New 818 Look, Possible Future Mod.s

[Vman7]

First off let me say this, these mods are not suggesting FFR change the path they are on, only a few ideas for future mods, either by FFR or by people who choose to modify on their own.

Like I said in the other threads. Let Dave, Jim & the FFR Team do what they do best

I believe that this new design that Jim and FFR came up with works well, the overall shape flows well!

Just a matter of personal taste on what people would like to do with it on their own.


Attachment 10086

David

[Flamshackle]

I think we might be surprised at how many people customize their body after purchase.

Slight modifications could easily sort some of the style issues that people got all up in arms about. Vman as always your drawings look real nice

[Vman7]

I think we might be surprised at how many people customize their body after purchase.

Slight modifications could easily sort some of the style issues that people got all up in arms about. Vman as always your drawings look real nice

Thanks Flamshackle

That's what I think as well, let people do what they would like to do to their cars.

[VTX]

Nice job. I think it looks pretty good.

[N8Salem]

kudos

[riptide motorsport]

Vman..you have some talent there...........

[BipDBo]

I like the single deck vent. The deck vent design on this concept is one of few things I'm not fond of. They have important function, but good looking ones are rare. Jim's vents look too small. The radiator should be ducted to discharge all of the air upward, none of it down under the car, which would cause uplift. If there is a big opening in the bottom, the air will take that path of least resistance and there is little to no point in the vents. Therefore, if they discharge all of the air that comes in though the front intake, they should match or exceed the size of the intake.

I also think Jim's deck vents look awkward. This single, larger vent looks better IMO.

[mekeys]

I also like Vmans version,however changing the nose a little and hesdlights and side vent does NOT change the basic shape of the body.We were all expecting some thing different.There were 702 designs submitted...There were a lot of Fantastic designs..I think we were all expecting a more up to date design.For me the one chosen was a big let down..I am only interested in the styling AS long as it can start and stop and go 70 MPH I'm good..

Mel

[Vman7]

Here is a more modified front vent area.


Attachment 10088

[shim2]

That's really nice vman, you should do one with a windshield to get an idea how the 818 roadster will look.

[VTX]

Nice! I'm really liking that front end now! I still think the head lights need a little work, but it looks really good!

[Flamshackle]

That's really nice vman, you should do one with a windshield to get an idea how the 818 roadster will look.

Please v-man could you do this^

[Vman7]

That's really nice vman, you should do one with a windshield to get an idea how the 818 roadster will look.

Please v-man could you do this^

working on it right now

[Vman7]

With Street Windshield, not sure on the size or shape that FFR is using, but you get the idea.


Attachment 10113

[07FIREBLADE]

^^^^ where do I sign up for this one.... Lol

[Flamshackle]

With Street Windshield, not sure on the size or shape that FFR is using, but you get the idea.


Attachment 10113

Hahaha! V-man you are a champion!

[dclin]

Here is a more modified front vent area.


Attachment 10088

Much better. I'd still do something to the lower center of the new nose, but much much better.

Sorry, the only thing the original rendering was, was simply Jim's original original design, but with a different nose... with no street windshield, big wing, big graphics, big wheels...

In Dave's defense, I think they simply didn't have time to undertake a completely different body to have ready at SEMA. They already had a full size mock up of Jim's original original body, and I'll bet its just easier to fix the nose, shot it with paint, and get it off to SEMA.

[kach22i]

I was not planning on posting for a while, but Vman's work got my juices flowing and I could not resist.

Not like this will ever happen, but I just had to see what shortening the nose back to Jim's first full sized buck would look like with different headlights - based on Vman's excellent foundation of changes of course.

http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x...%20and%20Ends/

[FFR-ADV]

Thanks Vman!

[GS guy]

V-man has nailed it! In my eye those simple changes to the front end and side really puushed this design to another level. I didn't think the first "reveal" from FF looked all that bad as some were making out, but this version is getting the hair fired up!
kach22i - IMHO the shorter nose doesn't improve the overall look on this one as much as it did with the original FF version.

