Retro Racing R build

[Hindsight]

Looking forward to seeing it back out on the track.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Yes, something inside was screaming to get out, but nothing made any new holes.

Retro
Was the screaming you heard from the motor the same as ours?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdDs...ature=youtu.be

We have not had ours back on the track yet. You have me thinking hard about a dry sump.
Bob

[STiPWRD]

Did you log IAT? I'm curious how your AAIC performed. Looking forward to the video as well.

[RetroRacing]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auBYK3dZN2g

This was the lap where I was scrubbing in a new set of slicks, running a new brake bias and you can tell the engine was letting go during the session, no power!
I will listen to your screaming, but Gator might be a better witness, as he was right there listening. AAIC temps were stable at 140 , but the temperature that day was 102, and we were having issues getting air out of the engine bay, wondering if we have some sort of reversion with out wing/diffuser combo. Looking to get better performance with some slight mods to the box. Oil temp was dead equal to water temp at 190, with the bottom air intake taped off.

The car was much faster earlier in the day, killed me to let the Cup Car get away.....

[longislandwrx]

my favorite thing about the video... no bouncing hood

[RetroRacing]

New video up, full power, first laps ever for the car.

[FFRSpec72]

New video up, full power, first laps ever for the car.

I see you passed me struggling to reach 5K. So how do you think these cars will stack up against Michael M. BMW R ?

[RetroRacing]

I know that just an LSD would make a 3 second difference, pulling past 7k should be at least 1-2 seconds and getting rid of the understeer another 1-2. That would put us in the mid 19's. Not sure what time Michael does, but our goal is sub 19's with chicane, sub 10's without.

[RetroRacing]

Dry sump is in and filled with 2.5 gallons. We cranked it over to get some oil into the system, should be able to start her up once a finish the venting lines. BTW, we did install the Peterson vacuum valve on the old oil filler hole and preset it to 20hgm. still have to shield the tank, not happy with where we had to install the tank, for weight reasons, but it is what it is for now.
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[Hindsight]

Awesome, that didnt take long. What header are you running?

[Sgt.Gator]

That's great.
Are logging crankcase vacuum/pressure?

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Dry sump is in and filled with 2.5 gallons. We cranked it over to get some oil into the system, should be able to start her up once a finish the venting lines. BTW, we did install the Peterson vacuum valve on the old oil filler hole and preset it to 20hgm. still have to shield the tank, not happy with where we had to install the tank, for weight reasons, but it is what it is for now.
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Retro,
Look great.
I'm waiting for my tank before my installation.
What brand and model hose did you use?
Bob

[Sgt.Gator]

Dry sump is in and filled with 2.5 gallons. We cranked it over to get some oil into the system, should be able to start her up once a finish the venting lines. BTW, we did install the Peterson vacuum valve on the old oil filler hole and preset it to 20hgm. still have to shield the tank, not happy with where we had to install the tank, for weight reasons, but it is what it is for now.
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20 inches of vacuum is a lot. You may be at the point of pulling air thru the crank and cam seals which is a bad thing, and also it dries out the bottom of the pistons. At 16 inches most of what I've read is you need piston oil squirters. I very highly doubt you could get to 20, (not even 14) but since the relief valve is a safety device you should consider setting it at 16 or 14.

[RetroRacing]

We think that may be the reason for the pump seal leak, the lip seal was folded out in one area, which is odd. Reseting it tonight to 12 just to be safe.

[RetroRacing]

Well, the fire system worked...........

Great test day on Friday, ran the car hard for 7 20 min sessions with a few minor issues that were 2 minute fixes. Actually got to tune the handling, but without an LSD, we were still leaving 3-4 seconds on the track. Same with ride height, but we have plan for that.
THen came Sunday, new drivers in the car, wet sessions in the am. Perfect weather in the afternoon, but first session out, something happened to the engine, then fire, then more fire. No idea right now, we couldn't see anything with all of the fire foam so we just loaded it in the trailer and had a beer.

The car was lapping 1:50 flat without the lsd, with 1 pound of boost removed and way to high on the ride height. It's easily a mid-low 40's car at the ridge, so we are really bummed that we are now out of the 8 hour in Portland and the 25 hour at T-hill. There is just not enough time to replace the engine, all of the hoses and wireing in the engine bay, tune and test.

Will let you know what we find when we find it, but I suspect something very bad as ALL 3 gallons of oil was missing from the tank....

