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Forum Build Thread Update 12 Sept-4-2019 – 9
Custom Dashboard
I’ve been thinking of what “my” car’s dashboard might look like since I first was attracted to the Gen 3 type 65/Daytona Coupe literally a few months after its SEMA introduction. Now it will really be MY Dashboard, quite cool.
This ability to actually design elements of a car, that you’re then building, is certainly one of the things I’ve enjoyed most during my Factory Five journey.
For the past 2-1/2 years I’ve been scouring the Factory Five Forums and the internet for dashboard and interior ideas and images. No, I’m not going to create a wildly custom off the wall dashboard, but one that I hope blends period correct aspects with some modernization into a functional and pleasing dashboard (and interior). One does spend half or more of your time with your Factory Five car on the inside, looking at that dash, interior, and oh yeah, also the road ahead.
I’ll admit that I’ve seen some great ideas along the way, mostly on the FFR Forums and I’ll use some of what I saw and also hopefully introduce some unique custom ideas too.
I’ve decided that my dashboard will have nine gauges: Speedo & Tach, Water & Oil Temps, Oil Pressure, Electrics, Clock and a multipurpose 4-indicator gauge. I want superior visibility of all of them. Luckily the Gen 3 Coupe redesigned from the Gen 2 vastly improves the location relationship between the steering wheel and Speedo & Tach. They can now be properly seen! Bravo FFR!
I decided that living and driving in HOT Arizona, air conditioning is mandatory for 5 months of the year, so the car and dash had to accommodate AC. I’ve loved the look of the round Audi 2000-2006 TT A/C vents so have bought a set of 4 used units off e-Bay. Luckily for me, their condition and quality is almost like new.
I decided I like the silver on black with red indicator looks, especially when mounted on a black dash/interior of the AutoMeter Pro-Comp Ultra-Lite gauges offered by FFR and functionality for me is OK.
I’ve discovered the New Vintage USA (NVU) Multi-Indicator Gauge which has a blacked out face when not lite and shows turn signals, high beam and emergency flasher lighting when working. Compact and all in one.
Switches will be grouped together on a separate panel below the main dash panel. Specifics TBD, but the usual switches/controls are obvious.
I’m planning on PBS-I system from Digital Guard Dawg, wireless & push button controls for ignition control/start-stop and to add a bit of car security given that the doors won’t likely have locks on them.
Given everything that I want to place on the dash, I’ve designed a full cabin width dash that’s wider than the FFR supplied dash. I want the dashboard to be removable, but quickness is unnecessary, i.e., Not pit-stop friendly. I’ve designed a dashboard that makes use of the FFR supplied aluminum dashboard that bends 90 degrees forward to become the dash top under the windscreen. My dash is a panel that will fasten onto the front of the FFR dashboard and be removable from it.
My entire dash is not yet designed though most is already fabricated. Here’s some snapshots into my design and the actual dashboard:
Starting with the FFR supplied aluminum dash panels.
Here are my gauges:
The Audi 2000-2006 TT A/C Vents:
Add in the 3rd and 4th Audi TT A/C Vents and the 9 Gauges.
You can’t image how many versions of arrangements over many months I went thru to get to this final arrangement. I started designing everything using Photoshop on my PC. Real work mockups much later.
Thanks to Forcefed/Curvey Road Gen 3 Coupe for his great looking Gen 3 Coupe dash, interior and some inspirations I got from it.
The gauges, vents and (representative) switches on the below mock up are just 1:1 prints of them.
Steering wheel mounted to check visibility
After verifying that the looks, function and fit of both the outside AND behind of the dash are OK, I proceeded to the actual sheet metal dash. Note that while FFR Sheet metal is 0.040” thick, my dash panel is 0.065” thick, more than 50% thicker and thus stiffer. I went with the thicker/stronger panel because of the Swiss-cheesed resulting panel of having so many gauge & vent holes. T5052 alum. was used.
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Forum Build Thread Update 15 Sept-4-2019 – 12
This is my seat and harness:
Corbeau Evolution X with fixed back and adjustable lumbar support
Schroth Rallye Cross boltv2 4-Point harness in blue.
I chose the Schroth Rallye harness due to its advanced 4-point system that acts like a 5-point system in severe decelerations (aka, crash) and the very easy ingress, egress and single buckle-up. Essentially there are two loops that one places the arms thru then a single central buckle. No four or five separate loose straps to insert into a common buckle.
I’m not planning to do any actual track racing with the Coupe, just some light track days.
ALERT: My brand new FFR full kit order supplied Simpson Harnesses (red) are now surplus for me. If anyone wants them cheap to replace your worn out and dirty old harnesses, send me a PM with an offer.
