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Thread: Factory Five and The Forum from Dave

  1. #41
    Thinker of thoughts FFRWRX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    But mostly, on a personal level, I don't appreciate being judged or being told how I should think. Enough already.
    I guess I missed the part where he judged you and told you how you should think.

  2. #42
    Brandon #9196 TexasAviator's Avatar
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    Stallion, first off I have nothing against you, its your approach. You must understand that you are the exception here. I dont represent FFR so I am being a bit more honest with the situation. Kind of like dismissing someone that just cut you off in traffic and you dont care cause you have cruise control on and you have other things to worry about on your way to work.

    Its not good business for a company to devote 90 percent of its time to 10 percent of its customers. Stallion, imagine if everyone did what you did, this forum would be a bear, orders would be further delayed and the orders that had been established would pay a greater price.

    I believe Dave could get enough stock and parts but its the 3rd party vendors that would have to step up their game. If he did order enough to get ahead of the orders I believe we will see a substantial increase in price to the kits since the overhead would need to be covered for many years based on the sales at their current pace. Add in the new tarriffs and everchanging Trump economy... I would rather Dave play it safe and not worry too much about back orders. This doesn't meant to stop trying to improve the procurement system but being a realistic customer in the mean time is part of this.

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  4. #43

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    Here's to Dave Smith and FFR.
    I'm only going to say it short and sweet. No business is 100% perfect. The BEST companies are those who strive to be the best in their industry, I have been dealing with FFR for a little over one year now (after wanting to do this for over 43 years) and have found Dave and everyone at FFR to be the most customer responsive and professional organization I've ever dealt with. I run a manufacturing business and let me tell you, I often tell suppliers that FFR is a model company when it comes to "CUSTOMER SERVICE".

    Just yesterday as I was continuing to work on my MK4 and was feeling so proud and LUCKY to be building this LIFE LONG DREAM of mine. I'm convinced that I could not be doing this without FFR and its commitment to what they do.

    That being said, to all in the forum that are living their dreams and DAVE SMITH (the dream maker) and everyone at FFR "KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK".

    Merry Christmas to all and to all a Good Night.

    God Bless us every one

    Ron LeBlanc

  5. #44
    Out Drivin' Gumball's Avatar
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    Dave - Thanks for all you and your team does to provide us with the canvas to create our dreams. I challenge anyone who is interested in building their own car to find a better company to help fulfill their goals. That alone is a testimony to all that your team does right.

    From the day I arrived at FFR to pick up my kit after ten years of wanting one, on the morning that Two Guys Garage was filming their cruise to Plymouth - and you still took two hours out of your busy morning to show us around your facilities like a proud father, to the past four summers and 13,000 miles in which every stoplight and fill-up is an impromptu car show with so many questions and even more compliments, I've never been disappointed.

    Merry Christmas to you, your family, everyone at FFR, and all of my brothers-and-sisters-in-building!!!!
    Later,
    Chris

    "There are no more monsters to fear, and so, we have to build our own."
    Mk3.1 #7074

  6. #45

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    Backordered parts and FFR Customer Service have been issues forever, and Dave's crew have always tried to make customers whole as fast as was possible. Following is an email I sent to FFR in May 2015, about 4 weeks after my '33 Hot Rod kit was (mostly) delivered.

    You guys ROCK! It’s so nice dealing with a company that actually seems to care about their customers.

    Yesterday I received the headers, steering rack, latch spacers and door hinge arms – and an envelope with the Certificate of Origin and Serial Number Plate. Obviously you sent all this stuff last Thursday, well before receiving my email noting their absence. Now the only item that I know I’m missing is the Grill. (Any word on that piece?)

    Thanks for the fast action clearing up the shortages so far. You seem to have the logistics part down pat, as long as your vendors cooperate!

    Regards,

    Keith Kelly

    IMHO, there will always be supplier issues and it is not possible to achieve perfect customer service. However, my experience has been that Dave and his crew are always trying to improve and always do the best they can to make their customers happy.

    Dave: Thank you and all your folks for all that you do. Have a Merry Christmas, a Happy and Successful New Year, and ignore the occasional random NPC who sneak into the forums just to drop turds in the punchbowl.

  7. #46
    Seasoned Citizen NAZ's Avatar
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    When this first came out I decided to contact the Better Business Bureau in Wareham to file an honest review of FFR from my experience as a customer to give some balance to what seemed a disgruntled customer's low opinion or the company. It's taken this long to get the local BBB to post my review. Twenty-four years in business and I'm the first to rate them -- how can that be? My guess is that only people that are pissed will take the time to contact the BBB.

    So if there are others out there that want to publicly share their rating of FFR outside this forum just Google BBB and on the main page you can search for FFR and walk through the steps of leaving a review. If half those that posted here were to file a review I'm sure FFR would have a five-star average posted on the BBB website.
    Dart Little M 406" SBC 800 HP N/A & 1,100 HP on nitrous, 2-spd Powerglide with trans brake, 6,000 RPM stall converter, narrowed Moser 88 3.90:1 spool with 35-spline gun-drilled axles & Torino bearings, custom parallel four-link, custom tube chassis & roll cage NHRA certified for 8.5-sec (only two FFR Hot Rods have this cert).

