Xusia's Build Thread - Building an 818S for Dummies

[Xusia]

It's been a while since I posted in my own build thread, so I guess I'm overdue for an update. FTW (the local tuning shop working on my engine), finished with my engine, so I wanted to get that installed in the frame. Mostly because I didn't really have another place to store it! To make a long story short, logistics were an issue and the best solution was to get to the roller stage, so spent what little time I had doing that. I will have to go back and take of some things I skipped (like the alum panels).

Here's a pic of the engine going in (a lot of stuff is not attached), and another of the engine sitting in the frame:
IMAG0591.jpgIMAG0590.jpg

I think the engine came out looking very good. I'm very pleased with the results and time & care FTW put into it! Details of the engine work are in my next post, but the high level summary is that I extended the rev limit to 8000 (stock is 7000), did work/mods to help the engine rev more quickly and flow better, and enhance reliability. My emphasis wasn't on outright power, but rather focused on increasing both performance and reliability. For instance, an engine that revs more quickly will accelerate more quickly. Extending the rev limit does several things:

• An extra 1000 RPM means more time in gear. More time in gear means less time shifting.
• Shifting at 8000 RPM (as opposed to 7000), puts you higher in the RPM range in the next gear than you would have been otherwise. This means more boost and more HP available.
• Greater RPM range makes all the gears more useful by providing a greater range of use and more flexibility in regards to gear selection.

This all translates to faster 0-60 & 1/4 mile times (or lap times, if that's your thing).

I'm also in the middle of a conundrum, which I will post separately from my build thread. I would appreciate the perspectives of those knowledgeable.

I have more videos, but I'm a bit behind on posting them. Hopefully soon!

Tool Review: Channellock Snap Ring Pliers
Verdict: Awesome!! They change from push to pull with the flick of a lever, and come with multiple ends. Look no further than these!

[Xusia]

After tearing into the engine a bit, a couple items that needed attention became apparent:

• Burnt exhaust valves
• Broken camshaft gear

The need to address those lead me down a road I hadn't really intended to go (or at least, didn't intend to go as far as I did), but as the saying goes, "as long as you're in there..."

We started with all the normal engine maintenance stuff:

• New Timing Belt, Pulleys, Tensioner, & Water Pump
• Spark Plugs (NKG Iridium)
• Valve Lash Adjustment (which is where we found the burnt valves and broken camshaft gear)
• New Clutch (OEM Exidy)

Since we now needed to pull the heads, I went a bit overboard:

• GSC Power Division 1mm Larger Intake & Exhaust Valves
• Machined existing Cylinder Heads
• Brian Crower Single Spring/Titanium Retainer Kit

And I also did all the "typical" performance mods:

• Perrin Turbo Inlet
• Grimmspeed Phenolic Spacers
• TGV Delete
• Grimmspeed Crosspipe

And a few I'd consider perhaps a tad more than typical, but certainly recognized as valuable:

• ACT Lightweight Flywheel
• Manifold Porting
• 11mm STi Oil Pump
• Perrin Crank Pulley
• Killer B Oil Pickup & windage tray

My car already has:

• VF39 Turbo
• Modded stock injectors
• Walbro fuel pump
• Grimspeed EBCS
• Perrin Intake
• Upgraded (I forget the brand) up-pipe
• Bellmouth down-pipe

And finally, lest the transmission feel left out:

• Complete 2009 gearset (stronger, and slightly taller first-third gears)
• OBX LSD (with bolt/washer upgrade)

I spent far more money than I budgeted or wanted to, BUT I think I'm going to be very happy with the results (and at the end of the day, I'd likely be more bothered that I didn't do something "right").

FTW is estimating ~330hp at the wheels, but performance should be a bit better than that HP would suggest. The engine should also be bullet proof reliable - which is a big deal for me (for those that are just tuning in, mine will be a daily driver).

EDIT: Forget to mention the intake valves & turbo!

[wleehendrick]

Looks like you went down that 'slippery slope'... but it looks great!

[Goldwing]

Looks beautiful. I like the idea of taller 1-3 gears.

[longislandwrx]

It will be easy to add cams down the road if you decide to go that route.

What turbo are you running, i'm sure you mentioned it prior, but not in your last post.

who did the engine work?

[Frank818]

I like that blue. Put some more.

