0 to 60 mph – What should an 818 do?

[DodgyTim]

I’ve been playing with the online calculator for 0-60mph times, trying to estimate what a completed 818 will do. These are based on my 2006 2.5L turbo donor.

http://www.060calculator.com/

Sanity checking the calculator first with some known (tested) times and the results of the calculator.

Standard 2006 WRX
Manual transmission, AWD, flywheel power 169 kW (226hp), weight 1420 kg (3130 lb)
Tested time is 5.7 to 5.8 seconds, Calculator predicts 5.74 seconds, so that is good.

Sanity checking again, with a higher powered, lighter car – Say the Lotus Exige S
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 257 kW (345hp), weight 1176 kg (2592 lb)
Manufacturer claimed time is 3.8 seconds,
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/our-cars...specifications
Calculator predicts 3.79 seconds, so that is good too.

OK, one more, even more power, and much, much lighter, the BAC Mono,
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/bac/mono
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 209 kW (280hp), weight 538 kg (1186 lb) calculated from the 520hp/tone spec in the article
Manufacturer claimed time is 2.8 seconds for 0-62mph, Calculator predicts 2.52 seconds for 0-100kmh, so this one is a bit out, maybe traction limited?

Now for the 818 ……..

818 with standard 2006 WRX motor
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 169 kW (226hp), weight 900 kg (1984 lb) - (I think Erik’s ran 2090 lb with some extras) = 4.3 seconds

818 with “Stage 2” Tune and 2006 WRX motor
I picked this one because you’d have to try hard not to get this performance in a turbo 818, given we’ve got to mod the exhaust anyway….
Mods are 3” downpipe, K&N air filter in the standard airbox, plus a tune, adds 20 kW (27hp) at the flywheel,
http://www.mrtperformance.com.au/per...wrx-my-2006-07
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 189 kW (253hp), weight 900 kg (1984 lb) = 3.9 seconds

818 with “Stage 3” Tune and 2006 WRX motor
Mods are VF34 or VF39 turbo, 3” downpipe, STI TMIC, GM boost control solenoid, K&N air filter in the standard airbox, plus a tune, now 212 kW (284hp) at the flywheel, same source as above
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 212 kW (284hp), weight 900 kg (1984 lb) = 3.6 seconds

818 with “Stage 3 Race” Tune and 2006 WRX motor
Mods are VF34 or VF39 turbo, 3” downpipe, STI TMIC, GM boost control solenoid, Injen CAI, bigger fuel pump, plus a tune, now 288 wheel hp, so approx 340hp at the flywheel
http://www.xpttuning.com/index.php?m...products_id=18
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 340hp, weight 900 kg (1984 lb) = 3.2 seconds

What will it take for a sub 3 sec time?
375 flywheel hp and some really sticky tires!

[Somerset Subaru]

If it was in the realm of myself building one it would be 700+ whp on e85 . Car would be a shear rocket ship. I hope someone does this. Sleeved EJ257 Equal length header and a Precision 6466 on E85. It would be laggy but ridiculous when it came into boost. Rolling burnouts at 125mph FTW!


-Adam

[Pearldrummer7]

I’ve been playing with the online calculator for 0-60mph times, trying to estimate what a completed 818 will do. These are based on my 2006 2.5L turbo donor.

http://www.060calculator.com/

Sanity checking the calculator first with some known (tested) times and the results of the calculator.

Standard 2006 WRX
Manual transmission, AWD, flywheel power 169 kW (226hp), weight 1420 kg (3130 lb)
Tested time is 5.7 to 5.8 seconds, Calculator predicts 5.74 seconds, so that is good.

Sanity checking again, with a higher powered, lighter car – Say the Lotus Exige S
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 257 kW (345hp), weight 1176 kg (2592 lb)
Manufacturer claimed time is 3.8 seconds,
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/our-cars...specifications
Calculator predicts 3.79 seconds, so that is good too.

OK, one more, even more power, and much, much lighter, the BAC Mono,
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/bac/mono
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 209 kW (280hp), weight 538 kg (1186 lb) calculated from the 520hp/tone spec in the article
Manufacturer claimed time is 2.8 seconds for 0-62mph, Calculator predicts 2.52 seconds for 0-100kmh, so this one is a bit out, maybe traction limited?

Now for the 818 ……..

