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Thread: 40 Watt Garage & #9365

  1. #241
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixit View Post
    Question for Edwardb or someone who's done the molded hose/stainless pipe mod for the lower radiator hose...

    How long do the "legs" of the SS elbow need to be from the bend? I may already have a source for this, but I don't know if it'll be long enough, and I don't want to order the suggested.
    I assume you have the newer style radiator with the angled bottom radiator hose connection? My build was with the previous Afco Racing radiator with the straight lower hose connection. So pretty sure the layout would be different from mine.
    Last edited by edwardb; 12-25-2018 at 10:47 PM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  2. #242
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    Yup, I've got the angled Inlet/Outlet...

    As it turns out, the Ford supplied upper hose (came with the Performance Pack) fits beautifully. If it was 3/4" longer it would be PERFECT - but as supplied it has to stretch out just a tiny bit to slip on.
    And again, the Ford supplied lower hose (installed backwards from the markings and cut) will line up nicely for a SS pipe/elbow under the X-brace to the Dodge V8 Ram hose off the engine.

    I'm finalizing radiator mounting today, and will get some decent & detailed pics of this setup with the angled radiator connections.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  3. #243
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Radiator Mounting

    12/29 Update 1 of 3

    I’ll always give credit where it’s due… my mounting system was inspired by the unit(s) offered by Breeze Automotive.
    Upper Mount kit
    Lower Mount kit
    I’m also using the Breeze radiator shroud, and incorporating its mounting with the radiator.

    Materials:
    3’ section of piano hinge
    3’ stick of ½” aluminum “U” channel
    3’ stick of 5/16” “All-Thread” rod
    2) 1-1/2” x 3” x 1/8” aluminum flat/strip stock
    10-32 “NutSerts”
    5/16”, 8-32, and 10-32 fasteners as needed
    Rattle-can Primer & Paint of your choice

    Upper Mount Tips & Pointers:

    • The small ¾” tubes welded to the upper crossbar of the frame need to be removed.
    • I used a Dremel type tool with a cut-off wheel to cut the welds, and big channel locks to pry the pieces off.
    • An angle grinder was used to clean up the rest of the weld beads.
    • The piano hinge was cut to fit the radiator flange, taking into account using the factory holes, and aligning them to the FFR suggested 5/8” offset.
    • The 4 mounting points on the upper cross tube are 10-32 “NutSerts”
    • The 6 mounting points on the radiator flange are 8-32 screws, with serrated flange nuts.
    • The mounting points for the upper end of the shroud (not in photo) were drilled 3/16”. 8-32 screws, with serrated flange nuts are used to mount the shroud.
    • Measure twice, cut once.

    RadMount01.pngRadMount02.pngRadMount07.png

    Lower Mount Tips & Pointers:

    • The “U” channel was clamped to the frame member and marked/cut for an exact fit to the outside of the ¾” frame tubes.
    • The elliptical hanger(s) lower holes are slots, for adjustment.
    • The radiator location is offset to the DS by 5/8”, as recommended by FFR
    • The shroud, radiator flange, and “U” channel were jigged up, and mounting holes drilled through all three for 8-32 threads, then disassembled.
    • The shroud & flange holes were opened up to 3/16” to allow for an 8-32 screw.
    • The “U” channel was tapped to 8-32, and machine screws used to mount the shroud to the “U”, sandwiching the flange.
    • Final length of the “all-thread” rod was determined after jigging up the assembly.


    RadMount03.pngRadMount04.pngRadMount05.pngRadMount06.pngRadMount08.png
    Last edited by Fixit; 12-29-2018 at 07:14 PM.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

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  5. #244
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Radiator Hoses

    12/29 Update 2 of 3

    I chose to not use the FFR supplied SS flex hose for the radiator connections. I prefer the look of the molded rubber hoses, and a simple straight pipe section. #9365 is running a Coyote 5.0, and was shipped with the “newer” radiator that has an angled inlet and outlet.

    Parts Used:
    Upper Hose - (Shipped with Ford Performance Controls Pack)
    Motorcraft # KM 5290
    Ford # FR3Z-8260-C
    Lower Hose - This will be made up from two molded hoses, with an elbow tube to connect them.