Now how about a street version? Loose the graphics, wing and roll cage. Better get the fire extinguisher ready!

[wallace18]

The reason for the longer front may be crash protection. FFR does do crash protection in the engineering of their cars.

[Kalstar]

I am thinking, to get the cloth targa the work, the roll bar humps will need to be taller. Great work V-man.

[Martin]

My wife just said "that's beautiful".

I think FFR are onto a winner here. Like all of the FFR line up, people will all build it their way. A few simple mods and you can get the car exactly how you want it.

Once our MK4 is on the road, this just became a contender!

Martin

With Street Windshield, not sure on the size or shape that FFR is using, but you get the idea.


Attachment 10113

[exist12]

With Street Windshield, not sure on the size or shape that FFR is using, but you get the idea.


Attachment 10113

This is the best one I have seen. Changing the front vent opening made a huge difference

[kach22i]

The reason for the longer front may be crash protection. FFR does do crash protection in the engineering of their cars.

If you work with the design at all you will realize that the headlights chosen dictate the arc, and length of the hood, including the overhang. The only way for the overhang to be less with these Camry headlights is to shove the lights back further into the wheel flare. It's too short of a distance already for my taste, but I'm not the head designer at FFR, so my opinion means squat.

One more attempt to clean up the design, per my own personal tastes. It really is looking too much like a Nissan 350Z, but that's better than looking like a Viper, in my opinion.

http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x...%20and%20Ends/


For reference, a blue Viper.
http://www.tuningnews.net/article/07...e_viper_srt10/
hennessey_2008_dodge_viper_srt10.jpg

For reference a blue 350Z
http://importsnc.com/forums/cars-sal...ast-model.html
8022d1289905255-04-daytona-blue-350z-enthusiast-model-dannysz008edit.jpg

[shim2]

V-man has nailed it! In my eye those simple changes to the front end and side really puushed this design to another level. I didn't think the first "reveal" from FF looked all that bad as some were making out, but this version is getting the hair fired up!
kach22i - IMHO the shorter nose doesn't improve the overall look on this one as much as it did with the original FF version.

Now how about a street version? Loose the graphics, wing and roll cage. Better get the fire extinguisher ready!

+1 Vman is onto something here. Loose those graphics, I kind of like the wing there, even for a street version. Would be nice to see both though. No graphics with and without wing.

[Niburu]

I think I actually like it mor with the longnose

[VTX]

With Street Windshield, not sure on the size or shape that FFR is using, but you get the idea.


Attachment 10113

That looks awesome! I would say it's in HOF territory for me now, even with those headlights.

Do you think it's possible to do a solid color and with darker wheels? I'd love to see what that would look like.

[mekeys]

I was not planning on posting for a while, but Vman's work got my juices flowing and I could not resist.

Not like this will ever happen, but I just had to see what shortening the nose back to Jim's first full sized buck would look like with different headlights - based on Vman's excellent foundation of changes of course.

http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x...%20and%20Ends/

Heh George don't stop now you are the main reason I keep checking in every day.Not too many others seem to be interested in STYLE..

Mel

[Mechie3]

Here is a more modified front vent area.


Attachment 10088

Just by modifying that bumper vent and removing the horizontal whisker, it looks amazing! Reminds me of the vent on the F430 scuderia!

[StatGSR]

I knew it wouldn't take to much to make me a believer, and i think Vman may have just pulled it off! good work!

[Oppenheimer]

Here is a more modified front vent area.


Attachment 10088

Now thats what I'm talkin' 'bout! I feel some tingling in the scalp, and it ain't dandruff shampoo!

Put some of that vman rear detail from the first post as well, and we got HoF. This is starting to turn into anther Rodney like effort. A few tweaks to Jim's basic design, and wow!