[Xusia]

I seriously considered cams, but one of my goals/streategies (that I didn't mention) was quick sppol, and came to the conclusion cams would ultimately affect that goal negatively. I also didn't feel I really needed more power, or that I needed to move the available power around the curve. So I decided against them - for now at least.

I forgot to mention the turbo, so I'll edit that post. It's a VF39.

As for the blue, I like it to, and do plan some more - but it will be sparingly since it's a highlight color.

[doolots]

This car looks awesome! I am semi local to you up in Portland and hope to join the list here really soon.

If you need any Subaru parts let me know as i deal in them quiet a bit and am a dealer.I have 2 complete wrx's that I will be making into complete donors here soon.

I am transferring from building lots of Honda s2000's over to one of these 818s. I cannot wait!

[Xusia]

Sweet! If you find yourself down South, feel free to stop by.

[grayghost]

Xusia, read your engine thread, I am trying to do much of what you did without the $ and opening the engine. Mine will be a DD with side trips to the local autocross events.
RLM

[Xusia]

Some more bling:
IMAG0621.jpg IMAG0622.jpg

I'm also working on the front firewall and have officially decided drilling is my LEAST favorite activity. I pulled a couple noob maneuvers (What did I expect? After all, I am a noob at this!), and drilled holes in the alum where I couldn't possibly drill a hole in the frame (because I couldn't get a drill into proper position). Oh well. I'll make do. I'm getting better at taking these kinds of things in stride.

[Rasmus]

drilled holes in the alum where I couldn't possibly drill a hole in the frame (because I couldn't get a drill into proper position). Oh well. I'll make do.

Just fill the hole with a short grip rivet and no one will ever know it's just for decoration.

[Canadian818]

Or a dab of black silicone

[Mechie3]

and drilled holes in the alum where I couldn't possibly drill a hole in the frame

I did this twice. I stopped drilling the aluminum and frame separately after the second one. Instead, I marked the holes I liked, clamped the aluminum, drilled one hole and cleco'd it. I then drilled all the rest with the aluminum on the frame. After I had 3 cleco's I removed the clamp. If I couldn't get a drill into position, the aluminum didn't get drilled so I had no extra holes.

[Rasmus]

I did this twice. I stopped drilling the aluminum and frame separately after the second one. Instead, I marked the holes I liked, clamped the aluminum, drilled one hole and cleco'd it. I then drilled all the rest with the aluminum on the frame. After I had 3 cleco's I removed the clamp. If I couldn't get a drill into position, the aluminum didn't get drilled so I had no extra holes.

Mentally filing this one away for my build. Great tip Mechie. Its neat how such a small change in process or method and can make for easy work.

[Xusia]

That is a good suggestion! It's a bit late for me, but hopefully it saves others' some headaches.

[MichaelN]

Xusia, your transmission looks beautiful! How did you get it cleaned up so nice? Really thorough cleaning? Did you paint it?

Thanks for taking to time to document your build. It's very educational for novices such as myself.

[RM1SepEx]

I did this twice. I stopped drilling the aluminum and frame separately after the second one. Instead, I marked the holes I liked, clamped the aluminum, drilled one hole and cleco'd it. I then drilled all the rest with the aluminum on the frame. After I had 3 cleco's I removed the clamp. If I couldn't get a drill into position, the aluminum didn't get drilled so I had no extra holes.

If you try to follow the manual you get incorrect holes on the first panel! I clamped and cleco the panel and drill in place as well. You NEED a 90 degree drill, I use air powered for this task. I did miss an issue in one spot and drilled through into a weld, broke off a drill. Watch for that too... No reason to put a rivet where you can't get the hand rivet tool in as well.

[Xusia]

Xusia, your transmission looks beautiful! How did you get it cleaned up so nice? Really thorough cleaning? Did you paint it?

Thanks for taking to time to document your build. It's very educational for novices such as myself.

Hi Michael. Thanks for the compliment! I had the shop that did my engine work clean it up and paint it, but the paint is designed to look like the original metal color. Up close you can tell it's painted (which isn't a bad thing IMO), but in photos or from a distance I think it looks like really clean raw metal.

[Goldwing]

You're painting things I would never have thought of painting. The brake master above looks very nice. It's going to look sweet when finished.

