Wayne Presley/VeryCoolParts Build Thread H6 power

[Wayne Presley]

Ok, finally got to work on my car today. Not much different from the last visit but the cooling system is completely devoid of air. I did a mod to the cooling system to automatically bleed all the air out on the first fill and FFR is working on a permanent bolt on solution to the issue. My way you have to drill and tap one hole. So with the cooling working great I strapped it on the dyno to break it in. Did all of the idle and light load running and short bursts to seat the rings. Shut it off and recheck the fluids, safety check everything and then let her rip. First short low boost pulls to 4500 rpm checking the AFR, boost level and timing. Then 5500, then 6500 rpm. Everything is great at 6 psi, so up to 8, then 10 and finally 12 psi. It made 264 RWHP and 261 RWTQ at 12 psi with 9.5 CR JE pistons, ported heads, stock cams, GT2860 turbo and full 3" exhaust. Very happy with how it runs, full boost at 3400 RPM, smooth idle.

[07FIREBLADE]

Come on. Lets see what it can do with some more boost... damn thats some pretty good progress though. Do you happen to have a video of the pull?

[Wayne Presley]

Come on. Lets see what it can do with some more boost... damn thats some pretty good progress though. Do you happen to have a video of the pull?

Maybe

[Frank818]

I thought you could rev up a 2.0 to 8700 or something. Maybe you're not there yet.

[Wayne Presley]

You can but you need cams and valve springs to make HP there...

[Frank818]

You can but you need cams and valve springs to make HP there...

So it means you lose bottom end if you rev it up past 8000?

BTW, that sound it pretty awesome! I don't think I'd need a 3.0.

[Wayne Presley]

So it means you lose bottom end if you rev it up past 8000?

BTW, that sound it pretty awesome! I don't think I'd need a 3.0.

To get to 8700 you'll need cams, rods, pistons, valve springs, titanium retainers to get there.

[Frank818]

Yeah I figure with more aggressive cams it means a less torquey bottom end. I doubt you could have the best of both worlds.
And then a turbo that flows at 8000, which means it probably needs to kick in at higher rpm than another turbo that can die at 6500 if your redline is 6500 anyway.

[Erik W. Treves]

Guys.... At 265 to the ground and around 1900 lbs.. Really... More? ? The thing is gonna scoot... To make more I think will be back to so much it will be not too much fun... It should be dead reliable at that power level.. Sounds pisser!

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Way to go Wayne. We need a "LIKE" button on this forum
:

[metalmaker12]

To get to 8700 you'll need cams, rods, pistons, valve springs, titanium retainers to get there.

Awesome Dude!!!!!loving it

I will get to 8600 Wayne, my ej207 ( jdm 2.0 sti) is stock and revs to roughly 8100 on a stock tune, I will get to around 8600, but the turbo stops around 8200. This is all stock jdm sti heads cams valves etc. It also makes great torque.

[Wayne Presley]

I will get to 8600 Wayne, my ej207 ( jdm 2.0 sti) is stock and revs to roughly 8100 on a stock tune, I will get to around 8600, but the turbo stops around 8200. This is all stock jdm sti heads cams valves etc. It also makes great torque too.

I am going to get 275-300whp and torque on a consecutive tune, that's more than enough and 230 whp should be a blast

I could have gone higher on the boost but a fresh motor and 6200 is where it made peak power. I like the 9.5 CR pistons make much better torque off boost and it made 40 more HP and 20 lb/ft more torque with 3 lbs less boost than the last 2.0 Subaru I tuned.

[metalmaker12]

That's a great number for a break in check, looking good man, pm me with what you did to the coolant system to purge it etc

[wleehendrick]

Yeah I figure with more aggressive cams it means a less torquey bottom end. I doubt you could have the best of both worlds.

Unless U have VTEC, yo!

Seriously, awesome progress Wayne! Do you plan to post a list of your 818 parts here on on your website? I'm eyeing that shifter, and will want a set of rims.

[Wayne Presley]

I'm re doing the web site right now and all the parts will be there

BTW if I go to 15 psi of boost it will make 293 RWHP

[Xusia]

Guys.... At 265 to the ground and around 1900 lbs.. Really... More? ? The thing is gonna scoot... To make more I think will be back to so much it will be not too much fun... It should be dead reliable at that power level.. Sounds pisser!

Agreed!

I could have gone higher on the boost but a fresh motor and 6200 is where it made peak power. I like the 9.5 CR pistons make much better torque off boost and it made 40 more HP and 20 lb/ft more torque with 3 lbs less boost than the last 2.0 Subaru I tuned.

Just so I know, what is the stock CR?

[Wayne Presley]

Just so I know, what is the stock CR?

The 2.0's are 8:1 and the 2.5L are 8.3:1 CR

[wleehendrick]

I'm re doing the web site right now and all the parts will be there

Great... there goes my budget!

[longislandwrx]

Nice power for 12psi. At that level and some careful tuning you could probably get away with 89 octane. heck maybe regular.

[Frank818]

I'm re doing the web site right now and all the parts will be there

BTW if I go to 15 psi of boost it will make 293 RWHP

And what's the max you think it can take (after break-in)?

[Frank818]

The 2.0's are 8:1 and the 2.5L are 8.3:1 CR

So you've actually increased CR compared to stock?

[metalmaker12]

Unless U have VTEC, yo!

Seriously, awesome progress Wayne! Do you plan to post a list of your 818 parts here on on your website? I'm eyeing that shifter, and will want a set of rims.

AVC's is basically VTEC, and 06 wrx up and all sti's have it. So they can have both pretty solidly except for really low end. But the new Subie engines will be direct injection and they will be pulling harder sooner.