    Engine end: (fitment is for a 1994 to 2001 Dodge Ram 1500/2500/3500 w/ V8)
    NAPA # 8726
    Dayco # 71713
    Radiator end - (Shipped with Ford Performance Controls Pack):
    Ford # BR33-8286-BA
    Motorcraft # KM5136
    (These numbers do not want to cross-over to any aftermarket vendor, Gates/NAPA/Dayco, etc.)
    Connector Pipe:
    What’s needed is a 1-1/2” O.D., 90deg bend, with at least one of the straight legs 12” long. The other leg can be as short as 2” long. You can get creative, or…
    Jegs # 679-MB1040

    (I’ll tag a disclaimer on here as it’s up to you to determine the fitment & parts will work, and assume you’ll be offsetting the radiator the FFR recommended 5/8” to the Driver’s Side)

    Upper Hose:
    No modification needed. The supplied hose is nearly a perfect fit – if it was ½” longer it would be perfect. A little stretch and it works.
    Lower Hose Engine End:
    I can’t stress the old rule of “Measure Twice, Cut Once”…
    Fit the hose on the engine nipple, and mark where it intersects the frame member.
    In my instance it wound up being about 7” down from the inside of the molded 90. (near a slight kink in the straight section). Cut here.
    LowerHose02.pngLowerHose01.png

    Lower Hose Radiator End:
    The hose works when installed backwards.
    Trim off about 1” from the end marked “ENG”.
    From the “ENG” end, at the last bit of straight section (towards the end marked “RAD”), cut off the remainder.
    Fit the hose on the radiator nipple.
    Connector Pipe:
    Jig up/fit the pipe and measure where the hoses end. Mark the hard pipe.

    • Allow for at least 1” engagement into the rubber hoses. More is better.
    • Cut the hard pipe
    • Test fit

    LowerHose03.pngLowerHose04.png

    Attachment to the frame member(s) is up to you. There’s a myriad of clamps or brackets, or make your own.
    Last edited by Fixit; 01-25-2019 at 10:34 AM.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  6. #245
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Engine Compartment "Odds n Ends"

    12/29 Update 3 of 3

    While waiting for the paint to dry on the radiator mounting pieces, I tackled a few “odd n ends” in the engine compartment.

    Fuel System:
    I’m not using the supplied FFR regulator assembly. My engine kit from Forte’s included the GM bypass/regulator fuel filter system. The supplied 3/8” pressure line made it to the center of the firewall. I needed a way to get it to the engine fuel rail.
    Parts:
    Summit SUM-221330B (3/8”M quick connect to AN-6)
    Russell 640730 (3/8”M quick connect to 3/8”F quick connect w/ 1/8” NPT port)
    (FFR Coyote Install kit) 30” 3/8” quick connect to AN-6 braided hose
    (FFR Coyote Install kit) Fuel Pressure gauge

    • I made up a support bracket from some aluminum angle for the line coming up from the frame
    • I disassembled one end of the FFR hose assembly and shortened it about 6”.
    • Using some Teflon tape, thread the pressure gauge into the fuel rail port.
    • Snap on the quick connect fittings and it’s done.

    Fuel_13.pngFuel_12.pngFuel_11.png

    Brake/Clutch Reservoir:
    I reworked my original mounting bracket for the Tilton 3-chamber reservoir. It was too high, and didn’t have any offset for the hood prop strut to fold into.
    Attachment 99770Attachment 99771Attachment 99772Attachment 99773
    Reservoir01.png Reservoir02.png
    (a previous post details cutting off the hose nipples and threading in 1/8" NPT to 1/4" hose barb 90deg fittings)

    Engine Vacuum & PCV:
    I got a fitting kit from JLT Performance. It includes the needed quick-connects for the cam vacuum solenoids and the Driver’s side PCV hose.
    Using a Uni-bit, I drilled a hole in the Spectre intake elbow, installed the grommet with some sealant, and connected the hose with the quick-connect adapter.
    The molded hard hose (Ford Piece) was about 1/2" too short "at rest". You can pull it to fit, but this puts tension on the connections.
    I slit the foam cover (along the bottom) with a razor blade, removed it, and clicked the hose into place. With very careful use of the heat gun I was able to "relax" the hard plastic hose to where there was no tension. The foam cover was put back on and held with ty-raps.

    PCV01.pngPCV02.png

    For the vacuum solenoids, a 3/8” quick connect to hose barb fitting (JLT) was used at the stub-end near the intake inlet, a 3/8”- 3/8” hose barb 90 (JLT), and a ½” to 3/8” 90deg. hose barb fitting (hardware store) at the port behind the throttle body.
    CamVac01.png

    As I was writing this up, my full-bypass heater control valve showed up… more to come.
    Last edited by Fixit; 02-07-2019 at 08:59 PM. Reason: Fixed link for reservoir pics, detail PCV hose
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  7. #246
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    For the vacuum solenoids is there a reason why you plumed it behind the throttle body? I have mine connected to a nipple on the intake pipe elbow.

  8. #247
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    See the attached vacuum system diagram from Ford... I highlighted the vacuum path in blue.
    According to this diagram the CMCV motors get post-throttle body vacuum via a pipe system (that we don't have).

    Since we don't have the pipe system, I connected the CMCV motor vacuum feed to where it ultimately does wind up.