EdwardB who’s effectively well over a full year ahead of me in his Gen 3 Coupe build, previously selected, test fit and purchased the Corbeau Evolution X seats while I had already been eying them back in the Fall of 2017. Thank you Paul for verifying they fit and work well. I think were about the same body size so that aspect helps too, as well as having wives that makes it a good idea for us to have comfortable seats in the Coupe.
Thank you also for provide such great mounting instructions, photos of your location templates and seat mounts that can be seen below along with the seat mounts in my car. I took a flyer and trusted those so much that after careful and close examination I directly transferred your mounts and their bolt locations to my car….and with a leap of faith, drilled.
Happily, it all worked out and my seats fit great. The one thing I had to do was slightly bend out the two FFR Coupe floor weld-mounted seat harness attachment tabs. The distance between the tabs was exactly the same 17” width of the seat frame at the down low points where they contacted. I spread each tab 3/8” measured at their tops and now have clearance for seat track movement and gained a full inch in additional rearward seat movement.
The mounting process was first with the floor sheet metal in place and the 4x holes in each seat mount drilled. For both seat mounts, there were three holes into the under seat welded on steel chassis seat pan and a fourth hole into a chassis frame member.
Initial bolt in verification installation of my seats was then with the sheet metal remove, due to it being out of powder coat painting. I was certainly convenient to have the sheet metal removed for this verification fitment.
Size 3/8-16 SS button head bolts were threaded into weld-nuts that were positioned on top of the seat mounts. With all bolts tightened in their weld-nuts I examined the seat mounts and their ability to slide, etc. After removing everything from the car, I re-assembled the weld-nuts to the frame and secured them tight with the button head screws. I then proceeded to drill the holes thru just for the rivet, 2 per Weld-nut and riveted the weld-nuts to the frame with the heads on the underside. I didn’t want any chance for the longish cut off ends to interfere with flat mounting of the seat mounts against the floor.
The seats and seat mounts were then bolted together with the 4x bolts provided with the seats.
I noticed that there were 4 bolts used to mount the seat mount frame and seat slider mechanisms together and the heads of the bolts used were pronounced bumps on the otherwise flat and smooth seat mount frame bottoms. I decided that spacers were needed under the seat mounts to make sure that there was solid end to end metal contact when the seats were secured in the car. I selected some on hand extra washers to use, 0.20” thk. x 1.0” dia. hardened steel washers
Then the seat + mount was positioned into the car, washers positioned and everything bolted in place for the first time. Success! Secure, solid and well positioned.
And, Yes, now it is easier to get in and out of the car.
Of course the seats will come out fairly soon and especially when the sheet metal is permanently installed, etc.
Last edited by Bob Brandle; 09-04-2019 at 06:33 PM.
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Forum Build Thread Update 16 Sept-4-2019 – 13
After the pedal box and pedals were installed, a straight forward task, next up was the supplied Mustang drive-by-wire accelerator pedal assembly installation, a NOT Very Straight Forward Task.
The supplied Mustang Accel. Pedal assemble is designed and built for the Mustang which has different geometry and structure in the firewall, pedal box and steering shaft area. A “normal” mounting place for the Mustang Accelerator Pedal Assembly would interfere with the steering shaft. Since the steering shaft cannot be relocated or even really modified, the Mustang Accel. Pedal Assy. needs to be both modified and creatively located and secured.
There are a number ways to accomplish all of this, including by using the FFR supplied Lokar Accel Pedal Assembly and FFR’s instructions. Not everyone does that and there are some innovative alternative solutions.
I’ve gone my own unique way and hopefully it works out well.
First off, I’ve long admired exotic “racy” looking pedals often in such cars as Porsche, Ferrari, etc., where the all three pedals pads are of the same design/look and they have that bare metal techno-drilled look.
The supplied Wilwood pedal pads are perfect, but there are only two of them, leaving the accelerator pedal pad out in the cold.
But, many months ago, I found in the FFR Forum, Michael Craven’s accelerator Pedal Pad Mod.
Michael bought two spare Wilwood pedal pads (Wilwood P/N 330-11280) of the same design used on the Gen 3 Coupe’s Wilwood brake and clutch pedals.
His mod. is to saw off a horizontal portion of each pedal pad to remove one of the five rows of decorative drill holes. The two pedal pads are butt joined together when they’re mount onto a modified Mustang digital accelerator pedal, resulting in a more traditional longish accelerator pedal pad. Easy said, more difficult to achieve, but doable.
I like Michael’s mod and have implemented that for my Accel. Pedal
Next up was how I decided to and did modify the Mustang Accel. Pedal Assembly and mount it into the Pedal Box/Foot box.
After examining the pedal arrangements of a few of my cars and a few others, examining what FFR has presented us in their design recommendation, reading so many installs in the FFR Forums and thinking about it all, I came to a few conclusions and preferences;
To me, I prefer an Accel Pedal/Pad that is fairly close to the alignment of the other two pedals in height, spacing and forward/backward relationships.
