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Thread: please critique my (already started) bodywork stages

  1. #41
    Senior Member rich grsc's Avatar
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    WHO the hell runs outa RUM? What kinda sick place do you live in?

  2. #42

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    I KNOW RICH ! I actually think I just get "SLAMMED" and forget where I left the bottle. OR ! it's my daughter hiding it from me to pay me back for playing tricks on her all the time...….. not very "Piratey" of her.....but, SHE LEARNED FROM THE MASTER !...DA rUM

  3. #43
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Yesterday, finished 220 standing on the feather fill (cuz I read the P-Sheets )
    Today got 3 coats of PPG FinishLine JP202 2K primer mixed 4:1:1.
    That stuff is way nicer to spray compared to Feather Fill. Reduced it sprayed pretty easy through the 1.3 tip in my gun. (P-Sheets say 1.3-1.6 tip)
    It actually went on really smooth on most of the car. I can't find any orange peel.
    A couple of spots show what looks like a lot over-spray. And a couple of runs on the inside of the doors. No runs on any of the main surfaces though.
    Oddly enough, both over-spray spots are in the same(ish) place. The "Gully" on the top front of the nose, between the headlights and the center nose.
    Not sure how that happened. Gun angle when spraying that part of the car? Seems curious that I got the same overspray pattern in the same spot on both sides of the car.
    anyway... one more step closer to color. .. despite the revelation that I have still MORE SANDING TO DO!!! Will it ever end!
    I've said it before, and I'll say it again... you guys who do this for a living are da-FREAKIN' CRAZY!!
    2016 MK4 | '99 Explorer 5.0 | E303&600cfm carb | T5z + 3.55 | 3-link | SN95 | PB/PS | FR500 17" 315&275 |

  4. #44

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    Well, I believe I told you 1.7-1.8 on the 2k.....but what do I know.....tech sheet ,smeck sheet.....dry times,THAT'S WHAT YOU GET FROM TECH SHEETS ! Tech sheets are like the Book of Bartholomew and Morgan...….more of a "guideline". As for the funny overspray spots,,, The body creates a vortex in that area. Very turbulent...da bat

  5. #45
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Is there a magic trick I can use to minimize that turbulence?

  6. #46
    Senior Member rich grsc's Avatar
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    Hang from the ceiling by your toes, like a bat??

  7. #47

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    Yep.....go in fast and close. Paint may not be a problem (thinner viscosity)….unlike thick primer through a 1.3 (WHO EVEN DOES THAT !!) skidd,,,,this is where you raise your hand.....now take a bow...da Bat

  8. #48
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    I can't take a bow, I'm hanging from the ceiling by my toes!!

  9. #49
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Finished block sanding 320 today. You guys weren't wrong about that fine talc powder dust getting everywhere. Brutal!
    funny how some guide coat and a sanding block can so easily show orange peal in a surface that otherwise looked smooth to the eye.
    Next weekend... 400 wet.
    2016 MK4 | '99 Explorer 5.0 | E303&600cfm carb | T5z + 3.55 | 3-link | SN95 | PB/PS | FR500 17" 315&275 |

  10. #50

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    400 has too much scratch…. Wet sand with either 500 or 600, seal, shoot. I seal over 500

  11. #51
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    So I should go straight to 600 wet after the 320 I just finished?

  12. #52

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    Yes ! I know it sounds like a big jump but grit is kinnda exponential . There is about as much difference between 150 &220 as there is between 320 &600. Now I know I keep saying 500 (for a good reason !) ….but you should use 600. If you are tearing your sheet in 1/2 and folding into 3rds you should sand about 2-2.5 sq feet per 3rd. It's all about getting an even mechanical tooth (or scratch) . If you over sand your paper you will loose the tooth for the paint. To sand the body it should take approx. 8 halves, or 4 full sheets. Hood, 1/2 sheet. Deck, half sheet, doors+or-_ full sheet. Hold that paper flat, watch edges digging in and use a sanding pad between the paper and your fingers wherever possible (that's about 98 percent of the car) . Lots of fresh water with a little soap in in. An empty 1qt plastic bottle works well to rinse as you sand....good luck....da Bat.....btw, you will be surprised how fast it sands this time.

