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33 Hot Rod (Gen 1) Stage 1 delivered on 4/27/2017, Stage 2 delivered on 9/21/2018
LS3 495hp/480 lb. ft., 4L70E, Electric PS, Classic Auto Air, Lokar electronic sport shifter, 13 inch Wilwood front and 11.68 Cobra rear brakes, Ford 8.8 w 3.73 w 4 link, Billet Specialty Legend Series MAG wheels and Mickey Thompson
Sportsman S/R 26x8x18 front and 29x18x20 rear tires.
Well if you have any questions for Classic Auto Air and can't get ahold of them let me know. They are in the DFW area and I can stop by. I stopped by and visited with them a few months back... Nice guys. Even said that when I was ready they would crimp all my lines for free since I have one of their systems.
So I had a delay in working on the car for the last week and a half. My Father and mentor passed away last week on Valentines day. I had been working hard on getting the car going so I could take him for a ride. I had also been trying to get him to come down for a visit and to help me work on it but neither will be able to happen now.
I did do some work on the car and started to have some trouble in turning the motor over and my thought was to call dad and ask him what he though. I guess I will have to depend on you guys from now on. Thats a far cry from just calling dad up but I guess it will have to do.
So yesterday I got to install the Summit Racing headers that came in. I also installed the pugs and plug wires to see how everything was going to look.
I bought the black non-High temp painted headers because the ones that are powder coated lost their warranty if used for breaking in a motor. I figured that for $119.00 I could break in the motor and then take them to be powder coated. Or I might find out that I hate them and have a set made for me.
My biggest problem now is after I took the pictures I decided that I was going to redo the lash for the rocker arms. I think they were way to tight the way I had done it. So I pulled the distributor, the plug wires, plugs and the valve covers and started to loosen up the rocker bolts. I could get all but three lose and went to turn the motor over so I could get the other three and then get the pistons into place to start setting the valve lash. No joy... I put the socket on the crankshaft bolt and even with an 18" break over and a cheater bar all I could do was tighten up the bolt. The motor would not turn. This was when I thought to call dad but then I got depressed and just cleaned up and went inside.
I think I may have figured it out though. So tonight I will give it a try and see if I found the issue. I'll update later if I have it fixed.
Are you trying to turn the engine with the plugs installed? I had a terrible problem getting mine done, wasted a camshaft and two lifters in the process.
Nope... Pulled the plugs as well.
When I woke up at about 3 a.m. this morning I started thinking about it and I did not have any problems until I put the transmission on the back of the motor. So I think what I did was to mate them up with the Torque Converter not seated all the way back and is probably pressing up against the fly wheel.
Wow, sorry to hear you lost your father. Thoughts and prayers for you and your family.
Sounds like you might be on the right track with the TQ not seated, hopefully no damage.
Sorry to hear of your Dad's passing. I've found even after 16 years I still find myself thinking "I should ask Mom about that..." I've come to cherish those moments as reminders of just how important they were/are to me, and could never be forgotten or replaced.
Just checking out your website and found the budget page - hey now where's the money for engine block and transmission? No fair using "parts I found in my garage"
James
FFR33 #997 (Gen1 chassis, Gen2 body), license plate DRIVE IT says it all! build thread
My build: 350SBC, TKO600, hardtop, no fenders/hood, 32 grill, 3 link, sway bars, 355/30r19
Previous cars: GTD40, Cobra, tubeframe 55 Chevy, 66 Nova, 56 F100
But I did just find it in the garage.
I was going to sell the Vette for $4,000 or $5,000 dollars and started looking at buying a motor and transmission and figured it would be cheaper to strip the Vette and use what I can on it. So the motor and trans are going into the Hot Rod and the rear end is going into my next project. My Dad gave me his Model T that has been sitting as parts for years. It uses a Vette rear end but the one that came with it is shot. So the rear end is going into it and I start it once I get the Hot Rod done.
If you go to the very last company in my budget page you will find the cost where I had the engine prepped. I also bought a new cam and lifters from Summit Racing.
One Step Forward, Twelve Steps Back!