[Wayne Presley]

Nice power for 12psi. At that level and some careful tuning you could probably get away with 89 octane. heck maybe regular.

My dynamic cylinder pressures are as high as a 8:1 CR motor making the same HP so still needs premium.

And what's the max you think it can take (after break-in)?

That size turbo will max out around 300-310 RWHP, the parts in the motor are good for 350.

So you've actually increased CR compared to stock?

Stock is 8.0, mine is 9.5 so yes I've increased the CR. Horsepower is a directly related to cylinder pressure given the same motor. Lets say a 250 flywheel HP motor 2.0L, you can get there naturally aspirated, or turbocharged. Either way you get there, the peak cylinder pressure is going to be the same at the same HP level. In the NA motor you get there by going with cams, head work and a high compression ratio to get enough air in to reach that peak cylinder pressure. Turbos force more air into the chamber so it takes less compressing to reach the same peak pressure, hence the lower CR pistons. The peak cylinder pressure is a combination of CR and boost level so you can go higher boost/lower CR or lower boost /higher CR. Now the caveat, the higher the boost to CR ratio, the more dramatic the difference between on boost and off boost power output. With less CR it will be making less HP to begin with then when it swings into full boost you get a huge HP difference. Couple that with a turbo that has to flow a lot to make the HP and you get a motor that has a Jekyll and Hyde personality. Now up the higher CR motor it takes less boost to the the same cylinder pressure because the piston are providing a larger component of the peak cylinder pressures. Since the cylinder will have more HP off boost, the power difference to the 250 level will be lower and smoother. On a 8:1 CR motor it takes about 15 psi to make 225 RWHP, on the 9.5 CR motor it took 10.5 psi. I had the intercooler coupling pop off on the 8.0 motor on one run and it made a whopping 112 RWHP. Multiply that by the pressure ratio at 15 psi and you get the numbers it actually made ((15+14.7)/14.7)*112 = 226.28. Simple Physics

[Erik W. Treves]

I think you turbo charger is too small for that engine...lol....

Seems like the math works on a turbo charged Ford as it does on a Subaru...imagine that!

I can't wait to come down there a "play" with mine...a few more weeks!

[longislandwrx]

My dynamic cylinder pressures are as high as a 8:1 CR motor making the same HP so still needs premium.

Didn't notice the 9.5s No wonder that thing boosts so fast and sounds like a beast. Very cool build. Did you just gasket match the heads or something more?

[Wayne Presley]

Didn't notice the 9.5s No wonder that thing boosts so fast and sounds like a beast. Very cool build. Did you just gasket match the heads or something more?

Gasket matched, ported the heads, 5 angle valve job, didn't trim the guides and removed the TGV's.

[icky]

AVC's is basically VTEC, and 06 wrx up and all sti's have it. So they can have both pretty solidly except for really low end. But the new Subie engines will be direct injection and they will be pulling harder sooner.

Vtec swiches to entirely different came lobes, bigger, instead of just changing the cam timming. Avcs is not all that great untill you can tune both intake and exhaust cams like the newer sti's. Even then they arnt the same, as honda k20's do both timming and bigger lobes.

[wleehendrick]

Vtec swiches to entirely different came lobes, bigger, instead of just changing the cam timming. Avcs is not all that great untill you can tune both intake and exhaust cams like the newer sti's. Even then they arnt the same, as honda k20's do both timming and bigger lobes.

Beat me to it... VTEC and AVCS are both VVT (variable valve timing) schemes, but quite different in function and implementation. My original comment was (hopefully clearly) a joke on Honda:

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Sorry for the diversion!

[HelluvaEngineer]

I think you turbo charger is too small for that engine...lol....

Seems like the math works on a turbo charged Ford as it does on a Subaru...imagine that!

I can't wait to come down there a "play" with mine...a few more weeks!

I think Wayne has done a great job of selecting components that work well together, creating a very drivable car. Great low end torque. Smaller turbo and higher compression greatly increases low speed drive-ability.

[Wayne Presley]

I think Wayne has done a great job of selecting components that work well together, creating a very drivable car. Great low end torque. Smaller turbo and higher compression greatly increases low speed drive-ability.

HE, that was an inside joke between Erik and me. On his turbo FFR cobra the internet people all said his turbo was too small, only made 575 RWHP and 689 RWTQ at 10 psi...Yeah, way too small and not enough HP for a 2400 lb car

[Frank818]

2400/689 = 3.48lbs/HP
Apply that to the 1900lbs 818 and that's 545wtq. I don't want that, the low and mid will suck! lolll

[HelluvaEngineer]

HE, that was an inside joke between Erik and me. On his turbo FFR cobra the internet people all said his turbo was too small, only made 575 RWHP and 689 RWTQ at 10 psi...Yeah, way too small and not enough HP for a 2400 lb car

That's Funny!

[shinn497]

Is there a way of actually measuring the cylinder pressure?

[Wayne Presley]

Yes, it takes some very specialized equipment, most of the time it is calculated by physics equations.

[CHOTIS BILL]

If you are interested in the formulas Google BMEP.

Bill Lomenick

[Wayne Presley]

Well I did a little work on the car today, pulled the 2.0L and stuck in the EZ30 six cylinder. Started at 10 and had the six in by lunch. Started on the wiring and cooling system.

[skullandbones]

OMG. Are you going to dyno this thing? Why not?!? I am guessing the 2.0 goes back in again. I don't care, it's fun watching all the action. WEK.

[Wayne Presley]

The six is staying in the car, sounds too beautiful to not have

[Silvertop]

The six is staying in the car, sounds too beautiful to not have

I have cylinder envy!!

[skullandbones]

So is this phase one? I can't see you running without a turbo for long. So that would mean some build up for more revs and hp. Just a little turbo wouldn't hurt! WEK.