its hard to tell from the pictures, but it looks like the motor is positioned just right to allow clearance of the interior door handle?

Hi Mike,

Did you connect the rods from the door latch to the door handle with the door panel on? I tried that spot on my doors and the rods from the door latch to the door handle got in the way but I used the corvette striker instead of the one from factory five.

[The Stig]

Hi Mike,

Did you connect the rods from the door latch to the door handle with the door panel on? I tried that spot on my doors and the rods from the door latch to the door handle got in the way but I used the corvette striker instead of the one from factory five.

Hi Mike. I'm not planning to use the same layout for the door handles as the original door panels. We'll see how it ends up...

[Kempo]

A new bracket was made that holds the seat belt latch a little closer to the console, to get it out of the way of the seat. The bracket leans into the console, and then twists a few degrees to position the latch and buckle a little better...





A 1/2" nut was welded on to the back side to make it easy to mount the bracket inside the floor mount.

I also had to rework the seat belt retractor bracket that I bought from Michael on this forum. It works beautifully, and is a very nice piece. But for some reason, my passenger's side of my car is OFF by quite a bit. Ralph and I looked at it and both came to the same conslusion that it would be much better to take it apart and make it right, than to "work-around" the problem. So that's what we've been doing.

(I say "I")... Ralph Warner, my next door neighbor has been doing the welding, heating and re-shaping of metal and more wiring that hadn't been finished... Thanks Ralph! Your help has been tremendous and very much appreciated! Your friendship is invaluable. Still looking forward to learning to weld with your new Miller 210 MIG though...

Now the seat fits nicely.

Mike, thanks a ton for posting this. I had the same idea of making the bracket for the latches but it had never crossed my mind welding the nut to it. I will be doing the same thanks for sharing the idea.

[The Stig]

Hi Mike,

Did you connect the rods from the door latch to the door handle with the door panel on? I tried that spot on my doors and the rods from the door latch to the door handle got in the way but I used the corvette striker instead of the one from factory five.

Hi Mike,

The interior door handle (passenger side) has just enough room to work. We made a bracket that we could use to mount/screw the handle into. I didn't like the idea of using only the fiberglass of the door panel to secure the handle. Once the correct spot was located to mount the handle, another bracket was made that would hold an aluminum slide. The connector rod would slide through this piece, keeping it from vibrating or rattling while driving down the road. Everything fits inside the plane of the door panel. Then the rod was bent into the correct shape to clear the bars and window. The donor "rod-clips" were used to secure the ends into the handle and the bearclaw latch.









As I mentioned previously, I'm planning to have new door panels made, so I just mounted the door handles to the new brackets until then. But, the panels do fit the door with these pieces in place, if I should decide to use them afterall.

One thing that I didn't realize, because it never occured to me, was when I pull the handle inside the car, the exterior door handle also opens. And visa/versa. It looks kind of goofy to me. but I guess that's what you get with these latches. (That and the inability to lock the door).

I don't have a picture, but we also made brace that runs the length of the upper door section. It's 1/8" x 1.0" flat steel. The rear end is bent to a 90 degree angle and mounts at the rear of the door, as well as the connector points for the window tracks. This made the upper piece of fiberglass very much more stable (solid), and holds the edge away from the glass. There is a fairly consitent gap at the rear, for an adheasive backed seal.

The glass is now positioned so that it seals all the way around the upper seal perfectly. Now, I'm in the process of trying to find a good "overlap" seal for the front edge of the window, as well as a good seal for the rear edge.

So, the passenger door is back together, and is aligned and closing perfectly. It has a Very solid thump when it closes.


Hope this helps. It's what we needed to do get everything working as it should.

[mikespms]

Hi Mike,

I was not aware that the out side handle and the inside handle worked at the same time. I recall Vidal having to make modifications to get his door locks to work properly. Is a good idea to make and fit the door panels before you finish your linkage and brackets.You may need make some changes after you make your door panels. Are you using power locks actuators or a remote keyless system?

I like the way Steve(sk7500) did his door panels they have that oem look.

I grafted the armrest and top inside window seal from the corvette to the gtm door panel so that i could use the corvette power window switch and to give the panel a finished look with out any fasteners showing.By doing that I had find a way to relocate the window motor and mount the door control module and be able to connect the rods to the door handle and make a bracket to secure the arm rest to the door frame.

[VD2021]

Mike,
Nice work on the doors. Its amazing how much time is required just to ensure everything fits and functions well.

The bearclaw's latch lever accepts both the interior and exterior handles essentially making them one. So they will move in sync.