[longislandwrx]

Even with a 90 deg drill I still had issues with two holes I drilled. cant fit the rivet gun. I though about just gluing the rivet in place, but I just left it empty.

[michael everson]

The masters look great. Too bad they will never be seen once the windshield surround is in place.
Mike

[Canadian818]

The masters look great. Too bad they will never be seen once the windshield surround is in place.
Mike

Shameless But very true

[Xusia]

I know they won't be seen (unless someone really gets in there). But I'll know the're painted and look nice!

[Xusia]

I haven't done a lot of actual work, but I've spent a fair amount of time working on some ideas and solutions to some challenges, so I thought I'd share. It's turned out to be quite the novel. For those who's religion is TL;DR, you might want to read the sections on the gas tank and gas pedal!

Actual Work
I finished drilling the front firewall panels. <-- <in my best smartie-pants voice> Wow! Just look at all I've done!!! And I made the decision to paint them black. Currently they are white from the acoustic and thermal insulating paint. I was going to leave them white, but it's already picking up all kinds of dirt. I'm not bit on cleaning, and I'm not big on dirty stuff, so black they will be.

Oh, and I marked the frame locations on the interior alum panels (but I haven't yet removed them from the chassis).

Ideas, Challenges, & Solutions (where I have them)

• Seats & Seating
  I started a thread on this, so I won't report the details here. In short, I am going with the stock seats, but will make custom mounting brackets. I found these provide the most comfortable seating position and have the adjustability and features I want. My head is slightly above the roll bar, which means no driver training or high performance driving events for me - at least for now. I have some options for the future, such as swapping to a race seat for the day (part of the reason I'm making my own seat mounting brackets), or making a taller roll bar (I need to know more about the soft top first).
• Sway Bar
  I won't be using a sway bar. I bought the Prothane mounts, but it still seemed like a kluge to me. Getting just the right position so it didn't hit the spring or the upright was difficult, and I wasn't confident it would stay perfectly. It wasn't really in the way of the gas tank, but not having it there leaves that area open to other stuff. As I've become more educated on this topic, I've started to see the sway bar as a compromise. On a car with so little body roll already, it really seems not worth doing. If I find the rear end too swap happy, I'll just use a front spring with a more appropriate spring rate.
• Gas Tank Update
  I've made some prototypes out of cardboard and pretty much have the design finalized (No pics yet - you'll have to wait!). The shape is rather odd, so I won't attempt to describe it (you'll have to wait for pictures). It will be 10" - 12" high as measured from the top of the "V" frame rails on either side of the battery tray. The shape of the tank allows space for the radiator hoses, steering column & joint, etc. Brake and clutch lines that cross from the driver's side to the passenger side would need to do so higher up - at the level of the master cylinders or just below.
  
  Capacity at the 10" height would be approximately 11 gallons. at 12" high capacity would be approximately 13.25 gallons. These assume no sway bar, which could be accommodated but would reduce capacity. By adding a smaller and slightly differently shaped section on top, capacity could be increased to almost 19 gallons without a sway bar, and 17 gallons with a sway bar. So as you can see, there is plenty of room here! (though adding a top section really fills up this space) The reason for the different shape on the top section is to allow space for the clutch master cylinder and brake line routing.
  
  Installation will involve cutting out the battery tray and the 2 "V" shaped frame rails on either side of the battery tray, to accommodate installing the gas tank from underneath. This approach gets around a lot of issues associated with installing it from above, and allows for easy removal later if needed (because there is nothing on the bottom to interfere with). The bottom of the gas tank will incorporate those "V" frame rails (and possibly some others), and will mount very solidly to the chassis. While those "V" frame rails won't be welded to the rest of the chassis, the addition of a solid sheet of steel (the bottom of the gas tank), and plenty of hardware mounting these to the frame, should mean rigidity in this area won't suffer.
  
  For filling, I plan to use the FFR supplied gas cap on the side of the passenger side front fender, above the back of the wheel well. I expect this will involve a custom tube, but it will be a mostly straight shot, so it won't be complicated.
  