818 with standard 2006 WRX motor
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 169 kW (226hp), weight 900 kg (1984 lb) - (I think Erik’s ran 2090 lb with some extras) = 4.3 seconds

818 with “Stage 2” Tune and 2006 WRX motor
I picked this one because you’d have to try hard not to get this performance in a turbo 818, given we’ve got to mod the exhaust anyway….
Mods are 3” downpipe, K&N air filter in the standard airbox, plus a tune, adds 20 kW (27hp) at the flywheel,
http://www.mrtperformance.com.au/per...wrx-my-2006-07
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 189 kW (253hp), weight 900 kg (1984 lb) = 3.9 seconds

818 with “Stage 3” Tune and 2006 WRX motor
Mods are VF34 or VF39 turbo, 3” downpipe, STI TMIC, GM boost control solenoid, K&N air filter in the standard airbox, plus a tune, now 212 kW (284hp) at the flywheel, same source as above
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 212 kW (284hp), weight 900 kg (1984 lb) = 3.6 seconds

818 with “Stage 3 Race” Tune and 2006 WRX motor
Mods are VF34 or VF39 turbo, 3” downpipe, STI TMIC, GM boost control solenoid, Injen CAI, bigger fuel pump, plus a tune, now 288 wheel hp, so approx 340hp at the flywheel
http://www.xpttuning.com/index.php?m...products_id=18
Manual transmission, RWD, flywheel power 340hp, weight 900 kg (1984 lb) = 3.2 seconds

What will it take for a sub 3 sec time?
375 flywheel hp and some really sticky tires!

Cool calculation. It would be really interesting to see people's acceleration times. I bet you could get more than 288 wheel out of those mods, just based on what my WRX is doing with similar ones. Plus, reasonably, you could be sub 900kg with some decent mods (like less gas, only 1 seat, AL control arms, etc. etc.)

[DodgyTim]

The calculator proves weight is the enemy.....
Stage 3 times drop from 3.6 secs to 3.2 sec if you drop the 900kg to 818kg,
but no-one has built and 818kg 818 yet?

[Xusia]

Nice work Tim! This bodes very well for me. I'm anticipating ~330whp, and I'd like 0-60 to be under 3.5 seconds (traction control FTW!). Based on your calculations, that should be easily achievable.

[EODTech87]

The calculator proves weight is the enemy.....
Stage 3 times drop from 3.6 secs to 3.2 sec if you drop the 900kg to 818kg,
but no-one has built and 818kg 818 yet?

Who's going to drive it?

[DodgyTim]

Who's going to drive it?

do you mean include the drivers weight?

from the link
"Note: Since this calculator is based on statistics from listed figures, it's important that you enter the data it asks of you and not whp numbers or race-ready weight. I know it seems weird, but don't include the weight of the driver either."

[metalmaker12]

I have just around 275whp and will reach 300-330 with a dyno tune. I ran in the 4's late fall with my bell electronics g meter. I would say sub 4 secs if you can hook up. Lower numbers are possable, but more power will just spin more. Traction control would help, but with say a 2500 rpm 2nd gear launch you can get the same effect.

[EODTech87]

do you mean include the drivers weight?

from the link
"Note: Since this calculator is based on statistics from listed figures, it's important that you enter the data it asks of you and not whp numbers or race-ready weight. I know it seems weird, but don't include the weight of the driver either."

I stand corrected, I didn't actually go into the calculator so I didn't see that.

[icky]

What will it take for a sub 3 sec time?
375 flywheel hp and some really sticky tires!

An auto would help, too.

[Goldwing]

I think tire grip will be a big factor in achieving these numbers. It'll be fun to see it become reality though.

[DodgyTim]

I doubt we'll see the lower numbers on public roads, it will take a prepared surface (strip)

but then with anti-lag and traction compound, who knows?

[Kalstar]

It is a pretty interesting tool.

I just put my GTM into that 0-60 calculator you posted and it says 3.147sec, on several occasions I have seen 3.2sec 0-60 on the clock (uses the GPS as well as OBD and the VSS) very accurate. The JVC head unit allows me to run many Internet based timed programs in real time. I prefer pocketdyno myself but there are many more.

I am building my 818 (already have the kit and donor is striped) with a fairly stock 02 WRX, other then a up/down pipe combo and a tune I will be around 275 crank. That will be plenty for ear to ear grins. In fact I think it might be more enjoyable in some cases then the GTM.

[Plebeian]

What will it take for a sub 3 sec time?
375 flywheel hp and some really sticky tires![/QUOTE]

I think it will take more power than that, especially on the street. Realistically, the 818 is about 10% lighter than the Roadster. So it's not too difficult to extrapolate times based on the many Roadsters that are out there. Cheers.