    Coyote_Vacuum2.png

    This vacuum system/supply for the Gen 2 Coyote has been tossed around and around, and via my searching (here and other sources) this seemed to be the last update or reiteration.
    Last edited by Fixit; 12-31-2018 at 07:46 AM.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  9. #248
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Heater Control Valve Pt. 1

    Update 12/30

    Mrs. Fixit went to do some damage at "Mall of America" with a friend, and left me to my own devices this afternoon... so more time in the "40 Watt".

    Full Bypass Heater Control Valve

    Running a Coyote with a heater requires the use of a “full bypass” heater control valve.
    The coolant flow (through the heater on a Coyote-equipped Ford vehicle) includes a crossover path from cylinder head to cylinder head in its design, and this is why when installing this engine without a heater, they require a “crossover” hose be installed on the ports from head to head.
    A typical heater control valve just shuts off the coolant flow through the heater core – deadheading the coolant flow from supply to return. Not good – eliminates the “crossover” needed by the Coyote.
    Living in MN with a “thermally challenged” spouse required a heater be installed in #9365. This will detail what I came up with to supply the heater kit.

    Parts:



    I wanted everything to be tucked up nice & neat under the engine cover.
    The supplied aluminum elbows in the FFR/Vintage Air heater kit somewhat influenced my choice on mounting, as well as the length & bend radius of the control cable. The corner of the PS valve cover just worked.

    With the aluminum 90’s in place, and the control valve laying kinda where it needs to go, I got a visual on how much to trim off the hoses and the tubes. Measure twice, cut once. There’s a lot of “fudge” room here for trimming, so be generous on your initial measurements.
    Using a tubing cutter I trimmed off the ends of the aluminum tubes & deburred them. I wanted a way to put some kind of “bell” on the end, but my flare tool wouldn’t go big enough. I found a socket with a nice flare to it, put it in the end of the tube, and gave it a few smacks with a hammer. The soft aluminum “bell’d out” just nice, and gave a lip for the hose to seal on.
    Heater03.pngHeater04.pngHeater05.pngHeater06.pngHeater07.pngHeater08.pngHeater09.png

    A little playing around/trimming with the hose elbows got the control valve laying where it needed to be.
    Heater10.pngHeater11.png
    Attached Images Attached Images
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  10. #249
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Heater Control Valve Pt. 2

    Next was fitting the supply/return hoses. Working with the natural curve/set of the hose, I marked and cut to fit the supply/return hoses. (the shrink clamps are not set). The ty-raps are to hold the hoses in relative location.
    Heater13.pngHeater12.png

    This is what I was after… nice clean install
    Heater14.pngHeater15.png

    I made up a mounting bracket from some scrap, and attached it to one of the unused studs on the intake. It locks the hoses in position, and in combination with the aluminum elbows the control valve doesn’t move during actuation, but has some “give” for engine movement.
    Heater16.pngHeater17.pngHeater18.pngHeater19.png
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

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  12. #250
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    Great work John! I really appreciate the time you have taken to include part numbers and links. Originally I was going to go with a 347 carb’d because the traditional look and what I am familiar with. Based on recommendations from many and your build detail (among others). I think I’m going to switch to a Coyote.

    I don’t think I have read where you put the hard fuel lines in yet, correct?

  13. #251
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The fuel tank plumbing is on post #166

    I didn't take any pics of the "hard line" running from the filter/regulator up to the engine compartment. Pretty basic stuff... I used the Forte's supplied plastic line (w/ quick connects) and ran it along the outside of the PS frame rail. It's held in place about every foot with a rubberized metal clamp.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

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  15. #252
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    40 Watt Garage - Mk4 Build - Exhaust Header Install

    12/31 – Exhaust Headers

    I was expecting to use up all the cuss words I didn’t vent while installing the engine while doing this… but in all honesty not one naughty word was muttered! This was by far the easiest header install I’ve done in a long time (try 2” tube full-length in a Chevelle with a 454… it’s a cuss-fest!)

    Not knowing what was in store for me stuffing the Coyote into that little engine bay, I removed all 16 exhaust manifold studs. I didn’t want them getting in the way & snagging on things. In hindsight, they’re tucked well under the head(s), and other “stuff” sticks out farther – they wouldn’t have been an issue – but having them out had its benefits while installing the headers. No lost time, 6 to one, ½ dozen to another.

    I am using the FFR supplied stainless headers. I’m very impressed by the build/weld quality… save one little thing on one side... Inside the collector on one side there was a chunk of MIG wire stuck near the O2 bung. No big deal, and nothing 2 seconds with a sanding drum on the die grinder didn’t fix. Check yours before installing.
    Headers_01.pngHeaders_02.png

    Hardware:
    The Coyote comes from Ford with one manifold installed, and studs for the other side. From the git-go you’re short 8 nuts… and the Ford nuts are the diabolical crunched/crimped self lockers.
    FFR supplies 16) 10 x 25mm bolts… no washers... ?
    I did save the Ford nuts, but also got 16) 10mm serrated flange nuts, and 16) 10 x 30mm flange-head bolts. This way I could mix-n-match as the situation called.