  I'm really excited about this and can't wait to show off the final solution. I will be working on this as soon as the weather gets to the point I can trailer my chassis to my In-Law's house. So I will hopefully have something tangible soon for anyone who is interested in replicating this.
• Gas Pedal
  I was playing with the gas pedal from my 2003 donor (so mechanical throttle) looking for a solution that didn't involve running the cable out through the firewall and back in by the center tunnel (because the gas tank will be there). In so doing, I noticed the very large amount of travel it had (~5", measured at the point where the cable attaches, therefore being representative of potential cable travel) , and it struck me as curious. As I started investigating, it become obvious that not all the available travel of the pedal is actually used. The engine only requires about 2" of cable travel to go from fully closed to fully open throttle. As a side note, the space under the dash accommodates ~3" of travel. You might be wondering where this is going...
  
  Well in motorcycling, it's common to change the ratio of grip twist to throttle response. Motorcycle manufacturers commonly make the twist very long - presumably for safety - more travel means easier throttle modulation, more precise control, and it makes it harder to get to full throttle so power output (because there is a limit to how far you can twist a handgrip while riding) is somewhat tamed. So it's common to replace the grip insert with one that uses less travel to go from fully closed to fully open. This it inspired a thought: Why not change the ratio of gas pedal travel to throttle cable travel/response in my 818!
  
  In the case of the 818, I'd be looking to increase the pedal travel relative to the cable travel, using all the available 3" of pedal travel (limited by the space in which it's mounted) to facilitate the required 2" of cable travel. Just as a longer grip twist on a motorcycle allows for more precise control, it should do the same in the 818.
  
  Why? First, when is more precise control bad?? Also, I've driven high HP cars and found them a bit awkward around town. At some point in the pedal travel, they really just want to GO! Having more travel available seems like it would help. I haven't really come up with a down side. Some might think the additional travel may be awkward, but since it's at the foot I just don't think so. And of course, any system I design to achieve this would be adjustable so I could easily undo it.
  
  Brilliance or insanity? You tell me!
• Brake Master Cylinder Mounting
  I don't like the solution FFR came up with for mounting the brake master cylinder, though I think I understand why they did it that way. The semi-perfectionist in me is after a more elegant solution. I like the solution Mike Everson came up with, but I have an idea I'm going to try fabbing up and see how I like. I'll go with whichever I like better.
• Intercooler
  I finally faced the fact that I just don't have a plan. Heck, I don't even have any clever ideas in this area (that are worth doing). So I bought Wayne's (VCP) AWIC (air-to-water intercooler) with optional blow off valve. One less thing to worry about! Thanks Wayne!
• Shifter
  Front mounted gas tank means shifter cables must go rearward. In looking at the FFR supplied shifter, converting it was more trouble than it was worth to me. So I bought the K-Tuned shifter from Wayne (VCP). Wayne to the rescue again!
• ABS, Mounting, & Proportioning Valve
  Most of this is summary from another post.
  
  I'm want to use ABS, and I plan to mount the ABS control unit on top of my [front mounted] gas tank. My thought is gas tank could act somewhat as a dampener, and the proximity of the master cylinder would minimize hard line routing. I've decided against using proportioning valves, for several reasons: 1)They need to be installed after the ABS control unit, which means I would need 2 and I currently only have 1. Yeah, I could buy another, so this isn't a major reason, just a contributor. 2)Feedback has been that the brakes are pretty well balanced as is. 3)With the gas tank up front, my weight distribution will be closer to 50/50 and therefore require less potential rearward shift in brake bias. 4)I'd rather err on the side of caution, and have too much front brake bias than have too much rear brake bias. And 5)If it does turn out I have too much front brake bias, it will only matter in panic stops (I'm not racing), and I'm fine with letting the ABS deal with that.

EDIT: I couldn't add what I wanted (post too long), so added another post below!

[Rasmus]

[*]Sway Bar
I won't be using a sway bar.

You don't even know how much I like this. I like the fact that you looked into what a sway bar does and the compromises you give and get to run one. I love that you took the time to understand it. My simplified goal in car suspension set up is plagiarized from others smarter but, "Get the front to stick as much as you possibly can. Tune the rear to the front."

[*]Gas Pedal
I was playing with the gas pedal from my 2003 donor...
Brilliance or insanity? You tell me!

From a man who loves AutoX: Brilliant. More precision control of the throttle makes a smoother drive. Smooth is fast. Smooth is top PAX. Jerking a car around an AutoX course relegates you to a life at mid-pack.

