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Thread: Patrick's 427 Build

  1. #41
    Senior Member FF33rod's Avatar
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    Congrats and welcome to the FFR family and fun! You're where I was at in November with the '33. When the kit finally arrived, was very excited just like you. Dove right in - inventory and then started the build. I'd start making some progress and then would have to pause to either figure stuff out (decisions to make since it wasn't explained in the manual) or get another tool or supply. I started to get frustrated. I had to have a little talk with myself about expectations - I truly didn't have schedule and I needed to remind myself of that. Still have to take a deep breath at times... You may have a totally different approach and personality but I thought I'd relate that in case you find yourself feeling the same way. Enjoy the journey!
    Steve

  2. #42
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Inventory

    I've tackled inventory.

    It's definitely a tedious process, but I can see that doing it the right way is important. In addition, I've already learned a lot about terminology as well putting a face to the pieces, which I think will pay off during the build.

    I have about 2 boxes left in the inventory process. I've discovered two things that were missing (a bolt and a piece of brake line). I'll continue to look through the other boxes to see if I missed them, otherwise I'll reach out to Factory Five.

    I have stumbled upon a few pieces that I can't identify and was hoping the forum could tell me what's what.

    1.



    I'm pretty sure this is an, 'Adjuster Bung'. The manual say this is supposed to be 1.25" long, however mine is 2.25" long. Is this a problem?


    2.



    I have two of these. Not sure what they are. Any help would be appreciated.

    3.



    No idea.


    4.


    No idea.



    Again, any help or advice is welcome and appreciated.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  3. #43
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    1. That looks like one of the adjusters for the UCA connection for the IRS. You should have two of them. Appears to be threaded on the inside as well as the outside, which is correct for that part. Looks like this installed on the IRS knuckle.



    2. Tab for attaching rigid brake line to the chassis where it transitions to flex. There are different versions. Since you list the Wilwood brake option, you should have similar parts provided that have a round hole. You won't use those.

    3. Used to connect fuel filler tube to the LeMans cap.

    4. Ground strap for the LeMans cap to deal with possible static electricity. Goes under one of the cap mounting screws to a metal chassis location.
    Last edited by edwardb; 02-28-2019 at 06:28 AM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  4. #44
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    To elaborate on edwardb's response, the tabs in #2 are for donor rubber brake hoses which as he indicated won't be used in your case. You'll find some other items like these such as fan mount straps, hood pins, assorted relays, etc.

    Good job working through the inventory!

    Jeff

  5. #45

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    Congrats! Just getting everything under your roof is a great feeling! Great job describing the ups and downs of delivery day...

  6. #46
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Starting the Build

    I finished inventory!

    That was a slow, tedious process, but I'm glad I took my time. I already feel more comfortable with things just from touching each piece and getting a feel for what's what.

    I decided to jump right into the build process today. I had a co-worker come over and help get the body off the frame, which we did without any trouble. It's possible with only two people, but would be easier with three.

    We got the frame on the body buck without difficulty. Unlike my frame dolly, my body buck did not topple over. That's a win for me.

    Next, I decided to install the Trans Mount Plate. We did this in the Mott College Build School. I know there has been some debate on this topic, but I haven't heard anyone say that it's an absolute no-no, so I went ahead and did it. I bolted the Trans Mount Plate on the TOP of the mounting tabs. The build manual says you can mount the plate either on top OR the bottom of the mounting tabs. If anyone thinks I should mount the Trans Mount Plate on the bottom of the tabs, please let me know.



    After that, I started work on the F-panels. Not too much to report here. I think I got them on without significant difficulty. The drivers side F-panel wasn't positioned correctly, so I had to move it towards the rear of the car about an inch. Unfortunately, this caused me to have to drill two extra holes in the frame, which I didn't love doing, but was necessary. I'm planning on getting the aluminum powder coated, so I'm just mocking them up with cleco's for now.






    I noticed the forward mounting tabs for the Lower Control Arm on the Drivers Side are too narrow, so I'm going to have to spread those tabs. I'm going to use the ol' threaded bar trick, which I've read works pretty well.


    Question for the Forum Braintrust:

    Do you use Loctite on all bolts? For instance, the bolts that I used to mount the Trans Mount Plate. Will those bolts require Loctite?

    Thanks for everyone that is following along. Again, please please chime in with any tips, pointers or advice.