So on Sunday the motor was in and the headers on and everything was looking good until I tried to turn the crank. It would not move. I figured it was the torque converter (TC) not being seated and started to pull the motor again. So, I had to pull the headers, the distributor, and put the hoist on the motor again. I started the trans bolts coming out and as I loosened the bolts the motor was being pressed forward so yeah, it was the TC causing the problems.
Go the motor on the stand and the motor turns with the break over on the crank bolt.
Got it onto the stand and the lash set as required.
Notice the oil spot on the floor? That is because I put the oil in and dropped in the pre-oiler and gave it a good spin with my drill. Oil came shooting out of the hole for the oil pressure sending unit that I had forgotten to put in. Got that put in and gave it another spin. I am now a bit concerned because no oil made it up to the rockers through the push rods. I may need to press down more to make sure the oiler is sealing well. But I don't recall having to do that the last time. But then again I was using an old distributer that had the cam gear ground off of it.
This is the one I am using.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AZJYEZS/
Last edited by TDSapp; 02-28-2018 at 10:44 AM.
33 Hot Rod (Gen 1) Stage 1 delivered on 4/27/2017, Stage 2 delivered on 9/21/2018
LS3 495hp/480 lb. ft., 4L70E, Electric PS, Classic Auto Air, Lokar electronic sport shifter, 13 inch Wilwood front and 11.68 Cobra rear brakes, Ford 8.8 w 3.73 w 4 link, Billet Specialty Legend Series MAG wheels and Mickey Thompson
Sportsman S/R 26x8x18 front and 29x18x20 rear tires.
I also have that drawer with all the receipts. Biggest problem is my wife is a 25 year teacher with 22 years of it being a math teacher. So she wants to see numbers. She is all for me building the hot rod though.
I mostly do it though so I remember what I have spent already and try and spread it out. I mean that almost 20K has all been in that last 7 or 8 months. It probably would have not hurt to spread it out a bit... But we can afford it right now so why not.
Thanks for all your work so far on this thread. I am just doing my homework on a future build at this point, but threads like this really help paint a clear picture of what things will be like when I get into this on my own.
X...
I am glad it is helping someone.
Make sure you take a look at the budget at http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/budget/ as I keep it up-to date with everything I spend on the car. Now mind you, not everything I have bought gets added. Mostly tools and such that I know I will use on other projects, like my sand blasting cabinet and a 16mm wrench. I have not really had to buy many tools as I had most of them.
I am currently at $19,474.07 and I only bought stage 1 to start with. I also have not bought my wheels and tires and I know I am going to need a few other things when I get stage 2. As I revise my future budget it creeps a bit higher than I expected but not by much.
$20,000.00 Stage 1 and Drive Train
$10,000.00 Stage 2
$ 4,000.00 Wheels and Tires
$ 5,000.00 Paint (This may be a little low but I plan on doing most work myself)
$ 2,000.00 Misc things I am going to need. (Sanding paper, filler, epoxy and glass.)
So, at least $42,000.00 and that does not include the cost of a motor and transmission. I already had them but did have to pay to get the block machined, but a new basic motor and transmission would probably add around $6,000.00 to $7,000.00 to the cost.
Tim I just got through you build thread and offer my condolences, it sounds as though you and your father had a great relationship. Cherish the memories and know he will always be riding with you.
Sincerely,
Jim
Tim, go to the Summit Racing website and order the following part number: CCA-320 (CCA-324 for SBF). I never build a V-8 engine without one of these crank turning devices. On high compression engines you can actually twist off the damper retaining bolt and don't even try turning the motor backwards. With these devices you can go either direction and never hurt the damper retaining bolt. Thank me later.
I was looking at your trans mount plate, just want to check that you are making some accommodations to be able to pull the trans without having to pull the motor, and to make sure that you can actually pull and install the motor and trans assembly with the body in place. It looks like with the plate hard mounted you may not be able to get the angle needed to get the trans and motor installed with the body etc. in place. I now know with my car I cannot pull the transmission with out at the very least moving the motor forward. With the motor in place I cannot move the trans back far enough for the input shaft to clear the bell, I need to rebuild the throw out bearing which should not be that big a deal, but ended turning into something much more involved.
