Ingress and Egress

[kach22i]

Almost like a clamshell.

That is an excellent idea which might work best with a T-top design.

Much simpler than these Sabb and Volvo concepts.

Aero X Concept
http://car.mb0t.com/category/saab


Volvo Concept Car Designed by women for women
http://www.gizmag.com/go/2672/

[Olimk2]

Sterling nova solution, back in the '70, inspired by Pininfarina's Ferrari Modulo, nothing new under the sun, but not a lightweight solution...

[Gollum]

The actual useful egress door area is dictated by the frame, right?.

All I have is a printout of the 3D frame drawing. I did not scale it to do this study, just eye-balled it for conversation purposes. Don't follow it, get it wrong and blame me - I'm not a frame expert.

Tell me what's wrong and right about this sketch/study.........................feel free to correct it and add your name to the changes using color, arrows or whatever suits your fancy.



NOTE: The penciled in outline of the car is not my design entry. Sort of looks like an old Escort 2+2 don't it?

The area you have marked might be a good estimate of "area" to climb out of, but the door itself can be a bit larger, and show the frame like a roll cage.

As long as those side supports are close enough to the driver, and there isn't too much door sill to get over, then getting over that support beam won't be a big deal.... if there's room for your head to go upwards, otherwise you're doing an awkward duck and pinch move to get out. If the initial release is a roadster (most likely) then the door just needs to get out of your way, easy! It's the roof addition that might botch the whole thing up.

[kach22i]

the door itself can be a bit larger, and show the frame like a roll cage.

I agree which is why I did not change my doors.

Can you imagine the look on a new passenger's face when they open up the door and see that steel tube frame?

A big smile would hit my face, but others may looked concerned - Example; - like hey man why the steel tube, are you planning on driving fast?.....is this a race car?.

[kach22i]

Sterling nova solution,

Good example, I could not remember the name of it.

[kach22i]

Last year I went looking at slightly used cars/trucks with my buddy. He takes care of his elderly mother, so egress was an important factor. Based on my research the Ford Freestyle would be the best for little old ladies, but I did not get a chance to test this theory in the field.

[Olimk2]

I once took my 80years old grand ma for a ride to the shops in my mk2 miata, before going she made sure she was able to exit the car alone and without help!! Tell the story to your wife ...

[iamnottelling]

I like the idea of a simple clam shell top. If it was a targa top hinged at the front that you would open for entry and you would just step over the low door. Also if you pulled the hinge pins the top could be completely removed. I am thinking of just a simple house door hinge type design.

[kach22i]

FYI: FFR GTM frame for reference.

http://www.cicenet.net/showthread.php?p=194839


http://kitcar.automotive.com/26631/0...hotos10-0.html

[Olimk2]

Waow, screaming for a new body!! Could be very interesting too...

[kach22i]

I just posted it so that we could see what one of the other FFR frames looks like. As already illustrated the 818 frame is different in several ways. Presumably to make it more user friendly (ingress/egress) and open top.

[Cooluser23]

FYI: FFR GTM frame for reference.

http://www.cicenet.net/showthread.php?p=194839


http://kitcar.automotive.com/26631/0...hotos10-0.html

I have to say, this reminds me a lot of the Lego TECHNIC 8880 kit.









More images for people who are nostalgic

[bromikl]

I apologize if this is a dumb question, but the GTM has doors. And there is a structural member across where I would expect the door to be. Does that frame move out of the way when the door opens? If not, how difficult would it be to put a hinge at one end, and a latch at the other?

Of course all cars today are unibody. But my Honda Element has the biggest door opening of any passenger vehicle. They managed to incorporate a B-pillar and side-impact braces. And the car is as solid as any truck I've driven (i.e. Chevy Blazer.) They use a flat metal bar that fits into a slot in the frame top and bottom. The door (I'm sure) is one of the heaviest out there, but I can't underestimate how useful it is.

Why couldn't they make a functional door?

[Xelerator]

I expect it to have a side impact crash structure for track use

URL=http://img11.imageshack.us/i/cageprepaintma9.jpg/][/URL]

[kach22i]

In response to an idea someone mentioned earlier.

Autostyle solutions ..............and Tigga Reese.
http://users.telenet.be/lotuselise/tuning/body.html

[Oppenheimer]

In response to an idea someone mentioned earlier.

Autostyle solutions ..............and Tigga Reese.
http://users.telenet.be/lotuselise/tuning/body.html

Yes! That is the idea exactly (well, it wasn't _my_ idea, but I did _like_ the idea).

