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Thread: Is it time to overhaul this Forum Section?

  1. #1
    Senior Member R Thomas's Avatar
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    Is it time to overhaul this Forum Section?

    The Challenge Racer is NOT a dead vehicle, plenty of people use them on street and for autocross. Also many are used in various racing classes through out NASA, SCCA, and other groups.

    However, in my opinion the series itself is dead. I say this because the donor model for the drivetrain is now at least 24 years old. If you could find a donor with worthwhile parts it would approach or surpass its original purchase price.

    Also the Tech has advanced markedly. Nothing wrong with a simple carbed, 2 valve per cylinder OHV V-8, but I am old enough to have driven cars from the 50's and 60's and yes several of the cars from the glory days of the Muscle Car era. Compared to a new Mustang they are a joke. Yeah lots of cool noise, but 10-12 mpg, changing plugs every 5k miles, etc. My Convertible would trounce most stock muscle cars. Also its nice to plug into the ODBII and have the code tell you the injector on #6 is fouled.

    But that's not why I brought this up. My main thought is that FFR builds RACE Cars as well as Street replicas and the Forums should have a Racer Section. Since the series has run its course I think this section should morph into FFR's in Racing.
    Daily Driver 2011 Ford Mustang Convertible
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    Administrator David Hodgkins's Avatar
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    Good question.

    I reached out to FFR to see if they have any input.

    It seems like it could be a good idea to change the emphasis of this sub forum. It could then be used for an all-inclusive forum for all on-track adventures...


    FFR 5369 Pin Drive, IRS, Trigos, Torsen, Wilwoods, FMS BOSS 302 "B" cam , Mass-flo. CA SB100 (SPCN) Registered
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    Mark Dougherty's Avatar
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    I love the idea
    Since there is no real traffic on here in this configuration
    Inviting all FFR racing is a great idea
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    Steve >> aka: GoDadGo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Dougherty View Post
    I love the idea
    Since there is no real traffic on here in this configuration
    Inviting all FFR racing is a great idea
    Double Ditto On This Great Idea!

  5. #5
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    I agree totally.........

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    Senior Member Gromit's Avatar
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    Seems like a place all the new "R" coupes could bench race

    I would think autocross threads would end up here as well

    Chris aka Gromit

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    Senior Member lahrs37's Avatar
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    I wonder if there could be a new challenge car series based on newer Mustang drivetrains. So many guys run the coyote and the 2015 and newer IRS anyways. just my 2 cents!
    5.0 HO from a '93 Mustang, SVE heads, Trickflow stage 1 cam, Trickflow Street Burner intake manifold, T-5 w/mid shift, IRS
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    Senior Member R Thomas's Avatar
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    Lars, I have thought about that too, one of my first interests in FFR was running the series, my evaluation I was at least 5 years late to the party. While a series could evolve around the Coyote engine roadster, I believe it would be much more difficult to drop a Coyote in the bulk of the existing Challenge car fleet as there was a significant difference in the structure around the chassis. I may be talking totally out of line here since I don't own one of these early models. If a new series is to come I would think the logical starting point would be the new Super Car Dave has eluded to that will utilize the GEN3 Coupe chassis or a variation of such. Again this is just my opinion based on what I have seen. The other major point why a changed Challenge spec isn't needed is there are many chances to race Challenge cars in Vintage Racing, and various classes in NASA and SCCA.
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    As 2 of perhaps 8 people still running the FFR series in the Midwest Region (my wife and I both have cars), I am open to adding other FFR cars (ie the coupe) to the series – as long as it/they have the solid rear axle and similar suspension/brake setup. I don’t care about their supposedly better aero. Since we have a horsepower/torque/weight chart, it shouldn’t matter what engine/powertrain is in the car. For that matter run any engine you want in the challenge cobra, as long as it fits and lands on the horsepower/torque/weight chart. I don’t want any mandatory changes to my engine or suspension because I have 2 cars and lots of spares (engines, transmissions, rear ends, suspension corners, etc.), but I have no issues with someone who is just starting putting anything in their car.

  10. #10
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    I'm real interested in anything related to track time, might be HPDE, SCCA, NASA, Auto-x whatever. Lots of time spent watching John George's and other track videos.

    Seems that the track guys are less concerned with pretty paint and more tuned-in to performance. I've seen multiple Challenge Cars at races or track events, great people, purpose built cars. These guys are proud of their dings and bandages.

    I'd really like more info on road racing and what it takes to configure a car for the track. If this forum becomes that resource I'd be real happy. I have lots of questions, just haven't been sure where to post them.

    I've been working on my Challenge Car and while not connecting parts at this time I am testing and evaluating i.e. plotting and planning. I'm not working towards a "class" as I don't expect to compete. Basically ignoring anything in the rule book other than those items related to safety.

    Jim

  11. #11
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    Jim
    We will be at Blackhawk with SCCA 7/15/2017 and 7/16/2017 running in SPO with are challenge cars. Then autobahn 7/29/2017 and 7/30/2017 with NASA

  12. #12
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    R.T., Thanks, I'll have to try to get there, Autobahn would be easier. Jim

  13. #13
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    I agree it's time to make this section more general race oriented. Maybe subsections for Road/AutoX/Drag to keep things organized.

    As far as the cars themselves I think a push to more equalize them in ST4, and get them into HSR as a group 5 vehicle. Maybe other vintage series.
    2012 NASA-SE FFR Champion
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  14. #14
    Super Moderator vnmsss's Avatar
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    Greeting Challenge Series car owners!! I love these cars, and have been busy working on getting our cars into vintage racing. While I agree the Challenge Series has waned a bit from its hey day, they are truly great cars, and whether you track them, race them with NASA, or use them on the street as a fun driver, their uses are truly only limited to your dreams.

    I own two Challenge Series cars, as well as a Gen3 R-model Coupe, and raced my red/white roadster and Coupe with the Society of Vintage Racing ENthusiasts (SOVREN) in the Pacific Northwest, and the Vintage Auto Racing Association (VARA) in Southern California over the last couple of years. I can say without any hesitation that people dig our cars, and with fewer and fewer of the originals on track, both of these vintage racing organizations have welcomed our cars into their regular race groups. I believe other vintage race groups will also be welcoming our cars, and I am working on developing a plan for racing our cars (Roadsters and Coupes) with vintage groups around the country. I am very hopeful we will have more race venues and race groups to run with in the future.

    In the meantime, SOVREN and VARA welcome our cars now, and I would encourage anyone who owns a Challenge Series car, or is thinking about building one, to jump in and join us now as we build these groups. Plans include driving some very cool and very historic tracks with our cars, and to enjoy them with vintage racing fans & spectators at these amazing events, and our fellow vintage racing drivers who appreciate the place these cars represent in auto racing history.

    SOVREN Spokane Festival of Speed
    Spokane County Raceway
    Spokane, WA
    June 1-3, 2018

    SOVREN Pacific Northwest Historics
    Pacific Raceways
    Kent, WA
    June 29-July 1, 2018

    VARA Lucas Oil Big Bore Bash
    Willow Springs International Raceway
    Rosamond, CA
    November 10-11, 2018

    Karen
    #28 FFR Challenge Series
    #28 FFR Type-65 Coupe
    2011 Western Endurance Racing Championship
    2010 West Coast Champion
    Drive it.....Like you stole it!

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