Just wanted to make sure you thought of future maintenance....
Jim
Well unfortunately with the way the transmission mounts I will not be able to pull it out without pulling the trans cover or the motor. I do know that while working on the trans mount I could not drop the trans out the bottom because of how long the tail shaft is. So I wrapped it with the ratcheting tie down straps and was able to lift it out, but once it is assembled it will require the trans cover to be removed. For now I am going to continue on and will just have to plan on pulling the motor if I need the trans out.
IMG_0732.JPG
Pulling the engine and trans is not that difficult in the 33HR compared to many other cars I've pulled engines on. I've had mine out a few times now during the build process. With the right tools can be a one-man job. In the photo you can see the articulating lifting adapter I use and this make it so that one person can R&R the engine & trans. Mine has to come out for SFI cert every two-years which is way more than most folks will need. You'll spend more time & money modifying the chassis to make it so you can pull the trans without the engine. And there is the engineering & design work necessary to ensure you don't compromise the chassis' structural integrity.
33 Hot Rod (Gen 1) Stage 1 delivered on 4/27/2017, Stage 2 delivered on 9/21/2018
LS3 495hp/480 lb. ft., 4L70E, Electric PS, Classic Auto Air, Lokar electronic sport shifter, 13 inch Wilwood front and 11.68 Cobra rear brakes, Ford 8.8 w 3.73 w 4 link, Billet Specialty Legend Series MAG wheels and Mickey Thompson
Sportsman S/R 26x8x18 front and 29x18x20 rear tires.
Drink a gallon of coffee, invite a friend, and Enjoy
Last edited by wrp; 03-02-2018 at 08:01 PM.
Wow you guys work fast! I had to set down and have a beer after that. wrp and crew can install an engine in a bit over a minute. HVACMAN can do it in an hour. It takes me three beers to pull or install an engine -- not sure in hours and minutes but I can reference the time it takes in beers.
All kidding aside, it's not that hard in the Hot Rod. My tip to others is to use Weather Pack connectors on the lights to make it easy to pull the grill / radiator assembly and get it out of your way. I've found it to be easier to install the motor/trans assembly through the front rather than the side but whatever works best for you is how you should manage the job. For my build I had a clean sheet of paper when designing my new chassis. I could have easily incorporated removable cross members to facilitate removing the trans through the bottom but I prefer to remove the engine & trans as a unit rather than fight getting my fat hands in the close space around the bell housing and firewall. And it wasn't worth the extra weight to make removable cross members anyway.
The key to it is to promise a 17 year old you will let him drive it if he helps. That gets all the beneath the car work done as well as the tight spaces on the bell housing. Plus they like sugar drinks as boost, leaving more coffee for the old timers
James
FFR33 #997 (Gen1 chassis, Gen2 body), license plate DRIVE IT says it all! build thread
My build: 350SBC, TKO600, hardtop, no fenders/hood, 32 grill, 3 link, sway bars, 355/30r19
Previous cars: GTD40, Cobra, tubeframe 55 Chevy, 66 Nova, 56 F100
Well my oldest son is 27 and lives in Oklahoma with his wife and daughter so he is not much help to me. My youngest is 24 but he has no interest in cars unless I was to ask him to program something on a RPi to put in the car. I could probably get a couple kids from next door to help but they are young.
But really though... How could a guy not want to work on something that looks like this. It gets me excited every time I look at it.
I did get to work on the car on Sunday. After putting the motor in and pulling it twice I finally got the torque converter (TC) to seat. I finally got the motor in, transmission in, TC bolted to the flywheel, and the motor brought to TDC on #1 and the distributor stabbed. I also mounted the headers and the down pipes. I am getting closer and closer to that fabled first start.
Now I have to pull the distributor and put the gear break in lube on the drive gear. I may just tape the lube to the cap though and not do it until I am about to start it. I don't want the lube to drip off of the gear while doing everything else to get it started.
I agree, that motor looks awesome. Proper old school grunt. Getting close to start!