    **Safety Check**
    Disconnect the battery if it’s installed! You’ll be dangerously close to the output post of the alternator with parts & wrenches when doing the driver’s side!

    Passenger side:
    Super easy install. You can use the Ford studs on every location, however the center two upper locations may give some difficulty with using a deep socket needed to run down the nuts. I chose to replace these two with flange-head bolts.
    Headers_03.pngHeaders_04.png

    Driver’s Side:
    This side is a bit tough. Clearances are really tight, but the header does slide in there, however it won’t go in with the full-length Ford studs in place. (This is where removing them was a benefit)
    Once in there I got under the car, and determined that the rearmost 3 locations would be better served with studs – trying to get a 25 to 30 mm bolt started and run down would be a pain. The other 5 locations I used the flange-head bolts.
    I cut the Ford studs down approx. ¾” from the tip. This leaves about 3 full threads exposed with the stud installed and the nut is run down against the header flange.
    Headers_08.pngHeaders_09.png

    With the exception of the forward 3 locations, every other is a PITA to tighten… there’s room for a full-length wrench in there, but several are 1/16th of a turn for the whole run.
    Headers_05.pngHeaders_06.pngHeaders_07.png
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

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  17. #253
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    I just realized that I'm VERY close to the monumental "First Start" day!

    All of the "Do This, Check That" items on my notepad have been addressed, and if my coolant reservoir hoses show up today (as promised) I should be able to fire it up this weekend!
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  18. #254
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixit View Post
    I just realized that I'm VERY close to the monumental "First Start" day!

    All of the "Do This, Check That" items on my notepad have been addressed, and if my coolant reservoir hoses show up today (as promised) I should be able to fire it up this weekend!


    Jeff

  19. #255
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Build to date

    186 days from delivery...

    jpg00.jpgjpg23.jpg
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  20. #256
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Closing in on "First Start"!

    My "Ford Only" coolant reservoir/puke tank hoses showed up today. Spent a few hours getting them cut to fit and coming up with a couple of brackets to mount the "turtle" under the hood.
    (While waiting for the hoses, I cleaned up, prepped & painted the hood hinges. Project creep again - needed the hinges in place to determine final location of the tank.)

    Got everything mounted and hooked up, and now have 3 gallons of orange Kool-Aid 50/50 mix in the system, with another gallon on standby.

    Reservoir01.pngReservoir02.pngReservoir03.pngReservoir04.pngReservoir05.pngReservoir06.pngReservoir07.jpg

    Put a little over 2 gallons of fuel in the tank as well. Flipped the key on and the gauge now reads 1/8-tank, so I know the gauge & sender works. Also heard the fuel pump kick on and watched the fuel pressure gauge move up. Several more cycles of on/off and the fuel pressure at the engine/fuel rail is at 58psi. and has been holding for over two hours. (no leaks!)

    There's 8 quarts of oil in the sump... It's really looking like we're gonna have the monumental "First Start" very soon!!
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  21. #257
    Senior Member cv2065's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixit View Post
    My "Ford Only" coolant reservoir/puke tank hoses showed up today. Spent a few hours getting them cut to fit and coming up with a couple of brackets to mount the "turtle" under the hood.
    (While waiting for the hoses, I cleaned up, prepped & painted the hood hinges. Project creep again - needed the hinges in place to determine final location of the tank.)

    Got everything mounted and hooked up, and now have 3 gallons of orange Kool-Aid 50/50 mix in the system, with another gallon on standby.

    Reservoir01.pngReservoir02.pngReservoir03.pngReservoir04.pngReservoir05.pngReservoir06.pngReservoir07.jpg

    Put a little over 2 gallons of fuel in the tank as well. Flipped the key on and the gauge now reads 1/8-tank, so I know the gauge & sender works. Also heard the fuel pump kick on and watched the fuel pressure gauge move up. Several more cycles of on/off and the fuel pressure at the engine/fuel rail is at 58psi. and has been holding for over two hours. (no leaks!)

    There's 8 quarts of oil in the sump... It's really looking like we're gonna have the monumental "First Start" very soon!!
    Can’t wait to see it John!
    MKIV Roadster - #9380 - Complete Kit - Delivered 7/17/18 - SOLD 5/2023
    Build Thread #1: https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...V-Build-Thread
    MKIV Roadster - #TBD - Complete Kit - Delivered 11/6/23 - In Progress
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  22. #258
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    Sounds like you’re ready to turn the key one last bit (not sure how you resisted earlier). Looking forward to it!
    MKIV #9542 Complete Kit, Coyote, IRS - Delivered - 2/19/19, First start - 9/8/19, Go Cart - 9/14/19
    1965 Mustang Convertible 4v 289
    Build Thread HERE

  23. #259
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - IT'S ALIVE!!!