    Thanks,

    Pat
    Last edited by Pat427; 02-28-2019 at 06:33 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  7. #47
    Senior Member cv2065's Avatar
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    Good to hear that you are moving along! There are certainly going to be times where you get frustrated or discouraged, but just keep coming back to the forum and everyone will keep you motivated!

    Regarding Loctite, I use Blue 242 on just about everything except lock nuts.
    MKIV Roadster - #9380 - Complete Kit - Delivered 7/17/18 - SOLD 5/2023
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  8. #48
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    The Build Continues

    I continued with the Upper and Lower Control Arms and the Shocks today.

    As I previously discovered, the mounting tabs for the forward Lower Control Arms on the Drivers Side were too narrow, which required me to spread the tabs. I was able to do this easily with the threaded bar trick. This works like a charm.

    I was able to get the Lower Control Arms in with minimal headaches. On the Drivers Side, the Lower Control Arm needed some pulling and twisting in order to get the bolt to go through the holes in the mounting tabs. I then torqued the bolts to spec. The build manual doesn't say anything about putting Loctite on these bolts. I was going to put Loctite on them anyway, but I forgot because my fiancé made a surprise visit to the garage and I was so eager to show off my killer torque skills I completely forgot to apply the Loctite. Not sure if I'm going to undo the torque in order to apply the Loctite. Any thoughts?

    For the Upper Control Arms, I went with the Howe Racing Ball Joints. A little pricey, but you can definitely tell they are high quality. A little Blue Loctite on the thread and they went in without any need to use the vise. Not entirely sure what to do with the washer that's above the castle nut. Anyone know if I need that or not?



    Then another first for me. I used a grease gun to fill the Arms with grease. Messy at first, but I eventually got the hang of it.


    Next came the Shocks.

    I think I was able to get them assembled correctly.





    I then mounted the top of the Shock to the body. Had to spread the DS tabs in order to get them to fit. Again, no biggie with the ol' threaded bar trick.
    Quick question: The nut used on the Upper Shock mount is that brass/gold color, yet the bolt is metallic colored. Is this normal or am I using the wrong nut?




    At first I mounted the bottom of the Shock to the body, but ended up taking the bolt out because it was too long. The bolt I had used was the 3.25" bolt that was needed for mounting the DS Upper Shock. I ended up not mounting the bottom of the Shock to the body because my kit was missing the 2.75" bolts that are used for this purpose. I think I'll just end up going back to Home Depot to pick these up instead of waiting on FF to send them.



    Please check my work. I'm new at this and really want to avoid this car falling apart on me.

    I have not torqued any of the Upper Control Arms or Shock bolts yet.

    I'm having a good time so far. I'm averaging about 2.4 Home Depot visits per day. It's slow going, but I'm taking my time and I think I'm making some small steps.

    As always, ANY help, tips or advice would be much appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Pat
    Last edited by Pat427; 03-01-2019 at 06:39 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  9. #49
    BadAsp427's Avatar
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    Hey Pat... looking good so far...
    To give a little advice. If you are installing a nut that is self locking (Vinyl Insert / Distorted threads) you do not need loctite. Also, not that it is wrong, but I do not know of anywhere that I had the brass colored nut on a silver bolt. Also, when you are working with the suspension bolts, it is best to use those provided by FFR. Not Lowe's or Home Depot. The bolts that go in the suspension are exact size (diameter) bolts that need to be in there, not to mention the strength. A question... On the shock spring adjustment nut on the shock sleeve. Usually there are two of those; one that the spring sits on and one that locks the other into place. Did your shocks not come with two for each?

    Either way, nice start. It's pretty cool to finish a project and get to start on the next. But do not be afraid to contact FFR for parts that you did not get. They will send them out nearly immediately and you'll be confident that you have the right part in place.

    Mk4 20th Anniversary #8690 (#8 of 20) Purchased 8/18/18----Build Started 8/19/18
    Build Thread Click Here / Registry Entry Click Here / BluePrint Engines 347ci / TKO600
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  10. #50
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    X2 on not using Loctite on nuts with the nylon insert. Not only is it not required since the insert provides the locking function, the blue Loctite is destructive to the nylon. This has been talked about quite a bit and as I recall is a caution in Loctite's literature. In general, you shouldn't need any Loctite on the suspension assembly other than the ball joint. The nuts provided by Factory Five are typically lock nuts of the nylon insert variety or the distorted type. Your suspension isn't going to fall apart! A properly torqued bolt will stay put. Loctite is talked about a lot on these forums, and it has its place. But don't overthink it.