James
FFR33 #997 (Gen1 chassis, Gen2 body), license plate DRIVE IT says it all! build thread
My build: 350SBC, TKO600, hardtop, no fenders/hood, 32 grill, 3 link, sway bars, 355/30r19
Previous cars: GTD40, Cobra, tubeframe 55 Chevy, 66 Nova, 56 F100
Yes, a SBC looks great in one of these cars.
After Dad passed away I have found it hard to go out and work on the hot rod. I was trying to get it going so I could take him for a ride before he passed. I got depressed after trying to work on it and had a problem. My first thought was to call dad and ask him what he thought.
But it has been over a month and I went back to work on the car last weekend. The head lights and buckets were delivered so I went ahead and mounted them to see how they will look. They are 7.5 inch light buckets that are polished stainless steel and the head lights are H4 Halogen bulbs with 6 LEDs across the bottom for the turn signals.
I have to pull them again to do the wiring but it only takes a single nut to drop them from the car. I will also have to turn the bulbs to make sure that the LEDs are at the bottom so they look correct.
I also put the carb back on along with the spark plugs, wires, loom and headers. I also started on the wiring harness so I can start the wiring.
Hey Tim, my condolences on the loss of your dad, I am sure he would have wanted you to get this done regardless! I lost mine a little over a year ago and still hear him telling me how to do things on the car even though he was a sailboat builder. Using all the knowledge he instilled on me for everything fiberglass as that boats were fabricated in fiberglass, you could say I was born with fiberglass diapers! It does feel good to know he would have been there all the time to tell me what to do and not just suggest things!!
I see you mounted your headlights and would appreciate it if you could take a picture(s) on how you mounted it to the brackets in behind/beside the drill. I'm trying to work out how I can have them permanently mounted along with the side marker lights i need to have without having the side covers. Want to make it look good but functional as well. cutting the fiberglass panels and reglassing them to have good tight joints is not an issue for me. any additional pics would be appreciated to see. TY!
So AJT, I have not gotten the photos of how the lights are mounted because I took them off so I can start the wiring on them.
With that said I have started the wiring of this beast. What a blur of colors... At least American Autowire has a good diagram of the wires and each wire is labeled. After reading a thread here on the site I mounted my fuse panel on the petal box frame to the left of the steering wheel. I may have to move it back some as I think it might be to far back and not allow the body to slide on.
One thing I think makes this a bit easier is the control unit I got with my Dakota Digital Gauges. It lets me run all the gauge wires to this unit and then only a single Cat-5 cable from the unit to the gauge cluster. It's nice and compact that way. Now I need to figure out where I am going to mount it and the control unit for the power steering.
I am now working on the ignition switch, I just want to solder the wires to the connectors before I put them into the connector. I also wired up the light switch, which is just seen on the lower left of this picture.
So back to a bit of working on the Hot Rod. I bought March alternator and AC compressor brackets and they both finally got delivered. I got them put on and found a couple issues with them but I can make them work.
First problem is the adjuster bar on the alternator bracket is way too short. It puts the alternator way too far out the side of the motor.
I found that I can buy another adjusting rod for not to much that will bring the alternator closer to the valve covers. Kind of fitting better like the AC compressor fits.
This one did not fit quite right but it is working OK for me. I had to move the adjustment rod over to the water pump though.
The biggest problem is that the two pulleys no longer line up with the water pump and crank shaft pulleys. I called March and talked to them and got them to tell me the matching Crank pulley. They also tried to give me the part number for the correct water pump but I need a smooth water pump pulley and they gave me one that has the grooves for the serpentine belt. I think I found the one that I need but there are no measurements or demotions on any of the web sites I have looked at. It is the March 6271 for the crank and I think it is the March 4312 for the water pump.
Finally got to work on the Hot Rod again. This time I started with converting and rebuilding the carburetor. The carb I got from my Dad is a Holley 4160 which uses a metering plate to control the fuel flow to the secondaries. I found that there is a conversion kit that changes the 4160 to a 4150, which includes a new metering block which allows jets to be changed for the secondaries.
I also have pulled some of the sheet metal and drilled some of the holes for the AC hoses.
I am starting to pull most of the sheet metal and am taping them up and getting them ready to spray on some lizard skin.