    Resistance was futile...

    After double-checking everything, fluids, clamps, bolts, whatever... it came down to "sh*t or get off the pot" - turn the key to "Start" and see what happens.
    Sheryl & I had dinner, went out to the 40 Watt and clicked the "record" button.

    IT'S ALIVE!!!
    This is a no BS as it happened video. Other than switching the key on/off a few times earlier to "prime" the fuel system and check for leaks, this is an absolutely genuine 1st start of a brand-new build.

    The coolant reservoir sucked empty quickly (3 gallons already in), the PS reservoir even faster (added 1/2qt)... but nothing was hemorrhaging on the floor. Not too long after the temp gauge moved off the peg the fan kicked on. IT'S ALIVE!

    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  24. Likes PeteMeindl, GTBradley liked this post
  25. #260
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    Awesome! Great job John! (Camera lady did and excellent job too.). I plan to follow your path pretty close so this makes me even more confident and excited.
    MKIV #9542 Complete Kit, Coyote, IRS - Delivered - 2/19/19, First start - 9/8/19, Go Cart - 9/14/19
    1965 Mustang Convertible 4v 289
    Build Thread HERE

  26. #261
    BadAsp427's Avatar
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    Awesome job. I’m sure you still have a grin on your face. It’s amazing how fast things will begin to move now that that fantastic milestone is out-of-the-way.

    Mk4 20th Anniversary #8690 (#8 of 20) Purchased 8/18/18----Build Started 8/19/18
    Build Thread Click Here / Registry Entry Click Here / BluePrint Engines 347ci / TKO600
    Carb/Heater/Heated Seats/Cruise Control/Drop Trunk & Battery/Custom Cubby

  27. #262
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    Attaboy John! I knew you wouldn't wait to go ahead and light it up. That's pretty much how it works with the Coyotes---no more drama on first start than getting into your daily driver and turning the key

    Jeff

  28. #263
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    Congratulations. Always a great moment.
    -Steve
    Mk IV #8901 - Complete kit, Coyote, TKO-600, IRS. Ordered 5/23/16, Delivered 7/14/16, First Start 8/13/17, First Go-Kart 10/22/17, Registered and Completed 10/18/18. Build Thread: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showt...V-Coyote-Build Graduation Thread: https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...-Roadster-8901

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    woooohooooo! John, that is awesome! Great job - couldn't have gone any better!! What a way to start the new year!

  30. #265
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    Another one making noise! Congrats.

    Dave
    My Build Thread: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showt...ter-Build-9754
    (Most viewed Roadster build thread on this forum!)

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    First Start: 12/30/2017
    Completed: 12/7/2019
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  31. #266
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Congrats! Like Jeff said. Pretty much the norm for a Coyote first start. On my #8674 build, I was testing the starter circuit just to make sure it was alive and engaged properly. Thought I could just bump it to confirm. It instantly started. So unlike your first start video, my first start video was actually the second start an hour or so later. I was going to post when you mentioned only putting 3 gallons or so of coolant in at first. The Ford spec for the Mustang capacity is 15 quarts, and ours usually take a little more. But you've got it covered.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  32. #267
    Senior Member cv2065's Avatar
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    Sounds great John and nice work! Love these first start videos! Hopefully I’ll be starring in mine soon.
    MKIV Roadster - #9380 - Complete Kit - Delivered 7/17/18 - SOLD 5/2023
    Build Thread #1: https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...V-Build-Thread
    MKIV Roadster - #TBD - Complete Kit - Delivered 11/6/23 - In Progress
    Build Thread #2: https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...Build-Thread-2

  33. #268
    Mark Eaton's Avatar
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    Awesome!
    MK4 #9130 , complete kit, arrived 8/10/2017, Street Legal 2/14/2020.
    DART SHP 347, EFI, TKO600, IRS
    http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showt...n-Build-Thread

  34. #269
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    I was going to post when you mentioned only putting 3 gallons or so of coolant in at first. The Ford spec for the Mustang capacity is 15 quarts, and ours usually take a little more. But you've got it covered.
    It took every bit of 4 gallons to get the reservoir to stay between the marks. (heater equipped). It's had several warm up/cool down cycles - life is good, no leaks and holds pressure.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  35. #270
    Boydster's Avatar
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    Woohoo! Congratulations!
    ---Boyd---
    MkIV #9042 build thread
    www.boss427.us
    427W, TKO600, Moser 3.55 rear.
    Delivered Feb 2017, Graduated Nov 4, 2019

  36. #271
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    40 Watt Garage - Mk4 Build - Rear Wall Upholstery

    In previous posts I detailed the upholstery of the rear cockpit wall, and the fabrication of the sliding doors for the "cubby hole".