    Other assorted comments: Put a witness mark on the ball joints and mounting plates so you can monitor that they aren't turning. Haven't seen it for awhile, but have been several instances of those working out. Which isn't good of course. X2 on not buying suspension hardware from HD or other big box stores. What Factory Five provides is the proper size and grade and often not available there. Having said that, the shock bolts are pretty normal grade 5 hardware. But a lot of the hardware I've seen at HD isn't even grade 5. If you have a local Ace Hardware with Hillman hardware (what they usually carry) they have a much better selection and you can be sure to get the proper grade 5 bolts for the shocks. The sort of brass colored nuts that Factory Five provides are OK. That's just plating with a kind of gold hue. Just use them where they're designated. Your standard red Koni shocks only have a single locking collar. With set screws that most recommend not using. At the very least, tighten very lightly or they'll ding up the threads on the adjustment collar. The dual action Koni's come with a double locking ring arrangement. Different than the standard Konis. The washers that came with your Howe Racing ball joints may/may not be required. Use them if needed to get the castle nuts to the proper tightness and lined up on the holes for the cotter pins.
    Last edited by edwardb; 03-02-2019 at 12:09 AM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
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    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  11. #51
    BadAsp427's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    Your standard red Koni shocks only have a single locking collar. With set screws that most recommend not using. At the very least, tighten very lightly or they'll ding up the threads on the adjustment collar. The dual action Koni's come with a double locking ring arrangement. Different than the standard Konis.
    Thanks Paul for clarifying. I've worked with several different styles of Koni Shocks on race cars in the past and all had the double locking spanner nuts. I was not sure about these for the Mk4. Carl

    Mk4 20th Anniversary #8690 (#8 of 20) Purchased 8/18/18----Build Started 8/19/18
    Build Thread Click Here / Registry Entry Click Here / BluePrint Engines 347ci / TKO600
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  12. #52
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Build Continues-Rough Day in the Garage

    Rough day in the garage today.

    I had to work an overnight shift last night, which means I'm in a bit of a fog today. I attempted to complete the front suspension, which I think I'd eventually did properly, but I obviously would love to get the blessing of the forum. I won't bother with all the little details, but suffice it to say I had lots of "learning opportunities" today.

    I have a couple of questions that I really hope you all might be able to clear up for me.

    First has to do with the castle nut on the spindles:

    Basically, I COULD NOT get the lower castle nut (yellow arrow below) to torque to the required 80-90 ft/lb. I'm not the biggest guy in the world, but I was using every drop of adrenaline in my system to crank that wrench and it would not torque down. I was cranking so hard that the body almost fell off the jack stands. I decided to stop at that point.



    I was reading on Wareaglescott build thread about this issue. He mentioned the spacer (blue line) that sits below the castle nut needed to be, "rounded side down", which it was, but I still could not get it to budge. Any advice?

    Secondly, once the lower castle nut was tightened down, there was not enough space between the lower and upper castle nuts (red line) for my torque wrench to fit, therefore I was unable to toque the upper castle nut.

    I think the issue is that my torque wrench has a 1/2"head, therefore I had to buy a 1/2"-->1/4" adapter (pic below) in order for the proper socket to be able to attach to the torque wrench. Well, I think the adapter is taking up too much space and causing the issue. I'm assuming I'll need to purchase a smaller (1/4") torque wrench so that I won't need that adapter?




    Just hoping ya'll could check my work on the next couple of pictures to ensure it all looks correct.





    Next, these bolts were left over in the bag for the spindle hardware. I'm not sure what they're for. Any advice?



    Last, after I "gently" tapped the hub, it looked like this.



    Does it look correct? I was concerned because the piece of metal with the red lube was kind of sticking out proud from the rest of the hub.

    I would be very appreciative of any advice on the above issues.