The Mustang Accel Pedal Assy. when quick positioned on the FFR built in mounting bracket places the Accel Pedal far to forward in the footbox for my liking. I don’t want to have to lift my right foot several inches to be even with the brake pedal. I’d prefer them to be much more in the same plane.
I would also prefer the top of the Accel. Pedal Pad to be close to or in alignment with the top of the pads of the other two pedals.
Time will tell if this will work out when I drive the car, but here we go.
So I set out to try accomplish these two locating desires PLUS also make sure the top & left side of the Mustang Accel. Pedal Assembly Clear the Steering Shaft, PLUS have enough clearance space on the right to adequately clear the footbox sheet metal panel (both pedal and driver’s foot placed on the pedal pad, PLUS be spaced far enough away from the Brake Pedal to make for proper driving.
Part of the solution is the need to make the Accel Pedal Assembly narrower to fit in the available space between the brake pedal and the engine/transmission firewall on the right. I ended up sawing completely off 2 of the 3 mounting tabs of the Accel Pedal Assembly and cut off part of the mount of the 3rd, the lower mount.
The top 2 mounting pads, totally removed, will be replaced by two new bolt hole locations closer in on the Accel Pedal Assembly.
Be careful to not saw off or remove too much webbing of the Pedal assembly, those are strength and support design points.
My design includes a 1” thick x 6” long x 2-1/2” wide aluminum spacer block that the cut down Accel Pedal assembly will be mounted onto via 3 bolts.
The use of a 1” thick spacer block effectively positions the Accel Pedal Assy. Towards the driver by that 1” and can position the Accel Pedal Pad closer to in-line with the brake and clutch pedal pads.
The 2-1/2” width and 6” height of the spacer block effectively matches the width and height of the reduced size of the Accel Pedal Assembly.
Below you can see the reduced size and modified shape of the Accel. Pedal Assy. and how it’s mounted onto the Alum. Spacer Block. You can see a new more “tucked in” upper left side bolt location and you can see that the lower left reduced size mounting tab is still in use.
Below you can see the location of the third mounting bolt tucked into the webbing on the upper right side of the Accel Pedal Assy.
Yes, both of these two upper mounting points are not as far out (less mechanical advantage) as the originally designed Accel Pedal Assy. has them, but I believe it will be secured enough. That plastic housing and webbing should be fairly strong and stiff.
The precise location and angling of this block and accel. pedal assy onto the FFR chassis welded on mounting bracket has to be determined by the builder.
Care needs to be done to have the accel pedal assy’s top mounted electrical connector clear both the steering shaft above and brake pedal lever to the left, as seen below.
Note in these photos the angled mounting of both the aluminum mounting block and accelerator pedal assembly. This is to have both clear the right side from the engine tunnel firewall and to position the electrical connection at the upper left of the accel. pedal assy to the left of the steering shalf.
Last edited by Bob Brandle; 09-04-2019 at 06:35 PM.
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Post Thanks / Like - 0 Thanks, 1 Likes
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Senior Member
I may have missed this in the build manual or in your thread, but why choose the rear brake setup you have? It looks like the calipers are stock 2015+ IRS but the brackets are to make them smaller diameter which I didn't think was necessary with the 18" wheels. Sorry if this was covered before!
Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe builder
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Forum Build Thread Update 17 Sept-4-2019 – 14
Continuing with the Accelerator Pedal Assembly mods and mounting;
Here’s some side views of the mounted Accel. Pedal Assy. (ignore the green tape)
Note that I’ve located the Accel. Pedal Assy. as high as I could in order to also raise up the bottom of the Accel. Pedal Arm and the mounting area for the pad and maintain as long an arm as possible for mechanical advantage during operation of the Accelerator Pedal.
I cut/machined a 45 degree angle at the top mounting surface corner of the Accel. Pedal Assy. plastic in order for it to clear the steering shaft. I also angle cut back the alum. Spacer block, but that might not really have been necessary in the final design.
The modifications to this block are an untold story unto itself, of initial design and then some necessary trial and error fitment cuts, grinding and filing. Knowing now what the final design solution is, I could make a “pretty” final version, but, I’m not in production and sales. For me, this is good enough, should be structurally OK and buried deep in the footbox. I may paint it black though (Eastwood Extreme Chassis Satin Black via spray can).
Below is a view of the back side (actually the front side in overall car orientation) and how I mounted some things.
The Alum. Spacer Block and then the Accel. Pedal Assembly are mounted this way:
My design intent was that all of this could be removed, if necessary, in a finished car without removing any sheet metal.
Three riv-nuts are mounted into the FFR welded on Accel. Pedal bracket. Then three flat head or countersunk-head bolts mount the alum spacer block to the welded on bracket. Note: These three bolts are separate from and must not interfere with the three mounting hole locations of the Accel. Pedal Assy.