    In the months since then, I've been on the search for a set of handles/knobs/whatever for the slider doors. Whenever I was in a hardware store or home center I'd peruse the kitchen sections looking. The search paid off.

    I found some handles that closely match the look of my passenger-side grab bar. I want to maintain a "theme" throughout the interior... not a lot of "bling", but just some brightwork where it needs to be - that ties everything together.

    CubbyTrim04.png CubbyTrim05.pngCubbyTrim06.png

    I didn't want to screw this up (or foul the upholstery on the doors!). I set the handles in place on the doors and got a "that looks good" measurement for where they needed to be. I transferred those measurements to a piece of scrap and made a drilling template.

    CubbyTrim07.pngCubbyTrim08.png

    After cutting the supplied screws to size, there's now handles on the cubby-hole doors.

    CubbyTrim09.pngCubbyTrim10.png
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  37. #272
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    40 Watt Garage - Mk4 Build - Rear Wall Upholstery

    Another item that's been on the "nagging at me/back burner" was the openings for the shoulder harnesses.
    Seeing as I upholstered the upper 1/2 of the wall in pleather, I knew that it would not hold up for long with the belts dragging across it.

    I've seen offerings of "grommets" for the openings, but that really didn't solve the problem of the drag of the belts across the opening. I've been kicking this around in my head for awhile.

    There was this 3" stainless band-clamp in the scrapbox that was calling to me. I took some measurements and found that I could get the 4 pieces I needed out of it.
    CubbyTrim11.pngCubbyTrim12.png
    Attachment 100583Attachment 100584

    They were rough-cut to size, mounting holes drilled, and riveted into a stack. When all together they were shaped to size - 4 identical pieces. After experimenting with the bend angle on one, they were bent to the same angle...
    CubbyTrim13.pngCubbyTrim16.png
    Attachment 100585Attachment 100586Attachment 100587


    Mounting holes were drilled, and (after a session on the rag-wheel & polish) they were riveted in place
    Attachment 100589Attachment 100590CubbyTrim15.pngCubbyTrim14.pngCubbyTrim19.png
    Last edited by Fixit; 01-13-2019 at 07:54 AM. Reason: Fixed pic links
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  38. #273
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Wheel Alignment

    Let's just say I'm a little ticked off at FFR right now...
    This not so minor problem is worthy of a notation in the assembly manual - especially when it rears it's ugly head this far along in the build - and it appears to be a common problem when using the power steering rack.

    It's time to get the front end aligned on #9365.
    I dug out my Dads 65+ year old "Bender model 400" camber/caster gauge, and made up a rig to use it on the Roadster.
    IMG_20190116_181508325_HDR.jpg IMG_20190116_181516462_HDR.jpg

    It's 2 lengths of of 1 x 1 aluminum angle, with a piece of 3/16 mild-steel plate in the center. The angle is cut to fit inside the outer lip of the wheel, bearing on the "bead" surface. It's held in place with velcro strapping (the stuff voice/data guys use to bundle & dress cables).
    A length of mason's string is stretched (between two jackstands), and set to be parallel to the frame. The protractor is to verify the wheels are turned to the recommended 20 deg's (L & R) during adjustment, and the string is moved to where it just touches the tire at the correct 20 degs each way.
    (I'll do a more detailed procedure in another post, after I fix what I'm PO'd at FFR about)


    It appears that to achieve the recommended minus 1/2deg camber, and positive 7deg's caster - the rear/aft adjuster sleeves & threaded stubs on the upper control arms will need to be shortened about 3/8" (total) so they don't bottom out before getting to the alignment numbers needed.

    Why has this not been addressed by FFR?
    This will require a significant amount of disassembly, and some tools that "Joe Shadetree" may not have (to shorten the parts correctly).

    I wouldn't have had the slightest problem with modifying the sleeves when I was re-arranging the upper arms (as supplied) and bolting them on the car a few months ago!
    005.jpg 006.jpg

    Having to do this now, when the car is a full-fledged, running, Go-Kartable vehicle is a real kick in the 'nads.
    Last edited by Fixit; 01-17-2019 at 06:00 AM.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  39. #274
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    FWIW, I just did my alignment tonight... It took all of about 20 minutes to shorten the sleeve. It cuts very easy with a hack saw as it is aluminum and the bolt portion cut right off with an angle cutter. A little clean up with a sanding wheel and it was back together in no time. I only had to do this on the passenger side top/rear adjuster and was able to get the 7* setting. I was afraid it was going to be much harder, but pull the one 5/8" bolt and it all swings right out and can easily be pulled off. Don't let this give you any kind of frustration.