    33 Hot Rod Super Pro Drag Racer Build: 33 HR NHRA Cert Roll Cage Build

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  9. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Papa View Post
    Stallion:

    What is your purpose on this forum? If it's nothing more than to be an antagonist, we don't need that here. It wasn't your "catalyst" that caused FFR to make the changes Dave described, as it's clear to me that those were already in play. Had you simply called FFR to express your concerns, you would have been told what was being done to make things better and you wouldn't be seen as the fool you've made yourself appear to be. I certainly hope you are satisfied and can let those of us that want to help each other build our cars get back to the business of doing that.
    To answer your question, I am still trying to understand:

    A. Why it is acceptable to pay $20k+ for a kit and not receive all of the parts when the kit is delivered?
    B. Why it is acceptable to not be notified of parts on back order until the kit actually arrives?
    C. Why it has been 4 months and we still do not have all of the parts?
    D. Why FFR has not addressed its supplier issue, which apparently is a very long running problem?
    E. Why the status quo is acceptable?
    F. Why I should be quiet about it?
    Last edited by Stallion; 12-30-2018 at 11:54 AM.

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  11. #48

    Steve >> aka: GoDadGo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stallion View Post
    To answer your question, I am still trying to understand:

    A. Why it is acceptable to pay $20k+ for a kit and not receive all of the parts when the kit is delivered?
    B. Why it is acceptable to not be notified of parts on back order until the kit actually arrives?
    C. Why it has been 4 months and we still do not have all of the parts?
    D. Why FFR has not addressed its supplier issue, which apparently is a very long running problem?
    E. Why the status quo is acceptable?
    F. Why I should be quiet about it?
    I'll answer those questions posed to Papa Dave:
    No, none are acceptable, but Dave and his crew will make it right.
    They are doing the best that they can and are attempting to deal with the demands of a very strong economy.

    Suggestion For Your Project:
    Consider selling your kit and buying a Porsche or maybe a Corvette instead of building a Factory Five.
    Many folks are willing to purchase FAILED PROJECTS so consider giving up and buying your dream.

    Before You Do Either, Please Watch These Videos Because It Explains A Lot About Dave Smith & His Team:
    https://youtu.be/6ckgfkPU8Ss
    https://youtu.be/RU2tY3M43HM

    Good Luck From The Dark-Dart Side Mr. Stallion, Good Luck!
    Last edited by GoDadGo; 12-31-2018 at 10:23 AM.

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  13. #49
    Senior Member AZPete's Avatar
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    Mr. Stallion, when you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.
    818S/C : Chassis #25 with 06 WRX 2.5 turbo, ABS, cruise, PS, A/C, Apple CarPlay, rear camera, power windows & locks, leather & other complexities. Sold 10/19 with 5,800 miles.
    Mk3 Roadster #6228 4.6L, T45, IRS, PS, PB, ABS, Cruise, Koni's, 17" Halibrands, red w/ silver - 9K miles then sold @ Barrett-Jackson Jan 2011 (got back cash spent).

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  15. #50
    Thinker of thoughts FFRWRX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoDadGo View Post
    Consider selling your kit and buying a Porsche or maybe a Corvette instead of building a Factory Five.
    Many folks are willing to purchase FAILED PROJECTS so consider giving up and buying your dream.
    Why do you have to say something like this? You basically acknowledge that back orders are not acceptable.

  16. #51

    Steve >> aka: GoDadGo
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    Quote Originally Posted by FFRWRX View Post
    Why do you have to say something like this? You basically acknowledge that back orders are not acceptable.
    My comment is simply a little Southern Style Sarcasm intended to invoke a little introspective patience for our troubled family member.

  17. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stallion View Post
    To answer your question, I am still trying to understand:

    A. Why it is acceptable to pay $20k+ for a kit and not receive all of the parts when the kit is delivered?
    B. Why it is acceptable to not be notified of parts on back order until the kit actually arrives?
    C. Why it has been 4 months and we still do not have all of the parts?
    D. Why FFR has not addressed its supplier issue, which apparently is a very long running problem?
    E. Why the status quo is acceptable?
    F. Why I should be quiet about it?
    I have to say, I've been watching this from afar but hope this will help.

    Answer: (My Opinion and Thought)
    A - Are you telling everyone here that you have never ordered something only to have it be on back order for a period of time? Well now you just ordered several thousand somethings... sure there are going to be some back orders. It is NOT out of the ordinary.

    B - It is not acceptable, it has been the standard, and I believe Dave Smith has made it clear that he is working to improve this part of the process. I can tell you that right up to the day your kit is shipped, they are adding parts to boxes that come in at the last second to prevent your B/O (POL) list being longer than needed. For example, if you look at your list(s) you will most likely see where a part is listed as in one box, but next to that part is indicates that it is in another. Well chances are, the first box was all ready packed and ready to ship w/o that item, but it came in just in time to throw it into another box. So truthfully, until the kit is loaded on the truck they really do not know what parts are not going to be with it. Sure, I think it could be a good practice for FF to email the final POL to the buyer the day the kit ships, this would then give you a weeks prior notice. But in all fairness, how is that going to truly help you?