[Rasmus]

The calculator proves weight is the enemy.....
Stage 3 times drop from 3.6 secs to 3.2 sec if you drop the 900kg to 818kg,

Weight is the enemy of so many things:
Want to accelerate faster? Remove mass.
Want to brake shorter? Remove mass.
Want to corner quicker? Remove mass.
Want overall faster lap times? Remove mass.
Want a lighter wallet? Install lightweight parts.

[Canadian818]

Want a lighter wallet? Install lightweight parts.

I enjoyed that

[EricScottZehnder]

I am building my 818 (already have the kit and donor is striped) with a fairly stock 02 WRX, other then a up/down pipe combo and a tune I will be around 275 crank.

I've seen Wayne's dyno runs and he's getting around 240hp at the wheels and I believe that's with a newer, more powerful WRX engine with several mods.

[DodgyTim]

The other factor for the 0-60 time is gearing
With my BFG G-Force Rivals (255R17's) I have to run out to 6950rpm in second gear to hit 60 mph
With the standard turbo it will be well out of breath by then
Stage 2.png
so that means 2 changes, or starting in second, or a bigger turbo......
Oh well, its bigger turbo time!
Stage 3.png

[Scargo]

If I make 420hp and 2,100 pounds, without me, I think I can make the cut for ST1 and 5.5:1 P/W ratio. I think Dot tires would be more than comparable to max traction of a streetable car so that would put me at 2.8 seconds. So much for a cup holder in the car.
Realistically, I think I'll start with less HP. I'm used to and very comfortable with my STi's 3.7 seconds, 0-60. Only once did I light them up so to speak. I am going to be looking for in excess of 400 FPT by 4,000 RPM.

[Kalstar]

I've seen Wayne's dyno runs and he's getting around 240hp at the wheels and I believe that's with a newer, more powerful WRX engine with several mods.

275 crank is about 233 wheel hp. Stock is aprox 227 crank, up and down pipe is worth about 30-35 Hp and a dyno tune is about 15% gain on top of base line.

[metalmaker12]

Right now I am running a moderate tune @14- 16psi with the fuel curve on the richer side. This is an average base map for my jdm version 8 Ej207 vf37 twin scroll mill. Stock is 14 psi on this engine and makes 296hp 290 ftlbs. On my previous wrx with the same engine made just around 255 whp @14 and 275-278 whp @16. At 20-21psi and tune dialied in tight, it should make 310-320 on a wrx, so 320-330 plus, but I might not need that power and dial it back anyway. I truely think a low 3 sec 0-60 is possable, but traction is the issue, not lite weight. The car at 2k is plenty lite with 300 ish whp, and should reach 60 under 4. The advantage I have to many of the built cars is I can rev to 8,600. So if I shift at like 8k I can get about 10-12mph more in each gear. This will get me pretty close to a 3.2-3.5 0-60 if I hook up. I could reserve the boost onset as a cheep traction control, but what fun is that.

[longislandwrx]

Metal are you running the jdm ecu? or one from an sti?






Back to the subject...


Anything under 3.5 is insanity, and I think achievable. That being said, this isn't a drag car, the 3rd gear cloverleaf to highway pull is going to be the fun part.

[wleehendrick]

That being said, this isn't a drag car, the 3rd gear cloverleaf to highway pull is going to be the fun part.

With the unknown reliability of all the torque going through the front diff, I personally am not going to be doing m/any 1st gear launches... it'll be quick enough rolling on the throttle after a smooth clutch engagement.

And I agree... it's all about the twisties... can't wait to take it up the South Grade of Palomar Mountain, just in my 'back-yard':



Palomar.jpg

[flynntuna]

With the unknown reliability of all the torque going through the front diff, I personally am not going to be doing m/any 1st gear launches... it'll be quick enough rolling on the throttle after a smooth clutch engagement.

And I agree... it's all about the twisties... can't wait to take it up the South Grade of Palomar Mountain, just in my 'back-yard':



Palomar.jpg

Be sure to watch out for the deer and coyotes! My son was driving back from a drive to Julian when a pack of coyotes ran across the road in front of his Audi that he just finished rebuilding the engine on. That coyote took out the bumper, IC and radiator and kept on running. Needless to say he was a bit PO'ed.