    Mk4 20th Anniversary #8690 (#8 of 20) Purchased 8/18/18----Build Started 8/19/18
    Build Thread Click Here / Registry Entry Click Here / BluePrint Engines 347ci / TKO600
    Carb/Heater/Heated Seats/Cruise Control/Drop Trunk & Battery/Custom Cubby

  40. #275
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    I'm not worried about the difficulty... my gripe is there's no mention of the possibility in the assembly manual.

    As we've all seen here on the forum, there are inexperienced builders that question bolts... (something that those of us with more experience building/modifying cars just take for granted), and now during a very late phase in the mechanical aspects of the build the need to modify a critical suspension component comes up.

    The possibility of buggering up the threads, or leaving a burr that will bugger/crossthread the sleeve is a real problem to someone who may not know how to do it properly, and we're dealing with parts that hold the bleeding wheels on.

    I'm thinking about the builder who may not be doing his/her own alignment, and having some hack in a tire shop try to get the recommended settings by unsavory means, or tell the owner it can't be done.
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  41. #276
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fixit View Post
    I'm not worried about the difficulty... my gripe is there's no mention of the possibility in the assembly manual.

    As we've all seen here on the forum, there are inexperienced builders that question bolts... (something that those of us with more experience building/modifying cars just take for granted), and now during a very late phase in the mechanical aspects of the build the need to modify a critical suspension component comes up.

    The possibility of buggering up the threads, or leaving a burr that will bugger/crossthread the sleeve is a real problem to someone who may not know how to do it properly, and we're dealing with parts that hold the bleeding wheels on.

    I'm thinking about the builder who may not be doing his/her own alignment, and having some hack in a tire shop try to get the recommended settings by unsavory means, or tell the owner it can't be done.
    I hear you except (1) It's not always required. I was able to get the full PS caster in my #8674 build without trimming anything. Not sure why the variation, but others have reported the same. Others have had to trim like you did. (2) In four builds, I've seen UCA's from three different suppliers. The version before this one it was often necessary to get a longer one for the front sleeves because they would run out of threads when adjusting for PS. Not making excuses, but maintaining documentation is a huge task. Used to be part of what I did for a living. Changing documentation every time a vendor is changed probably isn't practical. So it's left out, intentional or not. (3) This is talked about in a bunch of build threads and often when PS is mentioned. So it's not a new topic. I know not everyone reads every thread. But this is out there.

    OK, now we've officially read and talked about this for longer than it took to fix. Back to it.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  42. #277
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    10-4... minor rant over deadhorse.gif

    (FFR, just update the page listing the alignment specs with a notation that modification may be necessary depending upon your steering configuration.)
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  43. #278
    Senior Member VAHokie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadAsp427 View Post
    FWIW, I just did my alignment tonight... It took all of about 20 minutes to shorten the sleeve. It cuts very easy with a hack saw as it is aluminum and the bolt portion cut right off with an angle cutter. A little clean up with a sanding wheel and it was back together in no time. I only had to do this on the passenger side top/rear adjuster and was able to get the 7* setting. I was afraid it was going to be much harder, but pull the one 5/8" bolt and it all swings right out and can easily be pulled off. Don't let this give you any kind of frustration.
    Hey Carl, were your adjustments to the sleeves/arms in the same 3/8" range as John? I'm coming up on the IFS soon and may proactively do the mod if there's a consistency in the measurement across builds, otherwise I'll loosely install everything and come back to it later.
    MKIV Complete Kit #9494 l Delivered 1/5/19 l First Start 11/28/20 l First Go-kart 4/11/21 l Carb'd 347 l Mid-shift TKO600 l 3.55 IRS l P/S l Forte Mechanical Throttle Linkage l RT Turn Signal, Drop Trunk l Breeze Upper/Lower Radiator Support, Fan Shroud l Boig Upper/Lower Cool Tubes & Quiet Pipes l 18" FFR Gasser Wheels l Build Thread

  44. #279
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    The 40 Watt Garage - #9365 - Wheel Alignment

    Back to that "Tales of a Toolbox" write-up I did awhile ago...
    Dug around in Dads box and pulled out his (now "vintage") J.H. Bender model 400 magnetic camber/caster gauge. I'm guessing he bought this in the mid 50's, before the true alignment racks became the norm in the shops. It's still in great shape, a few combat scars, but the vials and bubbles are intact which is all that matters. This was designed to stick onto the machined surface of the bearing hub, over the dust cap.
    014.jpg
    That's not possible with the Roadster. The hub is buried in the wheel, and the wheel is aluminum. Had to come up with a way to mount the tool.