    C - Ok, I don't have an answer for this, no one on this forum does. But, I know that FF does and if you call or email them, they will give you an update. It may not be the best update because it will be based on the update they have received from the supplier, unless FF is the supplier. For the purpose of this thread, I think we would be interested in knowing what you have on B/O for 4 months.

    D - I know for fact that FF address supplier issues all the time. That is why they now use BBK headers instead of Hooker. Or why I'm waiting on a "New" style bumper -vs- the old style that wasn't just right according to FF. And if they have a supplier that consistently creates a problem for them, I'm certain they will work to find another supplier and "fire" the failing supplier. Remember, everyone that has bought a FF kit has had some kind of B/O, but I'd be willing to bet the list is different for everyone. I.e. They are not out of the same part all of the time, or they would find a different supplier for that part and the current supplier would be loosing a very good client in FF.

    E - Why isn't it? If Dave Smith and the FF team are always working hard to make improvements then that is a good thing. If they were doing nothing, that would be a different story. Remember, in just about everything, there is the 80 / 20 rule. 80% is good to go, and then there is always the 20% that is the problem. Just as soon as you fix part of the 20%, something else falls into that 20% to fill the gap. It's growth, it is the status quo.

    F - Because while you are entitled to your opinion, sometimes it is best to keep your thoughts to yourself. Especially if you are new to the process or environment. I don't think that if you were standing in the middle of a bar full of drunk die hard Cowboy's fans you would stand up and yell "the Cowboy's suck" even if it is your opinion, your entitled to it, but it would/could cause a huge uprising that you most likely would not want to endure. (FYI, I do not have feeling for or against the Cowboy's, just the first NFL team I thought of for this thought. And I do not think that all FF owners are drunks...)

    Stallion, most everyone on here feels and understands your pain/frustration. A pain/frustration that you have made clear. A pain that is understandable. But, seriously do what you started out wanting to do; Build your Mk4 Roadster... Enjoy the build, the journey. The people on this forum are some of the most generous and helpful people you will find. You will most likely need their help. You have joined a "family" here, don't let a few back ordered parts hinder your chance to get some help or assistance in the future from this family. In the amount of time and frustration that you have spent worrying about the B/O parts, you could have enjoyed the time of building and creating your very own masterpiece. Shared your own cool modification or asked for assistance to how to complete a complicated task on your build. Either way, know that your parts are coming, FF guarantees that... And they will send them to you just as fast as they get them. So how about a build thread and some photos from the "Stallion"
    Last edited by BadAsp427; 12-31-2018 at 07:10 PM.

    Mk4 20th Anniversary #8690 (#8 of 20) Purchased 8/18/18----Build Started 8/19/18
    Build Thread Click Here / Registry Entry Click Here / BluePrint Engines 347ci / TKO600
    Carb/Heater/Heated Seats/Cruise Control/Drop Trunk & Battery/Custom Cubby

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  19. #53
    Senior Member dallas_'s Avatar
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    If you have ever built a kit from any supplier in the world, you will know that all of them will have some back ordered parts.

    If you can't deal with that, don't build a kit.
    FFR 7123 tilt front, Levy 5link/wilwoods/LCA's, webers.
    SL-C, LS3 525, Mendeola SDR5,

  20. #54
    Senior Member ztoolman44's Avatar
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    Let me add my two cents. I can empathize with the frustration of not getting what you expect in this new "everything overnight" world but...

    I recently visited the factory to do my own due diligence before plopping a relatively large chuck of cash in the hands of a stranger. I called ahead, made arrangements for a tour and did as much research as possible. Upon arrival, I was greeted promptly at the door, enjoyed a nickel tour and was given free range of the place to look at whatever I wanted and ask questions to my heart's content. Dave was having a meeting with a few other employees and noticed me oogling the cars in the showroom. Although I was being taken care of already, he was kind enough to interrupt his meeting to walk over to me and shake my hand and introduce himself. We started chatting and he took the time to listen to my ideas for a build (not an average build either), showed genuine interest and enthusiasm and helped me decide on the right purchase for me. Not the right thing for him. I ordered my kit that day without reservation or hesitation.

    If anyone can find a better value for a hand built vehicle I encourage them to share it because I've done the math and I couldn't find anything close. If parts are occasionally on back order because they come from small, local individuals, I'm OK with that. If parts are on back order because FFR cant get it for a better price, I'm OK with that. If parts are on back order because there was a quality issue, I'm OK with that. As long as there is a legitimate reason that has been recognized and someone is working on it I'm OK with it. I'll put up with quite a bit to support a local company that supports local vendors and shows me respect when I come in to potentially make a purchase. This is supposed to be a hobby, done for the enjoyment of doing it. Not a competition to completion.

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