I like the way that looks on the Elise. I like the way it looks with roof installed, I like the way it looks in Targa mode, with T-bar. Manages to not look like you need a Mullet to drive it. Looks like it would be functional, too. The top is 2 smaller pieces, might make it possible to stow in car.

[Baysailor]

I'm only just over 6' tall 180 pounds wet, and most of the featherweight cars I've gotten into in my lifetime have always made me feel like a fool getting in and out. The Elise is a very good example of this. All of the chassis stiffness runs on the outside of the chassis, and since it's all aluminum box tubing that's rather large, opposed to steel space frame, the door sills are subsequently huge and getting across them is no easy task.

On the lotus ingress/egress topic of what is currently in production: I was with my wife at the LA Auto Show on the Lotus stand when she was in the midst of attempting such an ingress manuveur over the much discussed doorsill/box frame section.

The salesman responded to her slightly confused look in a his crisp British accent,
"There is, uh, a technique."

I completely agree with there being a technique. I am 6'6" about 265 lbs and drive my Elise pretty much daily. My wife, who is 5'1", also loves going out in it. Neither of us have a problem getting in or out. Wanting to fit also plays a role.

Being a Subaru owner/fan, I am certainly hopeful that it will be the same with the 818!

[bromikl]

Splendid!

[Cooluser23]

I'm sure I've ever seen this car with the doors open.

I. Love. This. Car.

This is exactly the design I want to build. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, they say.

I'm glad someone shares my thoughts. The Mp4 is the first car in a long while that has been built with a clean slate and is actually a compact car when seen in person (Pebble Beach, CA Concourse '10). If the final car looks "inspired" by this car, but still original I'm sure many people will buy it. - I know I would.

[Cooluser23]

Do the Aston 'slightly up' doors have a problem with wanting to close on their own?

Nope. They stay open just fine. Nothing special in the mechanism either. Just a great attachment method. If we go with simplicity I still find the Aston Martin type doors one of the best methods, I hope Factory Five agrees.

[Cooluser23]

Look at the video. These doors don't look at all complicated to make or install.
Considering the goal of this electric car they're made for, I'm sure they're pretty lightweight too.

Think about how easy it will be to clear the tube frame chassis of the 818 with doors like these. (remember the original 1960's Mercedes 300SL Gullwing doors were made out of necessity to clear the body panels.)

[Arch]

I am 63 years old, not flexible, over weight, and I could care less how I look getting in and out of a super car. If it is possible to do, I will figure it out. I envision myself pulling up to the red carpet (ie special event or restaurant) and needing the valet or my younger girl friend to help me get out of the car. Works for me.
Arch

[Olimk2]

OH yes good solution if your getting old, make sure you get a young lady near you to help!! Well my wife is 8 years younger than me, should do the trick in 25 years time!!! Even better my 2 years old daughter seems to enjoy the rides in my Miata, LOL!

[dowienu]

try this Centerforce 381009, Clutch Disc

[Cooluser23]

Doesn't seem like there is any more creative ideas for ingress, and egress.

[LifeIsOnTheWire]

funny how quickly Ingress and Egress turned into Digress..

[Slaughter]

Being an ex Lotus owner - It is never a good idea to use the windshield as a brace for you getting in and out of the car. Many people made this mistake costing them a pretty penny. I got used to the elise within a few days - you will too.

There is also an old saying among lotus owners. "If the woman does not like it, she has got to go"

[Mechazawa]

The more I think about it the more I like the idea of gull wing doors. Maybe the standard body would just be a lotus 7 like step over with a cut down section to make it a bit easier to get in and out, then the optional hard top could have gull wings that only need to go down to level the body is cut down to. This way ingress/egress is no more difficult than without the top, and you don't need roll down windows in the hard top, you just open the whole door to pay the toll, get the big mac, etc.

[olpro]

I think the gull wing concept is very logical, probably the best approach for an 818 roof option.

[Olimk2]

The more I think about it the more I like the idea of gull wing doors. Maybe the standard body would just be a lotus 7 like step over with a cut down section to make it a bit easier to get in and out, then the optional hard top could have gull wings that only need to go down to level the body is cut down to. This way ingress/egress is no more difficult than without the top, and you don't need roll down windows in the hard top, you just open the whole door to pay the toll, get the big mac, etc.

funster fast back web.jpg

[Cooluser23]

No one likes the "forward and up" opening gullwing type doors?

While I'm a huge fan of the DeLorean doors, I think the "forward and up" style looks a bit more modern.

Either way, I'm hoping the consensus is, we want simple, but "non boring" type doors that open somewhat cooler than a typical Camry.