    I used 2 lengths of of 1 x 1 aluminum angle, with a piece of 3/16 mild-steel plate in the center. The angle is cut to fit inside the outer lip of the wheel, bearing on the "bead" surface. It's held in place with velcro strapping (the stuff voice/data guys use to bundle cables).
    A length of mason's string is stretched (between two jackstands), and set parallel to the frame. I don't have "lazy Susan" plates, so I taped a protractor to the rig at the center point. (This is to verify the wheels are turned to the recommended 20 deg's (L & R, 40* total) during adjustment). The tires are sitting on a couple of layers of heavy poly sheet for slipperyness during turning.
    012.jpg 013.jpg

    My curiosity got the better of me, and I wanted to see if I could get away with not cutting the threaded shafts of the UCA's, just shave off a bit from the adjuster sleeves. I made up an "X-Ray Vision" tube from some 3/4" EMT, to simulated the adjuster sleeve. I wound up cutting about 3/16" off each shaft, and basically removed the machined/turned down ends of the sleeves.
    017.jpg 018.jpg

    Setting up a front suspension from raw "parts in a box" is an exercise in frustration... especially with fully adjustable arms! (Nothing's designed in for a particular car, they fit anything)
    FFR supplies some rough center to center measurements for the Upper Control Arms (UCA) to get you in the ballpark, but the front end is still really wonky.

    To time-compress about 10 hours work, here's the procedure:

    - Devise a way to easily lock/hold and release the steering wheel in the centered position
    - Center the steering rack. Full Left, Full Right, split the difference, lock the steering wheel down. (This also confirmed my initial assembly when the steering shaft was mounted to the rack. The steering wheel was dead-nuts centered at the middle of the rack travel)
    - Set a rough toe-in adjustment. (This was nothing more than two tape measures, as close to wheel center as obstructions allow, to repeatable reference points on the front and rear of the tires) Turn each side equally in or out!

    Release the steering wheel
    - Set a rough camber adjustment for one side (Crank the UCA sleeves equally in or out as needed).
    - Set a rough caster adjustment on this side (Crank the UCA sleeves as needed, not looking for final numbers, but close).
    Get a good metal machinist ruler, and measure the exposed threads, center to centers, etc. on this side.
    Adjust the opposite side to these rough measurements.

    The thing to keep in mind is that every adjustment interacts with another... and this early in the game they REALLY mess with each other. Repeat the above steps about 38 times... you will be covering the same ground many times. (Remember to lock the steering wheel when setting Toe.)

    Once I got the passenger side dialed in pretty close with the gauge, I moved it to the driver's side, and got it dialed in to the same "close" numbers as the PS (again, the above about 26 times)

    Now I've got a car whose wheels are pointed in the right directions, the UCA's look pretty much "mirror images" of each other, and now you're chasing fractions of a degree settings.
    Sanity Tip:
    At this stage you'll be turning the adjuster sleeves fractions of a turn, and you need to keep track of how many turns.
    On the tie-rod extensions I put a blue Sharpie mark on a flat, and a red mark on the opposite/180 side flat.
    On the UCA sleeves tape was put on a flat.

    Now that things are close:
    - Pick a side, and adjust for Caster first. Get it on the nutz.
    - Adjust this side for Camber **Use your marks** Adjust each sleeve equally in or out as needed, count flats or peaks - you want to tilt the whole assembly, not change the Caster.
    - Run the steering lock to lock a few times, and bounce the suspension.

    - Center the steering
    - Move to the other side and adjust for Caster, then Camber.
    - Run the steering lock to lock a few times, and bounce the suspension.
    - Center the Steering
    - Set Toe-In **Use your marks** Adjust each side equally in or out as needed, count flats or peaks
    - Re-check Caster & Camber on each side. Tweak if needed.
    - Re-check Toe. Tweak if needed.
    - Once #9365 is on the road, I'll correct any steering wheel centering issues with a turn or two on the tie-rods.

    diditmyself.jpg
    Last edited by Fixit; 01-19-2019 at 09:04 AM. Reason: link
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

  45. #280
    Senior Member Fixit's Avatar
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    Hey Carl, were your adjustments to the sleeves/arms in the same 3/8" range as John? I'm coming up on the IFS soon and may proactively do the mod if there's a consistency in the measurement across builds, otherwise I'll loosely install everything and come back to it later.
    When all was said & done, I probably could have gotten away with only shaving the adjuster sleeves a bit... The threaded shafts would be very close to bottoming, but probably wouldn't. Since I went through the trouble of disassembling the rear/aft leg of the UCA, I just went ahead and cut the shafts (The welded one with the BJ is a treat - have a new blade in your hacksaw!)
    John D. - Minneapolis 'Burbs

    1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
    2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5
    2018 Mk4 Roadster w/ Coyote - #9365 - Build Thread Delivery 7/3/18, 1st Start 1/4/19, 1st Road Mile 5/5/19, Legal 6/18/19, In Paint 2/25/21, Done (?) 4/2021

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