  13. #53
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Nice.. thanks Bat.
    I have a 25 pack of 600 grit wet sand paper that is already cut to 5-1/2" x 9" sheets. Those are what you call 1/2 sheets right? Which means I should consume about 12 or so of these in this stage.
    I gotta be honest.. I'm glad you said I can skip the 400 wet stage I had planned. I'm soooooo over sanding!!
    And thanks again for reminding me about not over-using a piece of paper. It's easy to forget that it's not just about making it smooth and flat, but also "tooth" for that bite.
    2016 MK4 | '99 Explorer 5.0 | E303&600cfm carb | T5z + 3.55 | 3-link | SN95 | PB/PS | FR500 17" 315&275 |

  14. #54

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    Yep ! those are 1/2 sheets And yes between 12-16. Your gonna loose a couple sheets working the jambs. We cross sand everything but when I'm done I make a couple linear passes in the valleys of the front and rear hips (cross sanding those can leave groves)….we call them "clean up passes". Short linear strokes so you don't create any long grooves...da bat

  15. #55
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    is that "Short Linear Strokes" a rule for the entire car? Or just the "in the valleys" clean up passes?
    I know this 600 grit stage, is a "finishing" stage of sorts. Smoothing out the 320 scratches, making a bite for the sealer.
    So.. it's not like I need to use a long-block and the usual criss-cross pattern.
    But.. I do still want to use the criss-cross pattern right?
    2016 MK4 | '99 Explorer 5.0 | E303&600cfm carb | T5z + 3.55 | 3-link | SN95 | PB/PS | FR500 17" 315&275 |

  16. #56
    Senior Member Presto51's Avatar
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    Maybe a little visual aid to help to understand what Da Bat is talking about. The method in the video is dry sanding before sealing. The wet sanding method eliminates the need for sealer, which helps in reduce cost in material etc. But the techniques in the video is about the same.



    Hope it helps.

    Ron
    "May you be in heaven a full half hour before the Devil knows you're dead"

  17. #57
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    That did help... thanks. Looks like I pretty much had the right idea too. so... Scratch-Removal 101.
    2016 MK4 | '99 Explorer 5.0 | E303&600cfm carb | T5z + 3.55 | 3-link | SN95 | PB/PS | FR500 17" 315&275 |

  18. #58
    Senior Member karlos's Avatar
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    Interesting video. Tried to follow along but the only thing I came away with is the knowledge that I didn’t pay Miller nearly enough...
    --
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    Miller Customs Bodywork & Paint

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  20. #59
    Senior Member Presto51's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karlos View Post
    Interesting video. Tried to follow along but the only thing I came away with is the knowledge that I didn’t pay Miller nearly enough...
    Oh he knows you didn't pay nearly enough, but like in the God Father, wait till he "asks" you for a favor in the future.

    Ron
    "May you be in heaven a full half hour before the Devil knows you're dead"

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  22. #60
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by karlos View Post
    ...Tried to follow along but the only thing I came away with is the knowledge that I didn’t pay Miller nearly enough...
    Funny thing is that when he and I talk we both think we don't charge enough...so now that we're all on the same page it sounds like the time is right for a rate adjustment

    Jeff

  23. #61

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    Well! If the RING brothers …..whatever ! Chris Cross everything you can (sometimes ya just can't) ….EVERYBODY SAY JUMP, JUMP,,,,,,, The clean up passes (with short linear strokes) are for the valleys ……(we all know you've had lots of practice with that)…..(because WE have all had lots of practice with that )….oh, and it was not lost on me that he used 400......what a waste of time......I have much more to say but to be honest I'm in a bit of a "snit" smart money don't push me when I'm in a "SNIT"...da Bat

  24. #62

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    Still SNITTING but I forgot to say.... all this wet sanding with 600 should be done with a rubber sanding pad roughly 2.5X4in. kinda like thick wetsuit material ,,,,also it has several holes (swiss cheese) bout .5in .

  25. #63
    mburger's Avatar
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    I’m literally eating popcorn reading this thread waiting for the SUTU address. Funny stuff!
    Mark
    Mk1, Frame #1929 stock 1990 EFI 302, T5, 8.8 axle 3:55, PS, Heidts, heat, fresh air vents, Russ Thompson Turn Signal mod, windshield wings FFR front lower control arms, Speedhut gauges, Alex's glovebox, cup holders. charging ports. 70K on the motor and 7,200k on the car.

  26. #64
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    I was watching that video, and biting my lip ... 400 grit... 400 GRIT!!! Lol.

    Hey.. I have one of these. Is this the block you are talking about?

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B003WUYG1O

    It seems a bit too stiff though. I've only really used it on a few if the really flat surface and.

    I also have a set of SoftSanders. I really like them . The feel way less like they try to dig in. They seem to conform to the curves (curves FTW) really nice. Those and this 16" K-Block have been my go-to. I was planning to use these SoftSanders for the bulk of the wet sand stage.

    You know... Bat doesn't even have my car, and somehow I feel like I haven't payed him enough either!

  27. #65

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    SO, NO, I don't like that pad you have. I have one of those and it just sits on a shelf (the elf likes to play with it). I couldn't find one on-line but if you shoot me your address in a PM I'll send you one of mine(has built in magic). I have been using these pads for 50 years.....No, not the same one. Most paint suppliers have them...da bat

  28. #66
    Senior Member Presto51's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j.miller View Post
    I have been using these pads for 50 years.....No, not the same one. Most paint suppliers have them...da bat
    Man I sure glad that you clarified that, the visual that was popping into my head was really frightening

    On another note don't forget to play the correct hand sanding music. I usually play this at max power, to help to get in the proper Zen state of mind.