    Thanks,
    Pat
    Last edited by Pat427; 03-02-2019 at 04:39 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  13. #53
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Observations from my side: Not understanding why you couldn't get 80-90 ft-lbs on the spindle lower ball joint nut. That's not that much that you should have to pull that hard, including pulling the frame off the stand. Something doesn't sound right. Sure you have the torque wrench on the right setting? Is it known to be accurate? Not being able to get the torque wrench on the other side is a common problem. Don't stress about it. Get a decent sized wrench on it and give it a strong pull. If the castle nut lines up, put the pin in and you should be done. Something doesn't look right with your front hub either. Are you sure it's all the way on? Seem to recall more threads should be showing than that. Sometimes it's necessary to use a little emory cloth on the spindle to get the hub to slide on. Also pretty sure that's the rear hub nut you have on there. Not the front one. I could be wrong, but that doesn't look right either. There's a dust cap that goes of the end and I'm betting it won't fit.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
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  14. #54
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    EdwardB,

    Thanks for getting back to me.

    I've attached some pictures of the Drivers Side hub.





    Does this look correct?
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  15. #55
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MechanicalKnowledgeNone View Post
    EdwardB,

    Thanks for getting back to me.

    I've attached some pictures of the Drivers Side hub.





    Does this look correct?
    The hub looks like it's all the way back on the spindle. But I sure don't remember seeing the bearing pushed out like that, which is also resulting in fewer threads showing for the spindle nut. I'm thinking the bearing is sticking on the spindle and you kept pushing it enough to move the bearing. Does that sound like what you did?
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  16. #56
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    The hub looks like it's all the way back on the spindle. But I sure don't remember seeing the bearing pushed out like that, which is also resulting in fewer threads showing for the spindle nut. I'm thinking the bearing is sticking on the spindle and you kept pushing it enough to move the bearing. Does that sound like what you did?

    Yes, that sounds about right. Does this mean I've ruined the hub? Or can I remove it and use an emery cloth on the spindle and see if that will allow the bearing seat further, which would hopefully result in more threads showing? Or is it possible to just start threading the nut onto the few threads that are showing in hopes that as I tighten the nut it will push the bearing further inward?

    Thank you for your help,

    Patrick
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  17. #57
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MechanicalKnowledgeNone View Post
    Yes, that sounds about right. Does this mean I've ruined the hub? Or can I remove it and use an emery cloth on the spindle and see if that will allow the bearing seat further, which would hopefully result in more threads showing? Or is it possible to just start threading the nut onto the few threads that are showing in hopes that as I tighten the nut it will push the bearing further inward?

    Thank you for your help,

    Patrick
    I honestly don't know the best course of action at this point. That's uncharted territory for me. I've had them be pretty snug, but never so tight that I had to force it on or move the bearings like that. My sense says remove it, push the bearing back to its original configuration, and use emery cloth on the spindle until it slides on without so much force. Some day you may have to get it back off and forcing it by using the spindle nut doesn't sound like a good idea to me. But as I said, no experience along those lines. I don't know if the bearing is damaged. I doubt it, but don't know about that either. Sorry. Maybe some others have suggestions.
    Last edited by edwardb; 03-03-2019 at 06:50 AM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
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  18. #58
    Senior Member Higgybulin's Avatar
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    With Paul saying that it looks like the rear hub nut in the picture, maybe the bearings are for the rear hubs and not the front. The bolts that you said were left over from the bag look like drive shaft to rear end bolts.
    Higgy
    New MK4 kit picked up 4/10/23!!!
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    351C, 3 link, 17's, dual roll bars

  19. #59
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Build Progress

    It's been a few days since I've been able to post any updates. I've been on a tough stretch at work. Gotta pay for all this somehow, right?

    Well, I think I've solved the issue with the Front Hubs. I managed to get my hands on some emery cloth. This stuff is pretty neat. I had to order it off Amazon. It was nowhere to be found in the stores in my area (2 Home Depots, 4 Lowes, 1 Ace Hardware and 1 Harbor Freight). I used Fine Grit.



    Once it showed up, I was able to polish the spindles and bam! The hubs went on much easier and didn't push the inner bearings out.

    I think I fixed the issue? The hub is seated all the way on the spindle, which is allowing much more of the threads to show.




    The other issue is the hub nut that screws on to the spindle. The forum seems to agree that I was using the wrong nut. Here is a better picture of the nut that came with the kit. Just wanted to make sure everyone still thinks it's the wrong one, because I can't seem to find any other nuts that might be the right ones.