The bottom bolt of the three Accel. Pedal Assy. bolts is threaded into a tapped hole in the aluminum block.
The other two/top bolts makes use of reversed riv-nuts mounted in a notched out area at the top of the alum spacer block. These riv-nuts are tightly press fit inserted with glue added since the crush securement process normally used for riv-nuts won’t work completely to secure them or hold them in place when the bolt is removed. Essentially these riv-nuts are like a nut that is located in a recessed hole and glued in place. So far, I can get full tightening of the bolts with these riv-nuts.
You can see one such rivet-nut at the left or near corner. Yes, this is kind of bizarre assembly, but I found it quite difficult to get all of this aligned in such a confined foot box space.
The remaining design, fabrication and mounting of the Mod. Accel. Pedal Pads is underway.
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q4stix,
I really just ordered from FFR the stock Mustang GT brakes, 4 corners, figuring that this 1,000+ lbs. or lighter car than the Mustang GT would make them more than adequate for my intentions.
I would think that the rear calipers and their mounting would be keyed in on the specific disc disk size and their proper relationship to the calipers and not at all the diameter of the wheel, which being 18" have plenty of room.
Perhaps Wilwood calipers and supplied discs are larger in diameter, but that's probably what one pays for, etc.
One more thing is that I ordered 18" FFR Halibrand Replica wheels in my original Full Kit order and would think that Factory five would ship the correct size "stock" Mustang GT brakes to me. To me they all seem to fit OK.
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Senior Member
Ahh, I looked at the pictures and thought the calipers were ground going over the rotors and it was the 11.65" package they offered. I was thinking it was that so you could fit it in a smaller wheel. I realize the calipers would need to match rotor size and caliper position.
Looking at the Factory Five images, I think it's mostly due to an interference with the coils overs if they're left in the stock Mustang position (bolting the calipers to the two lugs on the knuckles where the brackets now have to mount). Since I'm changing that part on my build I didn't even look to see if it varied from the Mustang GT setup.
Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe builder
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Member
Bob, these are super useful posts and photos. Thanks for taking the time to upload all this.
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Forum Build Thread Update 18 Sept-8-2019
Custom Accelerator Pedal Assembly Continued:
This is the Mounting & Spacer Bar for the Accelerator Pedal Assembly.
Dimensionally it is nominally 6” x 2.5” x 1.0”
The bar is secured to the chassis Accel. Pedal Assy. welded on Bracket by three ¼-20 Stainless Steel Hex Flat Head Screws that are screwed into ¼-20 Rivet-Nuts that are affixed into the chassis’ welded on Pedal Assy. Bracket. Blue Loctite is used.
The angled cuts are for clearances but might not be totally necessary as seen. I just didn’t want to go back and fabricate this piece all over again since it is hand sawed, filed and drilled.
The two cut down Wilwood Pedal Pads are secured to the fabricated aluminum mounting plate and it’s tapped holes via 4 each 10-24 Stainless Steel flat head screws (1/2” long and ¼” long). Torx or Hex screws are preferred.
The location of the mounting plate and 2 butt joined pedal pads are designed to have the top edge of the top pedal pad be roughly in line with the tops of the similar brake and clutch pedal pads and with the same mounted orientation angle. The mounting plate is secured to the black plastic Accel. Pedal Arm with three 10-24 Stainless Steel Button Head screws, nuts and blue Loctite
The exact location of the three mounting plate holes and their screws were carefully chosen to be located at strategic or advantageous locations inside the web structure of the Accel.
Pedal Leg as seen below.
Washers would have been nice to use, but there simply wasn’t space for them.
By total coincidence, and taken advantage of, the location of these three button head screws placed them directly under the domed area of the pedal pads.
This allowed button head screws to be used instead of countersunk flat head screws.
The Pedal Mounting Plate was spray painted Eastwood Chassis Extreme Satin Black.
With it mounted to the Accel Pedal Arm, the excess length of the plastic Arm was cut off flush.
Mounting everything into the car:
1. The Accel. Pedal Assy. Spacer Bar to the chassis mounting bracket
2. The Ford Mustang GT Accelerator Pedal Assembly to the Spacer Bar
3. The Pedal Pad Mounting Plate to the Accelerator Pedal Assy. Arm
4. The top cut down Pedal Pad to the Pedal Pad Mounting Plate
5. The bottom cut down Pedal Pad to the Pedal Pad Mounting Plate
For now, Blue Loctite was Not used to secure the Pedal Pads to the Mounting Plate, but was used for all other screws since this is desired to be a long term installation.
Checking out the driving feet on the pedals. Spacing looks OK and the feel seems OK.