    Ron
    "May you be in heaven a full half hour before the Devil knows you're dead"

  29. #67
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Dude.. seriously.. you're going above and beyond here.
    Do you think this SwissCheese pad you're referring to is better enough than these SoftSanders?

    https://www.amazon.com/Style-Line-ST...dp/B002YKRKS4/

    Or.. so you think these should work just fine? They sure have worked awesome for me so far. I've used the heck out of the Yellow and Blue blocks.
    What about this one? Prime can have it delivered by Friday.

    https://www.amazon.com/Motor-Guard-S.../dp/B003WUYG1E

    I was hoping/planning to get the 600wet sanding started this weekend. Assuming I have what I need.
    2016 MK4 | '99 Explorer 5.0 | E303&600cfm carb | T5z + 3.55 | 3-link | SN95 | PB/PS | FR500 17" 315&275 |

  30. #68
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    lol... Thanks ron.. now a Billy Squire song is stuck in my head!!
    At least you didn't post this one. (gotta be the worst video of all time)
    2016 MK4 | '99 Explorer 5.0 | E303&600cfm carb | T5z + 3.55 | 3-link | SN95 | PB/PS | FR500 17" 315&275 |

  31. #69
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Ok.. tried something. That one block I have that Bat says he hates.

    (https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B003WUYG1O)

    I agree.. I don't love it either. So.. I cut off the blue soft side from the stiffer black side. It's night and day better. I think it's now totally useabe. Quite a bit softer. It easily conforms to the curves now. Starting to wish I did this long ago.

  32. #70

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    DUDE ! YOU SO GET THE "TWIG AND BERRIES" AWARD !!! Good on ya mate ! What you have now is about as close to what I want you to use …..without the magic of course.. At this point we are not blocking, we are prepping for paint. Sooooo, you are good to go with your "double throw down modified double custom hand pad" The other thing I was going to suggest was cutting a gray Scotch Brite to size and using it for a pad for your paper. The reason we want something soft is so it doesn't dig grooves with the edges. You are ALL OVER THIS SON ! Start with the flat stuff so you get a feel for the new sanding style …...I'll be back to check on you later...da bat

  33. #71
    Senior Member Presto51's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j.miller View Post
    DUDE ! YOU SO GET THE "TWIG AND BERRIES" AWARD !!! You are ALL OVER THIS SON ! Start with the flat stuff so you get a feel for the new sanding style …...I'll be back to check on you later...da bat
    Hey Jeff when do you tell him about the baby's a$$ feel?

    Ron
    "May you be in heaven a full half hour before the Devil knows you're dead"

  34. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by Presto51 View Post
    Hey Jeff when do you tell him about the baby's a$$ feel?

    Ron

    Hey ! Those were sealed records ! I was acquitted of all charges and it was...….oh, you were talking about the car, never mind...da bat

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  36. #73
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Seriously Texas! Low 30s and rain this weekend? That BabyBottom is going to be frozen smooth!

  37. #74
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Unsurprisingly, daBat was right! Skipping 400 straight to 600 was a good idea. I had no trouble using the 600 to remove all the 320 scratches. Doing this stage of wet sanding with the 400 would have indeed been a waste of my time. The surface is now as smooth as those sealed records!

  38. #75

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    TOLD YOU !!!

  39. #76
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidd View Post
    Unsurprisingly, daBat was right!
    Don't ever doubt daBat (unless he first says "Hold my beer...")

    Jeff

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  41. #77
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    I'm suddenly reminded of that scene from Pirates of the Caribbean, when Jonny Depp and Kiera Knightly are left on the deserted island. She burns the Rum to signal for help. He spots the rescue ship and mutters to himself... "There'll be no living with daBat after this".

  42. #78
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    Sealer to Paint question.
    Do I try to get sealer on the whole car before doing the color and clear under the hood and trunk? Or, do I seal,color,clear those first. Then , seal,color,clear the rest of the panels the net day?

    My attack plan is along the lines of.
    Thur: complete under hood and trunk.
    Fri: color and stripes whole car
    Sat: clear
    Sun: sit back and marvel

  43. #79
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    I do all sides of all panels in the same session but as you know Bat isn't a fan of my "flippers" and may advise otherwise. If you aren't doing everything all at the same time be mindful of your recoat windows and if necessary let that dictate your order and how far ahead you go with sealer or base.

    Jeff

  44. #80
    Senior Member skidd's Avatar
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    I was planning to use your flip-flop setup, until I realized my diy booth wasnt going to be big enough, that and the 2-step takedown by daBat... So.. underside first, then the rest.

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