who will be the first to try putting the sti 6 speed tran in?

[Frank818]

Ill have to check but I think the 6th speed is shorter than a wrx 5th.

Ugh, I'd find that pretty odd but if that's the way they did it, can't change it unless you change the ratios yourself.

[StatGSR]

without actually checking, i am pretty sure the gearing on the 6 speed is shorter than the 5 speed in every way (even in top gear). keep in mind, i think the 6speed will be too short for an 818 (not an STI) in a road race situation. The reason i think this is because of the torque multiplication of shorter gears, the major reduction in weight, and the potential loss in traction from going from 4 to 2wd. I am pretty confident it will A, have traction issues due to the increased torque (relative to a 5spd) and the loss of 4wd, or B, grip and take of like a rocket making you shift every second or so, which could actually result in slower times because of all the additional shift changes per lap.

The art of selecting gearing can be extremely personal and its also very different if your car depending on the cars weight and powerband, the key is the use the majority of your power band where max torque is achieved, so basically with a stock STI you are good any time after 3500 rpm up to redline. You want it short enough to get the quickest acceleration but not so short that your run out of gear.

Again, these are my personal opinions, and i am sharing them because not everybody on here is educated on topic of gearing and torque multiplication or even had any idea what the gearing on the 6spd was like, but had quickly learned that it was MOAR BETTERER, because of people on the interwebs...

[Frank818]

What about changing the FD on the 6sp to make all gears longer than the 5sp?

[StatGSR]

not sure what is out there ready for purchase but it would be technically possible.

[Frank818]

Maybe these guys could do something.

http://eng.kaps-transmissions.com/pr...nal-drive.html

[icky]

That's what I was thinking aswell. Could make the shaft solid and there would be the conversion to fwd and stronger too.

Edit: I already have a 6 speed in my fxt, so that's why I was going to use it. You had a really valid point about weight reduction and rwd so I thought I would add more. IMO 500 hp mountain driving with a 6 spd is a dream; the same set up in an 818, might be sketchy. Ugh, more thinking.

[Canadian818]

But if your buying a used 6spd and then changing gears, your spending more than you would for PPG gears of your choice for the 5spd.

[Frank818]

Maybe yeah.

I guess for me the choice between 5 or 6sp will depend on how I'll have my hands on a donor (what sort of donor too). One thing's for sure for me, if I keep my goal of 325-350rwhp/rwtq, I am too afraid to keep the 5sp stock, I need more strength first. The "better" gear ratios come as a 2nd requirement.

[icky]

Ppg syncro set is good to 400 hp, dog box is more but I'm not going to drive one on the street.

[Frank818]

Isn't PPG Synchro the 6700 bucks upgrade?

[Xusia]

It's been said before: 5mt's are cheap. I can break & replace many of them before reaching the cost of a PPG gear set.

Personally, it's all too much theory for me. I plan to use the 5mt that came with my donor and see how that works. If I don't like the ratios, I'll change them No sense solving a problem before it exists though...

[Frank818]

True. I have plenty of time to see many people drive with their 5sp (or brake them, we'll see).

And what has been said about the max potential rhp/rtq the stock 5sp could support? It think I read that 300bhp is harder on an AWD tranny than it is on a RWD tranny. I also think I read that about 300-330abhp/atq may be the max safest point for the stock 5sp. That would drive to what number if RWD?

[Xusia]

It's all theory at this point - no one knows for sure yet. And there are a lot of variables, including how YOU drive your car.

[Frank818]

Of course, any one could blow up a stock 5sp on a stock WRX.

[nkw8181]

So the sti is finally set to go to auction. What is a "good deal" for a salvaged title one? For that matter what are people getting there donor 06-07 wrx's for? On thanks for all the useful info everybody. Always learning :-)

Nolan

[Xusia]

From what I saw on Copart, STi's went for no less than $6k - and that was for a seriously damaged car. I saw some sell for over $10k (and yes, that is wrecked). That's one of the reasons I decided not to bother!

[Wayne Presley]

95% of the STI's on copart and IAAI go for over $10K, I saw a side hit one with 75K miles go over $14K...just saying

[Mechie3]

Take a part and it sells for $X dollars. If Subaru puts "STI" on the same part, people pay 1.5x as much for the same thing.

[nkw8181]

Wow! Well I won't spend that. It may make the decision easier if they go for that much. I'll know by next wed if I have an sti donor. I'm going to go take a look at it next week. It is a front end hit and everything forward of the motor is gone but from what I can tell by pics the engine looks untouched. I'm hoping that since it isn't advertised as running I can pick it up for less. But 10k for a wrecked def would not make since for me. If that is the casw I'll just get a wrx, 5speed, and wheel adapters if I want to run my enkei's or buy new wheels.