Still need the floor matting, carpeting and sheet metal panels installed for a better check.
Certainly wide and knobby soled shoes or sneakers are not advised. Whether narrower real Driving or Racing shoes are needed or preferred will have to wait for actual driving.
I guess that's it for now on the Accelerator Pedal Assembly Installation, until I install the painted sheet metal, start hooking up the wiring, install padding and carpeting and start the engine, as I continue with the marathon.
Bob
Last edited by Bob Brandle; 09-09-2019 at 04:57 PM.
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Member
Excellent level of detail, Bob! Thanks. I'm enjoying reading stuff like this while I'm waiting for my marathon to begin. FFR says my coupe will be done 9/21/19. Tick tock...
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Looks great, like the dash layout. One item to check, put the AC/heater unit in and look at how the ducts fit behind the dash. There is not much room and I ended up cutting holes in the dash end plate to fit the hoses.
David W
Mkll 4874 built in 2004
Gen 3 coupe #16 registered 2018 painted 2019
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I think it looks great as well. Another thing to check is your switch layout and do you have enough room behind your lower dash piece assuming this is where you locate them. The Headlight switch, in particular, can be challenging.
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David,
Thanks for the dash complement and also for the heads up regarding the A/C hose plumbing. Yes, there will be a need for 4 main and two additional "defogger" outlets to be fed AC air flow. Though since here in Arizona defogging is seldom a problem only a small amount of air needs to go there.
See my below response to jdavis500 and the composite photo that I'll post explaining a few design ideas I have.
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jdavis500,
Thanks also for the dash complement and switches heads up.
I believe that since I'm planning on mounting the switches & controls on the added angled panel that is outward from the dash and underlying angled transmission tunnel panel, there should be actually additional space in this, "behind the panels" area. I do realize that my switches & controls will be mounted at an angle, not in vertical line with the dash, so while the ideal design location is centered vertically on this panel, I might have to mount the switches & controls slightly higher to make adequate clearances behind them.
Check out the below photos composite that I have put together to help explain things brought up by David Williamson and yourself -
With the switches & controls located further away from the dash (rearward in the chassis), I believe that I can relocate downward and rearward in the chassis an inch or two, much of the wiring and electronics that Edwardb has excellently laid out in his Gen 3 Coupe. With an A/C Plenum design concept by Freds, this should allow me to design and install an A/C Plenum up high on the back of the firewall, where Edwardb has bundled and grouped much of the wiring. Of course, I also have to figure in where the windshield wiper motor and linkages go.
From the A/C Plenum, I would have "compressed" round corrugated A/C hoses connected to the plenum at 3 places that would go straight rearward to 3 of the 4 Audi A/C vents. This would theoretically allow the Dash Panel to be removed and pulled directly rearward a few inches for maintenance or repairs access. And if needed, the hoses could be disconnected from the Audi A/C Vents if the dash needs to be removed further.
the Audi A/C vent to the left of the driver would have routed to it a more conventional A/C hose off the left end of the Plenum. Two small A/C hoses would also be routed from the A/C Plenum to the defogger vents.
Bob
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Bob Brandle
Of course, I also have to figure in where the windshield wiper motor and linkages go...
Interesting to see your ideas here. I went off the reservation a little. You're going a little further. Glad my ideas and pictures have been a resource. My interior pieces are all upholstered now. Hope to have the dash all back together for the last time before the week's out. Will post an update in my build thread.
For the wipers, unless you're doing something different, that should be the least of your worries. The wiper mounts in the body are in front of the firewall and the mechanism fits under there pretty easily. Shouldn't interfere with anything on the cockpit side of the firewall.
Last edited by edwardb; 09-10-2019 at 07:26 PM.
Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
Build Thread
Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020.
Build Thread and
Video.
Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020.
Build Thread and
Video
Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023.
Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.
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cool idea, seems like everybody takes new ideas and adds to them resulting in better cara.
David W
Mkll 4874 built in 2004
Gen 3 coupe #16 registered 2018 painted 2019
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Member
Hi Bob,
Your build is looking amazing. I am actually about to purchase another members 95% complete Gen 2 5.0 Type 65 next week but he has yet to register it. I was wondering how you going to go about this when time comes for you and if there is any useful info you can pass along that will help make the process quick and easy?
Also i live in Cave Creek and work in Scottsdale if that helps with a DMV or 3rd party to go title at.
Last question would be since we have the same motor and control pack, do you have or know of a shop that can custom tune it?
Was going to see if Dynocomp or Goodspeed would be recommended or if there is a better place that specializes in builds like ours.
Keep up the good work and not sure where your located but if you ever need a hand feel free to ask.
Dino 847-505-9364
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Senior Member
looks like it will be nice ride ,thanks for sharing post
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FFR Maven
Curious if you’ll be duplicating Fred’s part list for the AC Plenum or if you’ve found other products from places like Home Depot/Lowe’s or Amazon that you’ll use?