The problem with doing these sorts of mods ourselves is then you have to paint, and costs go way up. The genius of Dave's idea to go no-paint is the cost of the finished product, not just the cost of the kit & components. If FFR is willing to entertain some of these ideas (if they fit, and if they don't raise costs, and if they don't require new molds, etc), I think a lot of the 'OK, but not exciting' type comments will wane.

[Doc_FFR]

Here is a more modified front vent area.


Attachment 10088

Wow. Those changes really make a difference!

I personally think the longer hood looks great. Makes it possible for a frunk.

[Dave Smith]

I think that Vman is super talented and his small changes make a big effect indeed. We are up to our ears prepping for open house and so I can't come back to this too much, I just wanted to say that IF you guys can understand how just these small changes affect the 818R rendering, can you walk with me just a bit and take a small teenie tiny leap of faith that the translation to full size is a log scale difference, maybe two.

I am pleased with the project and have been studying this last few days the responses etc with great interest and comparing feedback from a variety of sources (I laughed out loud at the FB crowd-sourced robo-supercar-frankenstein design winner posted on another thread).

I have reached some conclusions about the drama of the last few days and I think I have a good idea of how to make sure that going forward, it doesn't hurt the project effort and contributes in a positive way while keeping the interested members of the FFR community informed of the exciting parts of the 818 story. I do think that the 818 forum section is, right now, worlds different than the rest of our community (and I have some ideas on that). Being kind and polite builds the community and I don't think that taking the effort to be considerate to others is very hard to do. Commonly the guy who claims to "say it like it is" is also intellectually lazy and doesnt take responsibility for the hurtful things he/she says. Candor yes. Rudeness and insults will never build a forum where people feel welcome to share ideas.

Imagine we were all speaking face-to-face and then the rough edges get smoothed out and the smiles come easy...

I don't want to do any post-mortem on the past few days, but Vmans ideas and those of MANY MANY people here are SOOOO GOOOD! Perhaps part of the challenge with the 818 section of the forum is the influx of "designers" who came here as a direct result of the design competition and are perhaps not all car-builders, racers, car-guys, or project guys as much as they are "designers" (this is closer to what the Local Motors community is where-as the FFR community is almost exclusively real guys who turn wrenches, make stuff, drive stuff and have established themselves as exceptionally positive and helpful). While those designers have had a great influence, I think, in some cases, they communicate differently and may occasionaly have expectations that cannot be met in the real physical world of vehicle engineering. This is the community I wanted to engage on the 818 project and we have, for the most part.

didnt mean to ramble... Excellent mods Vman!*

* Dave Smith does not commit to, endorse, or make any suggestions that he will do anything related to this stattement (a little joke there).

[leetfade]

If anyone has anything negative to say on that their just idiots... I have to commend you on being able to put the emotion of the past few days aside, still recognize the value of the community and continue to post.

One quick question that you may or may not be able to answer. Is the whole front one piece or is the front bumper molded urethane / frp / fiberglass like a production car?

Now, back to VMan. Really like the look of that. Nice job on the tweaks!

[16g-95gsx]

With Street Windshield, not sure on the size or shape that FFR is using, but you get the idea.


Attachment 10113

Definitely starting to grow on me. Not that I thought it was "bad" to begin with, just was an unexpected body choice.

[Oppenheimer]

Diversity. The rest of the FFR community, the other forums, the existing customer base, is a very narrow demograhic. Mostly *ahem*, 'older' guys, mostly of at least some means, certainly all wrench turning car-guys, with some sort of garage or work-space. Everyone understands each other, everyone can relate to each other. Plus with age (usually) comes maturity, and respect for others. Knowing you don't really know everything, and you can learn something from anyone.

For a variety of reasons, the 818 project is attracting a much more diverse demographic. There is a learning curve here, on both sides, and those growing pains are showing through. I really believe over time that it will work itself out, this part of the FFR forum will find its groove. It won't turn into NAISOC, but it will always have some rough edges compared to the other parts of FFR forum. But it will work, it will be effective. It will be useful to both FFR and to us.