If you really want to get more details on the carb rebuild please click on the link below. I did not want to type everything over here as well as there.
Work Work Work... Seems like that is all I get to do. But here and there are some good times with the Hot Rod. I just have to work around some of this HOT weather that we have been having.
I just got to spray the Lizard Skin Sound Control (SC) onto the sheet metal over the last weekend. I was going to spray the top side of the floor pans but there has been some summer time thunderstorms around here keeping me from doing it after work.
I know it is hard to tell but there is tape where the frame sits that will be removed before mounting the floor pans. That way they will sit flush on the frame. I am going to be spraying the Ceramic Insulation (CI) from lizard skin as well. Will probably try and shoot the final SC layer tonight and the CI over the weekend.
I also got the wiring done for the head lights and got them mounted. None of the wires matched what the wire harness has so I had to re-wire them. I then had to pull out the grinder and modify the headlight cans because they would not let the headlights sit flush and it put the LEDs at a wonky angle. But after a few hours of working slow in 95 degree weather I got them done and mounted.
Since I am not going with fenders or side covers I was able to mount them directly to the radiator supports.
More good news is that we ordered Stage two about four weeks ago and it is scheduled to be completed on July 28th. Jolene at ST said that they are scheduled to pick up on July 30th to Aug 3rd and that it would be around 7 to 10 days for delivery. So hopefully if everything goes well, around the middle of Aug I will have the rest of the kit here at the house.
James
FFR33 #997 (Gen1 chassis, Gen2 body), license plate DRIVE IT says it all! build thread
My build: 350SBC, TKO600, hardtop, no fenders/hood, 32 grill, 3 link, sway bars, 355/30r19
Previous cars: GTD40, Cobra, tubeframe 55 Chevy, 66 Nova, 56 F100
I had to get up early early on Sunday morning, up at like 5 a.m., so the crew could get here and replace a failed AC unit at the house. So I went outside and worked in the garage since it was just as hot inside. (It was up to 82 in the morning when we got there at 6a.m.) I was able to shoot the ceramic insulation on my sheet metal on one side. I hope that soon I will be able to shoot it onto the inside of the floor pans.
No pictures today because the ceramic insulation looks almost identical to the sound control except it is a little closer to black.
My biggest problem working on the car right now is the heat. I will normally work on the car and then call it a day when it reaches 95 degrees. Yesterday that meant I went inside at 10:30 a.m.! It reached a high of 109 yesterday and that is just too hot to be outside. Makes me want to put an AC in the garage but after spending $5,000 to have the one on the house replaced I realize that I don't want to spend that much on the garage.
After cleaning up the Lizard Skin sprayer I did get to play with the new pressure washer. Washed the daily driver and then used it to clean up part of the driveway. It was normally priced at $225.00 but I got it on Amazon prime day for $112.00. It is going to really speed up some of the clean up jobs around here. I figure that after sanding the body of the hot rod that the pressure washer will really clean out the nooks and crannies better than just a garden hose and nozzle.
Echo to that from the Westside Tim! 114 over here yesterday, which translates to 125 in the shop (even the portacool doesn't help at that temp). Hate to see weekends go by with not much work getting done. Focused on heatshielding and some wiring cleanup, so sweating like a pig doesn't seem to help things along.
33' Hot Rod Coupe/Roadster (GEN 1), Fendered, Ford 302, 350hp, EFI, AOD, 4-Link, Double Adjustable Koni Coilovers, Split Rear Exhaust, Electric Power Steering, AC/Heat/Defrost, Moser 8.8"-3.55, Willwood Front/Rear Brakes, 18" x 8" Fronts/20" x 10" Rears, Ordered: 1.26.17, Arrived: 3.29.17, First Start: 7.2.18, Go Cart: 11.4.18 Paint/Body: 2.23.19, Back Home: 11.24.19, Completed: NEVER!; View More Pics @ https://starmobileone.com/
There's a bit of irony in working on heatshielding when it's 120*
-- Mike -- TxMike64 -- @TxMGarage
Gen1.5 Hot Rod '33 #1094 (Stage 1) - 302/AOD '15 IRS - Quad Built - Build Thread