    Also, I wanted to get clarification about the front of the Drivers Pedal box. I have to Wilwood brakes and I'm planning on using a cable clutch. I wanted to ensure this is the correct piece of aluminum for the front of the pedal box?





    Also, I have nearly completed all the drilling of the panels and finished fitting them to the frame. Much bigger pain in the butt than I had anticipated, but it's about over. Next step will be to get the panels to the powder coater tomorrow. I'm thinking about going with a dark gray.

    Thanks again for everyones help and advice.

    Patrick
    Last edited by Pat427; 03-07-2019 at 07:18 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  20. #60
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    Unless things have changed recently the front hub nits are caged. Yes, that is the correct driver's side front panel for the Wilwood pedals.

    Jeff

  21. #61
    Senior Member Higgybulin's Avatar
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    Those look like the hub nuts in the picture
    http://www.factoryfiveparts.com/14850-mk4-spindle-set/
    New MK4 kit picked up 4/10/23!!!
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  22. #62
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    It's probably mainly my fault about the doubt on those front hub nuts. Your early pictures when the hubs weren't going on right, the bearing was sticking out, etc. just didn't look right to me including the nut. But mainly I guess because you had so few threads exposed. Agree the nuts in the picture from FF's website look like what you have and as I recall like ones I've received and used as well. If they thread onto the spindles, properly fit into the hub and compress the bearings, and the dust caps provided fit over, then I think they're the right ones. Hopefully you have the right tools to put the 225-250 ft-lbs of torque needed on those nuts.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014. Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. Sold 09/07/2020. Build Thread and Video. Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 Coyote. Legal 03/04/2020. Build Thread and Video
    Build 5: 35 Hot Rod Truck #138. LS3 and 4L65E auto. Rcvd 01/05/2021. Legal 04/20/2023. Build Thread. Sold 11/9/2023.

  23. #63
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    Those are the right front hub nuts. I just finished installing them on mine. I was able to get a loaner 250lb torque wrench and axle socket set from Pep Boys that worked great. Also, if you haven’t done so you may want to consider trimming the aft adjusting sleeves and bolts as noted by Fixit and others. I wouldn’t have got them close to the initial alignment measurements in the manual without doing so.
    MKIV #9542 Complete Kit, Coyote, IRS - Delivered - 2/19/19, First start - 9/8/19, Go Cart - 9/14/19
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  24. #64
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    IRS Center Section

    I started to tackle the IRS this weekend.

    First, I removed the bolts from the rear hubs with a 3lb sledge hammer. They came out fairly easily. It took 3-4 whacks until the bolt would fall out. Now, getting the new bolts in...that was a different story.

    I used the nut and washer technique to pull the new bolt through. It wasn't until the 5th or 6th bolt that I started to put a tiny bit of lithium grease on the empty hole, which made pulling the new bolt through 10x's easier. The biggest issue I had was getting my vise to hold the hub strong enough to not allow the entire hub to spin when I was wrenching it. Ultimately, I was able to get the new bolts pulled through and I was pleased I accomplished this task.




    Next was the IRS center section....

    First, I used POR15 to coat the center section. Like others have said, that is some stout stuff. I let it dry overnight and this morning I attempted to get in into the frame.
    This was a bit intimidating for me as I'm doing all the work by myself. The center section has to be over 80-90lbs, which made me really take my time as to not injure myself.

    With the help of a floor jack, I was able to get it into the frame....kinda.

    I was able to get the rear bolts to go through. It was such a great feeling to feel the bolts start to thread into the mounting bracket. At first it felt like victory. However, my joy was short lived and now I'm left scratching my head with a couple of hurdles that I hope the forum can help with.

    1. The rear bolts are not long enough to extend through he mounting bracket AND the mounting flange in the IRS center section.



    Here's another picture. This is a view from he front. In the picture below, the bolt is completely threaded and yet it does not extend out the other end for a nut to screw on.




    I believe the bolt I used was part #15962, which is an M14-2.0 100mm Flange Head Bolt.

    Is the bolt supposed to go all the way through for a nut to screw on?


    2. I could NOT get the front holes to line up. I think I'm going to have to loosen the rear bolts enough to wiggle the center section from side-to side just a few millimeters in order to get the those front holes to line up. Does this sound like it would work?