[AZPete]

I LOVE this place for the creativity, ingenuity and the smarts to question/rethink/redesign everything! It's always thought-provoking . . . and a great place to suck up time at work!

[Xusia]

Rasmus, thanks! I try to learn as much as I can. And - by the way - YOU help a lot with this!

Pete, what a great compliment! Thank you very much.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Hey Xusia
All great Ideas. Here is some of what I doing on the gas car.
1. Radiator and Intercooler stacked in back like sixstar.
2. Gas tank in front 14"wide x 18"long 12" high. 11 gallons.
3. reduce total transmission length by 7 inches. bar coming out of side of transmission for shifting.
4. Subaru shifter connected to transmission with u-joint shaft.
5. no sway bar.
6. ABS mounted inside cockpit on top of center tunnel at front fire wall.
7. storage area under front hood.
8. Better crash protection steel added front and back.
9. nascar style side impact foam in sides of car and doors.
10. move pedal box forward
11. move steering column forward


I need to stop designing and start producing.
Bob

[Xusia]

Hey Bob, I'll be very interested in your shortening of the transmission. Please document! Also, you made me realize I forgot some things, so I edited my post. I feel you on the "start producing!"

[Xusia]

The stuff I forgot:

• Rear Crash Protection
  I have 2 goals here:
  1. Prevent larger vehicles from running up and over the engine & transmission (that could end badly). I'm thinking something like what Six Star Cars did for their rear intercooler mount. They didn't make their for strength, but I plan to. I would make it removable to facilitate easy engine removal.
  2. Protect the transmission shifting mechanism. For this, I'm talking about crashes that would otherwise leave the car operational. If a crash is bad enough to seriously damage the car, I'm not expecting whatever I put in place to save the shift mechanism or the transmission. I'm thinking either something like a guard plate attached to the transmission itself, perhaps even welded to the cover plate, or something that attaches to the crash bar mentioned above and the transmission support below. I kinda like the guard plate idea because it's attached to the transmission and therefore doesn't have to be made removable. It's also very simple. Only downside is that it leave crash absorption to the engine mounts (and the crash bar mentioned above). We'll have to see when I get there.
• Rear Trunk
  I plan to build a removable bin (like a camping cooler, but without the insulation), and use the crash bar I plan to add as a perimeter for longitudinal and lateral support. I would build some flat surfaces in various places for the bottom to rest on for weight support. It would bolt in to ensure it's secure. The reason for making it removable is for flexibility of the space and so that if I want to run light for whatever reason, I can.
  
  Not sure if it will have it's own lid or if I'll rely on the body trunk lid. I like the idea of making it fully enclosed - I could make it lockable and not worry so much about a body trunk lid lock. Lots of possibilities.
  
  Since my gas tank will be up front, there will also be a fair amount of storage behind the seats.
• Steel Floor
  I just really want some more protection under my butt. I've also noticed the floor under the foot area bends a bit under weight. I like protection and solid feel more than I like a light car, so I'm planning on welding a steel plate (or 2, if that's what it takes) under whole cockpit. This would involve cutting out the existing floors in the foot area and behind the seats, and welding on some slightly thicker steel. It will also make it hella water proof!
  
  As a side note, I plan to take the alum that is intended to be used under the seats and make it into the rear firewall. Because I can mount it from the inside, I can make it a solid piece, and that under seat piece is basically the correct size as is. SCORE! I plan to make it removeable for easy servicing of the timing set (or anything else), and of course I'll have to accommodate wiring, shifter cables, and throttle cables, but that seems like it should be easy. The only thing I'm still thinking about is how to adequately insulate this wall. I really don't want the sound of the engine drowning out music or conversation. (Blasphemy, I know!!!)
• Spray Foam
  I plan to use spray foam on the front firewall, between the frame rails, for added NVH insulation. It should provide a very solid feel with little weight.
  
  Like Bob, I also plan to use it in the doors. Both for added crash protection, and to provide a solid feel to the door.
  