Interested in doing a clean plenum design for the vents as opposed to a bundle of hoses.
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Hi Logan, Sorry, but, No, I didn't go thru with creating a rectangular box channel A/C Plenum system. I started designing one and soon discovered that for my needs, besides the plenum taking a significant amount of space on the rear of the firewall (needed for wiring), the added connection joints coming out of the plenum to the hose then hose to it's end cap/joint then to the dash A/C vent really added up in a very narrow space (firewall to dash). Plus, I wanted some slack in the hosing so that down the road I had the ability of removing the dash panel, pull it a bit into the cockpit and work on wiring or gage attachment issues. The plenum to hose to dash system I was envisioning really didn't allow that. I could have maybe designed 4 hard plastic/metal tubes from the plenum directly rearward to the dash, mating/sealing with foam for instance, but didn't.
What I've ended up with is a (hopefully) carefully thought out can of hose-worms to provide air to the 4 dash vents and 2 defogger vents. It's all built, it fits, but just staged for final assembly into the car later. With two A/C supply vents coming out of the evaporator, I've got one feeding thru a 3" ea. dia. hose then split into two hoses for the two dash A/C vents of the all important driver. The other evaporator outlet provides air to the two small defogger vents and the two passenger A/C dash vents. I've got a Y-joint in this design with two added grafted in small 1"dia hoses for each defogger vent and the reduced size 2" hoses for the passenger dash A/C vents (1-in and 4-out). I'll hang the hoses to the driver area up just underneath the top of the dash so that they clear the wiring and electronics that will be mounted on the transmission cover, along the frame of the chassis and lower half of the firewall. I've got photos. Guess I should publish them or could send a few to you.
Bob
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FFR Maven
I’m trying to visualize as you’re describing them, but a few pictures would sure help illustrate your point!
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Forum Build Thread Update 19 Dec-21-2019
A/C duct hose system and plumbing development
Essentially due to requests, I’ll document some of my A/C duct hose plumbing design & temporary installation.
The final installation won’t be until much later as the final version of the instrument loaded dash and dash top are installed.
Here’s my probably not worthy “Peter Brock-esque napkin design” attempt of documenting the A/C duct system that I’ve fabricated. Never intended to upload this, but now here it is.
The basics of my system are that I have 4 dash A/C outlets (used Audi TT circa 2000-2006) and the 2 defogger outlets at the base of the windshield, which I figure need much less air flow than the dash front A/C outlets. This is particularly so for me here in dry Arizona.
I’ve got the two A/C outlets from the A/C evaporator feeding the (1) driver two air outlets and (2) passenger 2 air outlets plus the two defogger outlets. I figure the driver should get the best airflow.
I bought a third Vintage Air Y joint, two white PVC 90 degree 1” joints and also some 1” ducting for the defoggers. I cut down and joined two Y Joints and mounted the two 1” 90 degree joints into this assembly.
My Gen 3 Coupe will Not have a glove box, so I have open space there for much of this ducting and the double Y joints.
Here are two photos of this assembly put together. Black RTV or similar rubbery compound joins everything together plus tie-wraps also secure the 3” ducts to the joints, but the RTV covers them.
I also crafted joining methods for the 1” ducting to the defogger vents.
Here are a few views with most everything routed, connected and in its general place behind the dash.
The ends of the main 2-1/2 air ducts are just routed their dash vent holes and are not yet trimmed to their final lengths.
Note how the white 90 degree PVC joints start the routing of the 1” dia. hoses to the defogger vents.
Note, some of the reason for the seemingly slightly excess length of the A/C hoses is that I want some flexible length to be able to pull the dash into the cockpit a few inches upon possible gages troubleshooting in the future.
In this last view for now, note that there is a flat bar/bracket above the duct hoses spanning between the dash support bar and the upper firewall. There will also be a second one in front of the driver. These brackets will be used to tie-wrap up, secure & organize the duct hoses to near the top of this behind the dash area and above the wiring & electronics that will be mounted in the lower half of this area. The clear tapes are just temporary to hold some things in place during this fitting and for the photos.
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Hello Bob. Any chance you are in the Scottsdale area? I will be attending the Barrett Jackson auction and was wandering if We could meet? I am approximately 80% done with my Gen 3 Coyote coupe and it would be fun to visit and compare notes. I certainly plan to visit the FFR booth at the auction as well. Doug Dahlgren, Nebraska. FFR. SN 0000069
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Originally Posted by
Nerglhad
Hello Bob. Any chance you are in the Scottsdale area? I will be attending the Barrett Jackson auction and was wandering if We could meet? I am approximately 80% done with my Gen 3 Coyote coupe and it would be fun to visit and compare notes. I certainly plan to visit the FFR booth at the auction as well. Doug Dahlgren, Nebraska. FFR. SN 0000069
Doug, Yes I am located in Scottsdale and just 2 miles North of Barrett-Jackson/West World.