    Thanks for your help,

    Pat
    Last edited by Pat427; 03-10-2019 at 04:31 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  25. #65
    BadAsp427's Avatar
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    Hay pat, those rear bolts do not get a nut on them, they only thread into the housing. Be sure that you have them torqued to the correct amount. (100 FtLbs) My car is up on jackstands so I was able to take a quick look and your is exactly as mine is. If it will help, here is a LINK to my center section install.

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  26. #66
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadAsp427 View Post
    Hay pat, those rear bolts do not get a nut on them, they only thread into the housing. Be sure that you have them torqued to the correct amount. (100 FtLbs) My car is up on jackstands so I was able to take a quick look and your is exactly as mine is. If it will help, here is a LINK to my center section install.

    Thank you so much for your response. That made my day. I'm very much relieved that it looks the same as yours.

    All I have to do is loosen the rear bolts and wiggle the center section until I can get the front bolts to go through the mounting tabs. Hopefully that goes okay.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  27. #67
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    I didn’t see anyone answer yet but the bolt you asked about in post #52 is to bolt the FFR stock GT calipers to the front spindles. There should be four bolts. It looks like you have the Wilwood brakes so not sure if you need them.
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  28. #68
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Build Continues


    I spent most of the day in the garage and made a little progress, but I hit a wall, so I decided to stop for the day.

    I got my center section installed without too much headache, which gave me a little boost of confidence.

    Then I started to work on my IRS. I managed to get the upper and lower control arms installed without too much difficulty. I had to use the ol' threaded bar trick to widen all the mounting tabs, which worked like a charm. I also used EdwardBs trick with the grinded bolt to help get the arms lined up with the holes. That worked very well.

    But then I hit a wall. Two walls actually.

    First, I realized that I didn't have the correct bolt for the back of the upper control arm. It calls for a M16-2.0 x110MM Flange Head Bolt. Well, I couldn't find two of the them. I had used the wrong bolt at first, but realized my mistake when the flange nut wouldn't go all the way on the end of the bolt. I've contacted FF to send me a couple of new ones. I left the hole empty for now.




    Second wall has to do with the CV axles. I tried to slip them into the differential, but they wouldn't go. I wasn't sure how much force they required, but it definitely felt like it was getting snagged on something. When I took them out, I noticed a small ring near the end of the axle. I wasn't sure if this needed to be removed or what, but I thought I'd run it past the forum before I messed something up. Pics below. The little ring isn't flush with the rest of the axle. It's kinda sticking up and I thought that might be the issue. Thoughts?








    Last is just a picture of my Toe arm attachment point. Not very well described in the instructions, but got it cleared up by looking at EdwardBs pictures.




    Anyway, I hope ya'll can clear up the CV axle issue for me.

    Thanks as always,

    Pat
    Last edited by Pat427; 03-12-2019 at 08:18 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  29. #69
    BadAsp427's Avatar
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    Pat, the rings on the ends of your CV Axles is the retainer ring that will hold the axles in place inside the diff. STOP: be sure you have the correct axle on the correct side, one is shorter than the other.... once you know you have the right one; push it in. It may take a bit of umph to get it in as it will press in the snap rings... It will be a definite "Click" as it goes into place.

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  30. #70
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadAsp427 View Post
    Pat, the rings on the ends of your CV Axles is the retainer ring that will hold the axles in place inside the diff. STOP: be sure you have the correct axle on the correct side, one is shorter than the other.... once you know you have the right one; push it in. It may take a bit of umph to get it in as it will press in the snap rings... It will be a definite "Click" as it goes into place.

    Here comes the rookie newbie question of the day:

    When the instructions state that the CV axles are designated left and right...is this if you're looking at the car from the front or looking at it from behind?
    Last edited by Pat427; 03-12-2019 at 08:18 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  31. #71
    BadAsp427's Avatar
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    Usually as looked at from the rear. DS is Left

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  32. #72
    Not a waxer Jeff Kleiner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MechanicalKnowledgeNone View Post
    Here comes the rookie newbie question of the day:

    When the instructions state that the CV axles are designated left and right...is this if your looking at the car from the front or looking at it from behind?
    Almost without exception when speaking in automotive terms right and left are as if you are sitting in the driver's seat.

    Jeff

  33. #73
    Senior Member Big Blocker's Avatar
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    Damn Jeff, it must be the time zone thing . . . you always beat me to this kind of post response.