Nolan

The joys of a custom car. So may options and if you don't have enough you can just find more!

[Xusia]

Be careful. Donors with front end hits can have damage that can't be seen right away: Cracked heads, bent cams, timing components, etc. If it doesn't run, I'd think carefully about the price and potential risk.

[longislandwrx]

95% of the STI's on copart and IAAI go for over $10K, I saw a side hit one with 75K miles go over $14K...just saying

So true, Don't buy an STi on copart... What people pay is madness, If you want an STi, get involved with your local Subaru forum. It's sad to say but they are always being sold for a loss, guys get in over their heads, need money for weddings, kids...
You can get cars with lots of extras for less than wrecked cars on copart.

here's one near me...

http://www.longislandsubaruclub.com/...S-2004-WRB-STi

higher mileage but NOT wrecked well maintained and comes with probably $4500 in parts

And that's not even a great deal, its just the first local one I found in 30 seconds.

[Ethan818]

Isn't PPG Synchro the 6700 bucks upgrade?

One tip I have is to keep an eye on the NASIOC classifieds forum. PPG gearset's seem to pop up every month or so... they sell fast but it seems like the going price for a lightly used PPG gearset is well under half of the cost for a new set. I picked up a used PPG helical dog box assembled by Andrewtech, awhile ago for about the price of converting to a six speed.

Here's an example: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2524200

[StatGSR]

Isn't PPG Synchro the 6700 bucks upgrade?

even strait from PPGs site the cost is only $4300+ship for a 1-4 set either strait cut or helical. US vendors may even be able to get better pricing...er maybe not, http://www.rallispec.com/gea_syn_ppg-su5hs.html

[Grintch]

I have an '04 STi, so I am watching with great interest to see if the STi parts can be made to work. The STi gearing is slightly shorter overall 0.756 6th vs, 0.738 5th.

The WRX front wheel bearings have had issues with heavy track use, so use of '05+ STi uprights could be a good invetment for serious track cars. But they are a bit different, so some modification will be needed to use them (another advanatage is you can switch to the much more common 5x114 bolt pattern).

[D K]

But they are a bit different

How exactly?

Been after this very info myself...

[icky]

The knuckle, where the strut attaches is thicker and I believe the top hole is also higher. So you can get it machined to work but ffr may have already accounted for this with their upper control arm, there are two shims that are tacked on the inside that can be easily removed. Just need the measurements or to know someone else has done it on a prototype.

[07FIREBLADE]

The six speed is already in guys. According to Dave's last update.

[nkw8181]

Just saw that in the email flyer!

[Racebrewer]

Anybody know what is involved with getting it to work?

Simple as the WRX 5 speed?

John

[D K]

6 speed is much more difficult because there are gears in the tail housing the housing cant be removed like on the 5 speed.

[D K]

The knuckle, where the strut attaches is thicker and I believe the top hole is also higher. So you can get it machined to work but ffr may have already accounted for this with their upper control arm,

Are you referring to the uca or the knuckle adapter?
If its nly a small difference in width, then its possible for FFR to build another adapter that fits the STI knuckle?

[icky]

Are you referring to the uca or the knuckle adapter?
If its nly a small difference in width, then its possible for FFR to build another adapter that fits the STI knuckle?

The oem sti knuckle is different. FFR "possibly" accounted for this in ffr's knuckle adapter, I won't have one for a year, so I can't test it or show you. I'm sure someone will show picks when they figure it out. 30+ chassis and no one has brembos or 5 x 114? Kinda hard to believe, they're just teasing us.

[DruOdil]

FFR tech and anyone else. I can get a 6 speed for a great price. Is there going to be a FFR 6 speed option?
Dru

[Xusia]

I'd call them. No telling when they'll have a free moment to check here and respond.

[nkw8181]

On the web site, last time I checked, it was in the list of in work.

[JeromeS13]

On the web site, last time I checked, it was in the list of in work.

Where is this "web site" you speak of?

[metalmaker12]

FFR has it in the R so they are working on something, call them, last time I was there I was taking to them about it.

[JeromeS13]

At SEMA (November 8th), they told me that they were "two months out" with the parts being available.

[apexanimal]

i know issues like fitment, and locking it into fwd are still on the table...

but in the meantime:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1201152
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1412230

[Kurk818]

I have an STI that i purchased as a donor so ive really been watching this topic closely. I received word today from FFR that the 2WD coupler has been engineered and should be delivered to FFR shortly. Cables, reverse lockout, shift and shifter cable brackets have still not been developed. Im thinking those may be the easiest part to fab up myself any how.