Sure, would like to show you my FFR Coupe project and discuss things with you. I’m out of the country, returning tomorrow and will get back to you then.
Bob
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That will be great! Thanks and talk later. Not sure the best way to communicate but you can also call or text me at 308-991-8206 if it is better.
Last edited by Nerglhad; 01-01-2020 at 11:49 PM.
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Forum Build Thread Update 20 Aug-30-2020 – Engine Installation Part 1
[/SIZE]It’s been a super long time since my last build update and much progress has been accomplished, at least as far as I’m concerned. Enjoy the build, keep it all interesting and just keep making progress are my goals.
There’s too much to list or describe at the moment, but the key recent milestone is the Gen 2 Coyote Engine + Tremec T56 Transmission installation. It all went like clockwork, with precision and success, THANKS to Factory Five’s chassis design and manufacturing and many FFR Forum contributors.
My intent and goal has been that it’s a once and done task, so much has to be in place prior to the install.
Key preparations have included;
Installation of the battery mount just above the pwr. steering rack and all of its cabling laid out and routed thru the firewall to the cut-off switch.
• Brake lines & Tilton 3-compartment reservoir mounted, installed, filled (DOT 3) and bled
• Fuel lines installed along with the with regulator
• Russ Francis chassis harness mostly installed and laid out throughout the engine compartment
• Ford Performance Coyote Harness mostly installed and laid out throughout the engine compartment
• Moroso 63806 Degas Tank location scoped out. More on that tomorrow.
• All sheet metal (and recommend insulation of insulation and carpeting) of both foot boxes should to be fully installed, except if you have removable top pieces they can be off. Absolutely the engine and forward facing sheet metal needs to be installed
• If you have A/C, the evaporator and all pieces within the passenger footbox should be installed thru the bulkhead fittings
• Firewall needs to be installed
• Recommend that entire contents of the driver’s side footbox should be installed. Having the sheet metal off while installing all that goes inside is highly recommended
• Steering shaft needs to be removed from the car
• Before the engine+transmission was installed, I cut off with a cutting wheel approximately 1-1/4” of the bottom of the bell housing, so that the now flat bottom of the bell housing was flush with the bottom of the chassis or slightly above. Basically thru the mid-point of the bottom most two parallel bottom bolt holes. Of course the center located bottom hole was inside the cut off piece. With the engine+trans. installed, the cut point was perfect.
• The starter motor and alternator both need to be removed for ease of engine/trans fitment during installation. The starter motor needs to be installed before fitment of the passenger headers, while the alternator needs to be reinstalled after the driver’s side header is installed.
• Note that I had a drive shaft containment hoop installed before the engine+transmission installation and everything went well and I was able to install the drive shaft with the containment hoop itself installed
• I had not yet mounted the A/C Pump for this engine installation, but I see no reason why it couldn’t be.
• The KYC Power Steering Pump was installed prior to the engine installation (easier to do) but that installation wasn’t necessary
• If one’s in Arizona (Scottsdale here) and it’s summer, it helps (is required) to have A/C in the garage and doors closed. 110-115 Outside and 80-85 inside…..dry heat.
Here’s some photos of the installation with my so helpful and enthusiastic crew, which include my wife Sandra, my daughters Melissa and Andrea and Thomas, Melissa’s boyfriend.
Here’s the 3-car garage-shop with the Type 65 Coupe repositioned to be under the full height clear ceiling and the Coyote+Tremec T56 attached to the 2-Ton Harbor Freight hoist with leveler and ready to be un-cradled from the Factory Five Coyote engine cradle.
Note, I have not used HF jack stands.
Note, Love the epoxy floors
Open WIDE!! No, I’m not doing this alone, the crew is mostly just taking a break before the big install.
Regarding positioning, sometimes the hoist with engine was moved and sometimes the car on the wheel caddies was moved.
A tie down strap with ratchet was used to pull the rear end of the transmission down to get the most useful angle of the moment during installation.
Slow, steady, carefully and with forethought and it’ll all work out.
Last edited by Bob Brandle; 08-30-2020 at 09:09 PM.
Reason: font sizes incorrect
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Post Thanks / Like - 0 Thanks, 1 Likes
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Senior Member
Awesome! Quite a pit crew you have there.
Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
Build Thread
Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020.
Build Thread and
Video.
Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020.
Build Thread and
Video
Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023.
Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.