[wleehendrick]

Be sure to watch out for the deer and coyotes! My son was driving back from a drive to Julian when a pack of coyotes ran across the road in front of his Audi that he just finished rebuilding the engine on. That coyote took out the bumper, IC and radiator and kept on running. Needless to say he was a bit PO'ed.

That sucks... yeah, 818 vs. wildlife would not be pretty.

[Xusia]

<sigh> Now I have to design a cattle guard...

[longislandwrx]

This makes me wish I was back in Oregon... first stop would be cruising to Sunriver and hitting Paulina Lake Raceway, err Paulina Lake Rd.

Capture.JPG

map fails to show the 4200ft elevation change.

[wleehendrick]

This makes me wish I was back in Oregon... first stop would be cruising to Sunriver and hitting Paulina Lake Raceway, err Paulina Lake Rd.

map fails to show the 4200ft elevation change.

Nice! Palomar gains over 4000' as well. A few years ago it was the final stage in the tour of California, and with all the spectators on the road, ended up being the most highly attended sporting event in the US ever. Unfortunate'y, it's a pretty regular occurrence for a Marine from Camp Pendleton to go off on a brand new sport bike.

[Xusia]

This makes me wish I was back in Oregon... first stop would be cruising to Sunriver and hitting Paulina Lake Raceway, err Paulina Lake Rd.

Capture.JPG

map fails to show the 4200ft elevation change.

Just when I thought I knew about all the good roads around me. That's right close. I'll be giving that a go this summer!

Have you driven/ridden FR19 (Aufderheide)?

[longislandwrx]

Sent a PM

[Wayne Presley]

With the unknown reliability of all the torque going through the front diff, I personally am not going to be doing m/any 1st gear launches... it'll be quick enough rolling on the throttle after a smooth clutch engagement.

And I agree... it's all about the twisties... can't wait to take it up the South Grade of Palomar Mountain, just in my 'back-yard':



Palomar.jpg

I've been up that road many times on a sport bike, so much fun!

[ssssly]

We'll se this fall. My 818 should be delivered in August.

I'm planning on putting my 2.2L stroker engine in it with the new BW 7163. So around 500hp at the crank or theoretic sub 2.5 sec 0-60 times.

Thinking that it is going to be greatly traction limited. And making it into 3rd gear in under 2 seconds will be a chore.

And I guess we'll get to find out if the stock 5sp, with some blast plates, can take decent power levels in a fwd configuration.

If I can get it built in time, I'll try to get some slips before the track gets snowed out. Theoretically it should put down sub 10 sec 1/4 mile times. But I think it will need greater than 10" rubber for anything close to that.

[Plebeian]

Ssssly, are you building a drag only car?

[longislandwrx]

On such a short tire, and limited weight and width even on drag slicks I think you are going to have a real tough time hooking up well enough to get you anywhere near a 3.0 0-60

The car has a stiff suspension, rear biased COG, and ultimately times will suffer due to lack of weight transfer, squat and all the other things that make drag cars fast in the straight line.

What final drive are you running? You should be able to hit 60 in second gear, unless the tires are spinning, which with 500hp you can guarantee you will be. With such a big turbo, you may also have a hard time not overwhelming the tires as power is coming on between 3000 and 4500 rpms.

I don't want to be a naysayer, but theoretic times and RL are very different. Hell I am rooting for you though. I want these cars to be stupid fast and it takes pioneers for that to happen.

I look forward to seeing your build come together, Hoping its not just another MattySti

[ssssly]

No, I'm not building a drag car. Which is why I don't think it will hit the theoretic times. Would have to give up too much handling to turn it into a drag car capable of those times. Should still be damn fast though.

Not that you couldn't make one into a great drag car. But it would require 11.5" tires, at least, and a completely different suspension setup.

9.5" R compounds in the rear should be fine for those power levels once they are heated up. And having driven similar, more powerful setups, as long as you are smooth on the throttle through transitions you can get it all to the ground. Just takes a bit more finesse and you have to fight the urge to smash the pedal at the apex. With that much power you don't need to anyway.

Don't know who MattySti is or what that means exactly.

But here is a time lapse of the movers packing out my cars in Japan to ship them to the states. 2 fully stripped to the frame v9 spec Cs and a v6 RA. Along with my 207 and 20G closed deck stoker engines and a few s204 transmissions and assorted other Suby stuff. All and all about 5 full cars worth of stuff minus the frames.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v...88685821581900

[Xusia]

MattySti was a forum member who was planning on building a very extreme 818 - around 700hp if I recall - but has since totally disappeared.