[joe0121]

I thought that this was sort of cool... "Cartoonizing" your car...

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showt...onize-your-car

Riptide posted the link in the General discussions section of the Forum.

Looks like HDR photography.

[The Stig]

Mike,
Nice work on the doors. Its amazing how much time is required just to ensure everything fits and functions well.

The bearclaw's latch lever accepts both the interior and exterior handles essentially making them one. So they will move in sync.

Hi Vidal,

I just read your PM regarding the shaved door handle actuators. Thanks. That looks like a great idea, and I may be in touch with you soon to talk through it.

I'd like to have the handles act the way most people would expect them to...

Take care Buddy.

[The Stig]

I spent some time getting the Remote Positive re-installed. I had to move it when I installed the Quick Racing sway bar kit. I made a bracket that straddled the sway bar and allowed me to re-mount it.

I also figured out where to solidly mount the horns, and got them working; although they sound like a sick cow... So I'll be looking for a set of replacement horns.

I'll post some pictures that show the effort.

I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. I've pretty much finished up everything under the rear hatch, and the hood. Just a couple of things in the cockpit and I'll be ready to send the car to upholstery.

But first... I need to make the seat belt brackets for the drivers side, finish the sound and heat barriers in the interior, and get the gauges wired...

I'm also wondering whether or not I need to install breathers in the valve covers low vent crank case pressure.

A friend of mine recently blew out the main seal due to excess pressure build up in the block. I have a PVC overflow but I don't know whether that will be enough to release the case pressure.

[carbon fiber]

mike, i've already spent the gas money i had for a ride in your car on beer! (just kidding!) your finishing touches are looking great. as for the venting of the crankcase, i use an fittings in the top of the valve covers, (bungs welded in to the top of each valve cover) connect them with hoses and a "t" an fitting and then run the hose to a remote aluminum tank with a filter on top. on front engine cars with filters in the valve covers i'd always get blowby into the interior when you were hard on the gas and the blow by would even get to the filter even with the plate on the inside of the valve cover blocking the hole.the remote tank install looks really clean and you can put the little tank where you want. (out of sight in the back of the gtm's bodywork) still dreaming about that ride....

[The Stig]

mike, i've already spent the gas money i had for a ride in your car on beer! (just kidding!) your finishing touches are looking great. as for the venting of the crankcase, i use an fittings in the top of the valve covers, (bungs welded in to the top of each valve cover) connect them with hoses and a "t" an fitting and then run the hose to a remote aluminum tank with a filter on top. on front engine cars with filters in the valve covers i'd always get blowby into the interior when you were hard on the gas and the blow by would even get to the filter even with the plate on the inside of the valve cover blocking the hole.the remote tank install looks really clean and you can put the little tank where you want. (out of sight in the back of the gtm's bodywork) still dreaming about that ride....

Hey Buddy! Long time no hear.

Dont worry about gas money. We'll get together and take it out for a good drive. Thanks for the info regarding the crank case venting. I actually have a Canton overflow tank that I haven't used. It would probably be perfect for this. It's a little big though, (about 4" diameter if i remember correctly).

I saw that you were working on carbon fiber covers for the center console section. Did you get those worked out? Do you have pictures?

Take care,

Mike

[carbon fiber]

i've bitten off a larger chunk and am working on exterior redesign now. i'm going to go ahead and sell the door panels soon, i was trying to get to a certain point on the exterior before i sell the door panels. i'm going to offer a RESTYLED front clip, and with some of the problems with the stock one resolved (properly rounded wheelwells, larger venting for radiator air, etc.) i've got a computer rendering of it and i can't stop looking at it! (even when i'm not working on it) the interior project is still in the works also, but i'm going to have to offer it as an entire kit, not individual pieces. the design i've come up with is too different to match any of the stock interior parts. i'm still here and i'm planning on offering more parts than i was to begin with for the gtm. i know it's lame not posting any pics, but i will when i'm closer to being done. got kinda tired of some of the drama (know how dave feels sometimes!) and haven't been posting as much, but i'm still here and will be bringing some really awesome options for gtm owners who want to take their cars to the next level. good to talk to you mike, thanks for the offer for a ride. just let me know when!

[flotowngtm]

Hey carbon fiber,
Cant wait to see what you have come up with on the interior!
I will be going home to S.C. on leave early next year. If you have something together by then I will have to stop by.

[carbon fiber]

flotowngtm, i should have some good progress made by then and you're welcome to stop by. i really wanted to be in production already but i couldn't resist starting the exterior mods. i can't seem to leave anything the way it comes, it's a disease!

[flotowngtm]

Trust me, I have the same problem!