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Forum Build Thread Update 21 Aug-31-2020 – Custom Moroso 63806 Degas Tank Mounting
Since even before I even received my FFR Type 65 Kit almost two years ago, I’ve been analyzing the location and mounting of the Moroso 63806 Degas Tank. I’ve spent time checking out what others have done, but not knowing if I could do what I ultimately envisioned until the Coyote engine was actually installed in my car’s chassis. I’ve selected and assembled the related close proximity parts, those being the air induction tube, MAF and air filter parts, performed a bit of customization and now can see how it all fits.
SUCCESS!!!
I envisioned the Moroso degas tank directly centered in the chassis’ engine bay, in the V-shaped chassis tube framework. The tank would be located at a very far forward location, under the frame, as Edwardb has located his tank (and has proven it works, Thank You!), but even further forward and more centered to take advantage of the open space of the angled radiator air exit structure.
This further forward location of the tank also has provided more space for the air induction parts. I’ve used the crate engine kit provided Ford Performance Package wrapped-silicone 90 degree air tube. I think it has a tighter radius than many other similar or metal tubes. Yes, it’s nothing of beauty, maybe even ugly, but does work. In my resulting custom design, the Ford Performance air induction tube with MAF and larger of the two supplied air filters I received, can be positioned directly downward, out of the way and perhaps to a bit cooler air source too.
Here’s how it looks:
Note that the individual radiator/engine coolant flow and degas hoses are not yet installed in these photos.
The entire Ford Perf Induction Air Tube, MAF and air filter assembly are freely floating/hanging down in place. There’s nothing pulling it inward toward the engine and away from the degas tank in these photos.
Still TBD is some sort of custom support, bracket, etc. for the air tube, MAF and air filter assembly so that they stay together (Hello early EdwardB 20th Anniv. Roadster experience) and also stay in place not touching the degas tank, etc., since even with the tank cut out, it’s tight down there.
There is over one inch of clearance space between the bottom of the air filter and top of the battery tray upper bracket.
I’m using an Odyssey Extreme P925 battery and the mount is an Artec Industries battery mount specifically for that battery. I’ve had it powder coated Satin Black to match the chassis.
Attachment:
There are 4 attachment bolts (SS button head 10-24) that securely hold the degas tank in place all using Rivetnuts in the chassis tubes.
Two make use of custom aluminum L-brackets that attach to the tank’s integrated bracket strip and then the chassis frame.
A fabricated aluminum U-bracket that “holds the tank” goes under the tank and up the sides and is attached via two bolts into Rivetnuts in the underside of the chassis V-frame tubes.
Yes, the Moroso degas tank has had to undergo some modifications for this custom installation, as follows.
1. I cut (hand saw) two relieve notches in the front facing tank bracket strip. These allow the tank to move forward and further under the chassis frame and right up to the sloping portion of the chassis radiator ducting frame.
2. The hose tube fitting of the tank on the sloped forward surface had to be removed, plugged and relocated on the driver side via an outside welding service. This allows for ease of hose attachment and eliminated the fitting and hose interference with the sloping radiator ducting frame and sheet metal.
3. I decided that downward hanging engine MAF tube and air filter were too close to the bottom rear edge of the degas tank and I didn’t want any contact during engine running or car operation. So I hand cut out (hand sawed) a clearance notch area in the tank and had the same welder weld in boxing plates to seal the degas tank.
Closer look of the tank modifications:
The original tank mounting tab has two notches cut out to clear chassis frame tubes.
The sloped surface hose fitting port has been relocated to the side and its original opening weld patched.
Since this degas tank is nearly totally hollow and open inside with no baffles, I figured that as long as this hose fitting port is at the same level and close to its original position, it should work with no problem.
Note several views of the clearance notch area cut out (hand sawed) at the lower rear tank edge and its welded closure. The notch can only be so big because there’s a small vent tube just inside and then the large drain tube.
Not shown in any of the mounted degas tank photos is a very thin neoprene cushion strip (<1/16” thk) between the top of the tank and the chassis frame that I’ll install for cushioning.
Comments or Questions?
Last edited by Bob Brandle; 08-31-2020 at 03:53 PM.
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Excellent pictures and lighting -- you planned well and it shows.
Great job!
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Senior Member
Boy you worked hard to get the tank moved over and higher. Good job! Should work fine there. Intake in that position should be fine. Try to clock the MAF sensor around to the front as much as you can. It's recommended to be in the longest air path possible, e.g at the outside of any curves. Don't know your plans for a custom tune, but wherever it ends up, leave it there as the calibration will be for that location.
What is the hose with the insulation around it? Is that the PCV hose? Haven't seen one wrapped like that. You won't need the connection on the RH side of the 90 degree silicone tube. So it will need to be capped. Funny you mentioned the intake on my Roadster falling apart. Almost forgot about that. . Because of that, I've switched over to T-clamps on my Roadster and now the Coupe.
Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017.
Build Thread
Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020.
Build Thread and
Video.
Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020.
Build Thread and
Video
Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023.
Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.