  And I'm not talking about that crud that comes in a can. I'm talking about real spray foam that uses a proper sprayer, mixing the chemicals as you spray. Check out http://www.sprayfoamkit.com/products/spray-foam-kits

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Hi Xusia
I am still designing. To cold to work in the barn.
I forgot one.
I am using 2 triangular sheets of aluminum to make a sealed box for the ECU and some of the relays. Picture below.
Bob

ebox.jpg

[Santiago]

No sway bar, thank you very much. I'm glad to see more folks planning to ditch that. I forget who kept drilling it into my head that "if you have a sway bar, you don't really have an independent suspension." Get the spring rates right through design/tuning, carry on.

And Bob, I think everyone is going to be very interested in seeing what you come up with to shorten the trans.

Best,
-j

[Goldwing]

I'm with you on the blasphemous noise reduction. The jet engines make enough noise at work, I prefer my leisure activities to be quieter. I have used a little spray foam in the frame pieces (squirted after drilling the rivet holes) to reduce noise transmission from the engine bay forward. Not sure how much that will do, but usually in this department every little step helps. As an open roadster, it might seem silly, but I will have a top eventually. That's when those efforts will pay off. I'll paint the aluminum panels with sound deadening as well like you mentioned above. Mine is already dark, like a charcoal color. I'll watch your ideas in this department.

[mrprgrmr]

Xusia, I do remember twisting the throttle until my wrist was in an unnatural position to get to full throttle on my motorcycles. I just thought it was me! Please post pics if you figure out how to use the full gas pedal travel. I'm seriously interested in this mod. It seems like it might make driving the 818 in traffic more enjoyable. Also, when someone unfamiliar with the vehicle asks to drive it, it would be less worry. It's easy to say "yes, it's fast and no you can't drive it" to most people, but there are a few folks I just couldn't decline (my family).

[ehansen007]

You don't even know how much I like this. I like the fact that you looked into what a sway bar does and the compromises you give and get to run one. I love that you took the time to understand it. My simplified goal in car suspension set up is plagiarized from others smarter but, "Get the front to stick as much as you possibly can. Tune the rear to the front."


From a man who loves AutoX: Brilliant. More precision control of the throttle makes a smoother drive. Smooth is fast. Smooth is top PAX. Jerking a car around an AutoX course relegates you to a life at mid-pack.

Having autocrossed the 33 Hot Rod without a sway bar I can say I hardly missed it. But only because it was easy to change springs to compensate. But when I drove on the street with softer springs it rolled A LOT. If you're looking for the best of all worlds, then a sway bar isn't a bad idea; and it was was invented for a reason; to give maximum ride quality while still minimizing body roll. I don't think I will be running my sway bar because I have a huge battery box in the way!

[STiPWRD]

Hey Brian, have you thought about front end collisions and reinforcing your front mounted gas tank? I believe FFR designed the radiator supports to buckle in the event of a collision as to not transfer high loads and deform the main chassis (i.e. it's much easier to replace the radiator support than to straighten out the main chassis). Just hope your gas tank design isn't going to be in that crumple zone. Great creativity BTW.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

No sway bar, thank you very much. I'm glad to see more folks planning to ditch that. I forget who kept drilling it into my head that "if you have a sway bar, you don't really have an independent suspension." Get the spring rates right through design/tuning, carry on.

And Bob, I think everyone is going to be very interested in seeing what you come up with to shorten the trans.

Best,
-j

I'll just put something in my build thread
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showt...490#post142490

Bob

[Xusia]

Hey Brian, have you thought about front end collisions and reinforcing your front mounted gas tank? I believe FFR designed the radiator supports to buckle in the event of a collision as to not transfer high loads and deform the main chassis (i.e. it's much easier to replace the radiator support than to straighten out the main chassis). Just hope your gas tank design isn't going to be in that crumple zone. Great creativity BTW.

Thanks for the compliment! As for the gas tank, it's going where the battery is supposed to go, which is rearward of the radiator crumple zone. It will actually be behind what seems like a very strong section of the frame - almost directly underneath the forward most part of the windshield (about half forward of it, and half behind it). I hope this makes sense. I'll post some pics when I have a few more things ironed out. I definitely plan to "share the love" I just want to present something with more "wow" than I currently have! LOL

[Canadian818]

All this "no sway bar" talk is new to me, have I been living under a rock? From the few posts above this is what I've gathered;

Proper spring rates (probably higher) would negate the need for the sway bar.

Use of the sway bar allows for the use of softer springs which equals a smoother ride.

That about right?