[Frank818]

Oh crap I'm sorry to read that! All the great wrap must have taken a beating. Not sure you posted pix, some are blocked when I'm at work.

You are very calm, car catches on fire and you take a beer.

[Sgt.Gator]

Dang!! Sorry to hear that. What a mess! I can't imagine all the work in front of you to get it going again.

If you're game to drag out one of your old cars for a PIR or Thill "team practice", I'll be there. I'll be going to Thill25 either on a team or as a spectator no matter what. If my STI was running I'd offer it up for ya'll to use, but it's no where near ready for a 25 hour race.

[RetroRacing]

IMG_1450.JPGIMG_1447.JPGSo, a stock JDM ver5 engine will rev to 8500.....once. We put a new driver in the car, new to the car that is, and he mistook a debrief discussion of where to shift and where not to. I guess our tuner did not set the rev limiter, he pulled 4th gear to 8500 and blew a rod cap through the top of the engine. Shattered the water crossover, note in the picture, the rod cap sitting on top of the block.
Lessons learned:
1. Trust but verify, we should have tested the rev limiters (set them low and rev)
2. Have a track map handy during debrief
We really did get lucky. We pulled everything off the car from the bulkhead back, and we have the block stripped down and have inspected/cleaned everything. burned some wires, hoses and wrap, along with some powdercoating. If our engine gets here in 2-3 weeks, we will have it all back together in a month or two, ready to test again next spring.
We are changing to 15" wheels up front for a few reasons. We can run a much lower front ride height, less brake leverage and less rotating mass. May need to change calipers, will know once we receive the wheels. We will then have a set of XXR 551 for sale. just sayin.....

[Scargo]

Where's the nut for the rod bolt? Looks familiar. Friend did almost the same, with fire. His extinguisher material was pink...

[RetroRacing]

they twisted off by hand....it was sitting on top of the engine as well.

[Frank818]

Was there any damage to the body panels (fiberglass, etc.) and/or wrap?

[RetroRacing]

Yes, we need to re-wrap the rear fenders, top cover and alum humps above the bulkhead. There goes a week.....

[Mitch Wright]

Looking at the photo of the rod/cap it looks like the rod big end and cap is blue and might have been tying up prior to breaking. It could be the photo but something to look into.

[Scargo]

Looking at the photo of the rod/cap it looks like the rod big end and cap is blue and might have been tying up prior to breaking. ...

Does look blue, like it got very hot, and there is no sign of a bearing except possibly for a slight smear visible.

[RetroRacing]

We were checking for bearing as the day went on, everything looked good, but I havn't cracked the primary filter yet. Not sure why we would have a bearing issue unless our pressure is too high for stock bearings.

[RetroRacing]

https://youtu.be/rWFHeF03KE4
Here is the video from the Friday test day, two different drivers (im the faster one in the Carbon Helmet ) As you can see, it really needs an LSD, can't put the power down out of the corners. We also need some front downforce, hence lowering the front of the car to get the splitter to work.
Love the shifter, and the no drama handling. Speed at the end of the front straight was 156mph, maybe we will keep the 4.44's!

[FFRSpec72]

https://youtu.be/rWFHeF03KE4
Here is the video from the Friday test day, two different drivers (im the faster one in the Carbon Helmet ) As you can see, it really needs an LSD, can't put the power down out of the corners. We also need some front downforce, hence lowering the front of the car to get the splitter to work.
Love the shifter, and the no drama handling. Speed at the end of the front straight was 156mph, maybe we will keep the 4.44's!

Looks like you were at a lapping day event as some of the other cars were not really paying attention and holding their lines. I noticed it seems you were going through the carrousel in 4th ? When I had issues with tire rub was at the turn at the bottom of carrousel and at the turn at the end of the straight away on the back before going down the hill

My shifter totally is a POS and pure garbage.

[DanielsDM]

Looks like it was working pretty well. 156mph! Did you take out some rear wing angle since the previous event?

[RetroRacing]

We reinforced the rear wing so that it didn't bend backwards, so that may have helped. You could feel the aero wall approaching after a few seconds into fifth, so a little more power is required. We will be adding another 60hp for the next outing, taking it up to stock boost levels, we ran detuned for safety....ya, that worked!

Yes, it was a track day, blue mustang was a tool out there, new GT3 cup car (and I do mean new!) was afraid of it I think. We know that an LSD, lower ride height and 60 more HP is worth 6-8 seconds, which puts us into the low 40's there, which was our goal.