    Soooo, for what it's worth, Jeff is [as always] correct, ALL references to orientation on a car is as if you were sitting in the drivers seat looking forward . . . left is the drivers side.

    This concept confuses quite a few, especially when they start talking about which way something "rotates", like which way does the engine spin? Correct answer is: counter-clockwise, when you are sitting in the drivers seat.

    Doc
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  34. #74
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    To add to what was said about the CV axles, confirming don't remove the snap rings. Big mistake. Once you push the stub into the center section, you should feel the inner CV joint compressing. It slides. Once all the way in, give it a solid push and it should click into place. If it doesn't, you can give the end of the axle a light bump with a dead blow hammer as stated in the instructions. Again with the inner CV joint compressed. Even if you don't feel it click, if you end up with the approx 1/8-inch gap as described in the instructions, you should be in. If in doubt, give it a light tug. It shouldn't come out. Usually takes some leverage to pop it back out once the snap ring is engaged.
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  35. #75
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    To add to what was said about the CV axles, confirming don't remove the snap rings. Big mistake. Once you push the stub into the center section, you should feel the inner CV joint compressing. It slides. Once all the way in, give it a solid push and it should click into place. If it doesn't, you can give the end of the axle a light bump with a dead blow hammer as stated in the instructions. Again with the inner CV joint compressed. Even if you don't feel it click, if you end up with the approx 1/8-inch gap as described in the instructions, you should be in. If in doubt, give it a light tug. It shouldn't come out. Usually takes some leverage to pop it back out once the snap ring is engaged.
    Thanks for the information. I'll be trying this out later today.

    Just out of curiosity, does the snap ring in the picture I posted look the way its supposed to? The reason I ask is because the snap ring is bulging upward in only one spot (between the 11 o'clock and 2 o'clock position) and the rest of it is sitting nicely within a groove. I thought snap rings were supposed to be protruding equally around the entirety of the circumference.

    Thanks,
    Last edited by Pat427; 09-07-2019 at 10:24 PM.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  36. #76
    Senior Member edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MechanicalKnowledgeNone View Post
    Thanks for the information. I'll be trying this out later today.

    Just out of curiosity, does the snap ring in the picture I posted look the way its supposed to? The reason I ask is because the snap ring is bulging upward in only on spot (between the 11 o'clock and 2 o'clock position) and the rest of it is sitting nicely within a groove. I thought snap rings were supposed to be protruding equally around the entirety of the circumference.

    Thanks,
    Sounds like they're not centered in the slots and floating around a bit. I really don't think you have a problem. With just a little bit of extra persuasion, if needed, I'm confident those will go in just fine. You could put a little gear lube on the ends before pushing in if you think that would help. Same as what they'll see in operation. FWIW, unless something has changed which I doubt, those are Ford OE CV joints installed on shorter axles. So they're made to go into that center section.
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  37. #77
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Rookie Newbie Question of the Day


    I got the CV axles in without any issue. I used a little force and a few bangs with a rubber mallet and they went in fine.

    Now I'm about to attach the hubs and spindles.

    My hubs and spindles are not attached, however the bolts that are used for this purpose have a red marking on the threads, which confused me. Does this red mark mean that I'm supposed to put Red Loctite on the threads?



    Thanks,

    Pat
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  38. #78
    Senior Member cv2065's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MechanicalKnowledgeNone View Post

    My hubs and spindles are not attached, however the bolts that are used for this purpose have a red marking on the threads, which confused me. Does this red mark mean that I'm supposed to put Red Loctite on the threads?

    Pat
    Hey Pat. Those bolts already have a threadlocker on them. Just the dry kind. Shouldn't need any more so you're good to go!
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  39. #79
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cv2065 View Post
    Hey Pat. Those bolts already have a threadlocker on them. Just the dry kind. Shouldn't need any more so you're good to go!
    Thank you for the info cv2065. Much appreciated.
    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

  40. #80
    Senior Member Pat427's Avatar
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    IRS Continues

    So I finished the PS IRS. It all went together fairly easily. Once again I had to spread all tabs with the threaded bar trick. That skill is really coming in handy. Anyway, if you guys see any glaring errors please let me know.

    Thanks,

    Pat







    MK4-IRS, 427w, TKO-600

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