[Scargo]

Around for a few months, Matt seemed to know the lingo. He didn't have a kit ordered as far as I could tell. Perhaps arrested while doing the Cannonball run?

[ssssly]

Lol. In my humble opinion, its just not worth it to attempt the Cannonball Run unless you have Dom Deluise as a co pilot.

Not really planning anything all that extreme. Just going to throw that moderately built 2.2l in with a stock 02 tranny and see what I get. If the BW 7163 is too much to put the power down, I have a hybrid Garret 3071R to swap out to bring the power down a notch.

Only other modifications I have planned are minor standard things. Solid cooling tubes, vcp trailing arms for some 9.5" rubber, 5x114.3 hub mods and some custom interior stuff. May do some custom head and taillights as well. But nothing extreme.

After I get some track time on it, if there are other things I feel need to be done, I'll see about extreme mods. But it looks like a solid platform as is.

[metalmaker12]

Let's see where this goes, it's only true if there evidence. Talk is cheap but pink slips aren't. Anyhow I am happy with a 3.5- 4 sec 0-60,Idk time will tell, maybe will hit low 3 to 60. This car is a track car though and will be FFR best track car hands down, that's what the 818 is all about. I just mocked up my wipers so plates are a week or two out, than some warmer weather and I will see what I can lay down for times and dyno. I think I can muster up a 3.5-60 or better but I need great traction. And I will be in the 315-325 whp range if all is running correctly.

[ssssly]

Let's see where this goes, it's only true if there evidence. Talk is cheap but pink slips aren't.

ROFL...you trying out for the next Fast and Furious?

The thread is about theoretic 0-60 times based on an online calculator. So that is what people are talking about. Including myself.

Not trying to get into a my car is better than your car contest with anyone. Just stating my plans for my build and referencing them to the theoretical times based on the calculator in the thread.

So lets start over again. Allow me to introduce myself.

My name is Brooker. I go by ssssly on all the forums I frequent. Feel fee to look me up on the other international Subaru forums. I have lived in Japan for the last 7 years and have been building and parting Subarus in Japan for about the last 5. I'm in the process of relocating to Omaha, Nebraska this week. Flying out of Tokyo on Thursday.

Nice to meet you all. Not trying to hide behind the internet. Not blowing a bunch of smoke or trying to one up anyone. I'm a real person and anyone is more than welcome to come over to my new place in Omaha for some beers, a cup of tea, wrench on some cars, whatever. Just sharing my plans.

I'm looking forward to building my 818S, which is ordered, with a delivery date of 8/9/2104. And I'm sure I'll have my share of questions through my build. I am very experienced with JDM Subarus, but not with the 818.

I built the engine that will be going in my 818. Its a 2.2l stroker, stock nitrated 79mm crank, manley rods, custom 93mm Wossner stroker pistons, the new xpg series king bearings with stock V9 spec C heads.

Attachment 26943

Attachment 26944

Attachment 26945

I received confirmation Feb 10th from Jeremy at FullRace that I will be getting one of the next twin scroll 7163s. Should be available middle of next month.

If it's too much, this custom GT3071R will be going on it instead. Is a PnPed vf34, with a S204 vf42 hot side and a billet Garrett GT3071R CHRA. Ran it on my daily driver spec C for the last 6 months before I stripped it for my move. Pushes 24 psi to redline. Will peak at 28, but starts running out of juice on the top. Ran it at 25 peak to 24 at 9k.

Attachment 26946

Attachment 26947

And once I get the car built, i will share the results I get (pink slips and all) both to aid others and get suggestions from those more experienced.

BTW you should be able to get a bit more out of that vf37. I normally tune them to peak at 19.5 PSI and taper to 16-17 at redline. You can get as much as 21psi out of them, but they just start blowing hot air after that. And you aren't gaining anything much by running it out to 8600. The vf37 can't flow enough air to continue making additional HP after 6800. Plus, you can't keep the charge air cool enough on any of the stock top mounts to run the timing you would need to continue making HP above 7K. But we generally get 360-75ish, on Japanese 95 octane, out of them at 5800ish.

And the stock Target boost table on a JDM STI A4T series ECU map should be 2.2 bar at 4800 RPM. So ~17.4PSI not 14. 14 PSI is what the stock JDM WRX non STI, non AVCS, ECUs run. I can send you the stock JDM V8/9 STI and spec C maps if you would like them.

Great engines to work with and they do love to rev.

Looking forward to learning from everyone's builds and sharing mine.

Be well