Supper easy car to drive, brakes are super awesome.

Jeff

[DanielsDM]

You posted earlier about the steel tube subframe bending where your wing supports attach. Can you post some pics of this area? I'm planning on doing something similar with my wing mounting.
What is your WHP now?

[wleehendrick]

blue mustang was a tool out there, new GT3 cup car (and I do mean new!) was afraid of it I think.

I noticed that; being afraid of Mustangs is just reasonable!

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[RetroRacing]

I will send pictures of what we did to support the area, but just as a description, we installed two brackets on the upper shock bolts, then ran a solid aluminum rod (drilled and tapped for hiem joints) down to the rear horizontal bar that is just behind the transmission. Removable, but super solid!
We were only running about 250 at the wheels, we set boost one pound under stock, on 92 octane fuel. We ran 100 through the system, so we can increase the boost to stock levels and dial in a bit more timing. Tuner sais easy 310 safely.

[Frank818]

1 week to re-wrap only these panels... how long did it take for the entire car the 1st time?

[RetroRacing]

WE stripped the panels in about half an hour, easy with some heat. Now we have some fiberglass to fix, vents to install, new hood latches, then the wrap. The Wrap of the complete top rear of the car will take the better part of a day. THe whole repair will take a week.

[FFRSpec72]

How many yards of wrap did you need to do your car ? and what width did you use ?

[RetroRacing]

We have been working on building engines for the 818, my EP RX7 and Terry's as well, all while installing a new front suspension in his car, helping a buddy totally rebuild his EP RX3 (which will probably kick our but now) AND finishing the repairs on the 818 after the fire.
We are now down to the final bits and pieces on the 818! new airbox, new stand alone water pump for the turbo, ceramic coating of entire exhaust, new mufflers (testing testing testing) all new wiring, plugs, rear hood vents, aero latches, new lsd, new 15" wheels for the front, blah, blah.
Off to the dyno next week we hope, looking for 300+ at the wheels at 18-19lbs of boost. That would give us the exact same power to weight ratio as the new Porsche Cup car. He is hoping.....

[Mulry]

We have been working on building engines for the 818, my EP RX7 and Terry's as well, all while installing a new front suspension in his car, helping a buddy totally rebuild his EP RX3 (which will probably kick our but now) AND finishing the repairs on the 818 after the fire.
We are now down to the final bits and pieces on the 818! new airbox, new stand alone water pump for the turbo, ceramic coating of entire exhaust, new mufflers (testing testing testing) all new wiring, plugs, rear hood vents, aero latches, new lsd, new 15" wheels for the front, blah, blah.
Off to the dyno next week we hope, looking for 300+ at the wheels at 18-19lbs of boost. That would give us the exact same power to weight ratio as the new Porsche Cup car. He is hoping.....

And a rev limiter on the ECu this time?

[Scargo]

Was just going back over the notes in the thread. You were running a used dry sump on a tired two liter engine. You had some porting work done and had rebuilt heads. Heads could be OK to 8,500 if all is to spec. # 3 let go. That's fed by #3 main which also feeds #2 rod. It looks like there is a gap between the journals, and the case halves show a gap as well. That's hard to imagine. Are my eyes deceiving me? Did you have any data logging going on or video of gauges? You seemed to know that it went to 8.5.
What is going back in?

[RetroRacing]

No data logging yet, but what let go was number 3 rod at over 9000 rpm, and yes, we have a rev limiter now.

We are putting in a new rebuilt EJ207 RA, with new H-beam rods and forged pistons. The dry sump was new, the engine had only 45k on it, but sat for 14 years like all other version 5 engines, not that it would have made a difference at 9k!

We did open up the head to match the intake, will be interesting to see what that gets us, with the P20 exhaust housing on the VF28. The gap I think was formed by the rod jamming into the block half.

[RetroRacing]

Got the wrap and blankets on the ceramic coated exhaust last night. It that doesn't make a difference then nothing will. Also, finished mounting and pluming our electric water pump for the turbo. Blew through it no problem when not running, so water will flow normally when out on track if the pump is on or off, then, when shut down for pit stop, our pit plug will run the pump to keep the turbo cool during pit stops or after running. The pump is on a 180 temp switch, so it will keep pushing water through the turbo until its under 180 degrees.

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