We all need to embrace the diversity here, respect others, take the highroad, and always, Always, ALWAYS assume good intent. Assume that your fellow forum member has the projects best interest at heart, and certainly so does FFR.

[16g-95gsx]

I think that Vman is super talented and his small changes make a big effect indeed. We are up to our ears prepping for open house and so I can't come back to this too much, I just wanted to say that IF you guys can understand how just these small changes affect the 818R rendering, can you walk with me just a bit and take a small teenie tiny leap of faith that the translation to full size is a log scale difference, maybe two.

I am pleased with the project and have been studying this last few days the responses etc with great interest and comparing feedback from a variety of sources (I laughed out loud at the FB crowd-sourced robo-supercar-frankenstein design winner posted on another thread).

I have reached some conclusions about the drama of the last few days and I think I have a good idea of how to make sure that going forward, it doesn't hurt the project effort and contributes in a positive way while keeping the interested members of the FFR community informed of the exciting parts of the 818 story. I do think that the 818 forum section is, right now, worlds different than the rest of our community (and I have some ideas on that). Being kind and polite builds the community and I don't think that taking the effort to be considerate to others is very hard to do. Commonly the guy who claims to "say it like it is" is also intellectually lazy and doesnt take responsibility for the hurtful things he/she says. Candor yes. Rudeness and insults will never build a forum where people feel welcome to share ideas.

Imagine we were all speaking face-to-face and then the rough edges get smoothed out and the smiles come easy...

I don't want to do any post-mortem on the past few days, but Vmans ideas and those of MANY MANY people here are SOOOO GOOOD! Perhaps part of the challenge with the 818 section of the forum is the influx of "designers" who came here as a direct result of the design competition and are perhaps not all car-builders, racers, car-guys, or project guys as much as they are "designers" (this is closer to what the Local Motors community is where-as the FFR community is almost exclusively real guys who turn wrenches, make stuff, drive stuff and have established themselves as exceptionally positive and helpful). While those designers have had a great influence, I think, in some cases, they communicate differently and may occasionaly have expectations that cannot be met in the real physical world of vehicle engineering. This is the community I wanted to engage on the 818 project and we have, for the most part.

didnt mean to ramble... Excellent mods Vman!*

* Dave Smith does not commit to, endorse, or make any suggestions that he will do anything related to this stattement (a little joke there).

The changes made to the design, even if it is IS Jim's design, are already many magnitudes of order better than the original. I'm confident that you guys will nail it in the end. Having taken a moment to get over my initial surprise, the body seems to be really growing on me. I fully agree on the slight frontal changes the Vman has added, and really think that may have been all that was needed for me. The small opening looks funny to me at first, but in reality from an engineering perspective is all that is really needed on a car like this. Good luck with your project, I'm still eagerly standing by waiting to see what the final product turns out to be.

[N8Salem]

Good counsel Dave, I am a moderator of a forum at musclediscussion.com and unfortunately as a forum grows you have to moderate the detractors and even spammers that will try to post ads. On my forum off topic posts and rudeness is deleted and the member sent a pm that could result in banning of their ip if it continues. You may want to nominate some members you know and trust to monitor the forum. I also noticed there is another ffr forum online you may want to recruit from.

That being said I'm looking forward to seeing how the 818 evolves. I've watched the Elise evolve into Steven Tyler's Venom GT and think the 818 could follow suit albeit more economically.

[DrieStone]

Definitely starting to grow on me. Not that I thought it was "bad" to begin with, just was an unexpected body choice.

I'll agree with that statement. This is a car that I can see myself in. It's still not quite there, but this pushes the want level up.

I'll also admit that leading with the 818R design made it difficult for me to "see" the car that I'd want to purchase. The full sized windshield and the reworked front-end have helped a lot. I'm still on the fence, and I always will be until I see the final $15k car.