302 TBI build - so many decisions

[Jonathan D]

I have been reading many threads asking for help with 302 builds and here goes mine. I have an 88 stock 302 I pulled from a Mustang. I'm tearing it down to the short block and sending to the local shop to go over it and this is where the questions start. I believe the engine is great so the plan is to stay 302 unless the shop advises me differently. I'm sticking with the T5 I pulled from the same car and I want to go with some form of throttle body injection. I'm building a street car, something with good idle and decent MPG to cruse with the wife. I'm not on a super tight budget, I want to put a nice top end and have looked at edelbrock and trickflow top end kits but I really want to make sure I'm following a proven combo that makes around 350 hp. I'm really looking at this hard right now as I'm reading about piston requirements with the trick flow and asking myself if ditching the stock forged pistons is a good idea?? If I need to make changes to the bottom end, now is the time so any advice would be great.

[John4337]

Can’t address all your questions, but I have an x302 crate motor, edlebrock performer rpm intake and e cam. Ford rated it at 350 hp (for whatever that’s worth). I’ve been running a FiTech for 2 1/2 years with no issue. Good drivability and manners, and I got 22 mpg on the last highway trip, cruising 80ish on the highway.

Hope this helps. Good luck

John

[NAZ]

Before you get too far along on a rebuild, I suggest you look at crate engines. Get a lot of bang for your buck with a crate engine and you don't need all the special tools and skills to build an engine. I can't build one for the cost of a crate engine.

[brewha]

What you haven’t told us is how many miles are on the block. If the mileage is over 40k I would think of having the shop redo the internals. If your shop says you internals are ok then stay 302. If you need to redo the internals...... stroke it.
Doesn’t cost much more to get to 331 which leaves plenty of meat on the block and will put a bigger smile on your face.
I run an Edelbrock RPM air-gap intake with a Fitech 600 system and shaved aluminum heads for running higher compression. I think my smile is connected to my gas pedal......

[FF33rod]

+1 on the crate engine comments, hard to beat for price.
If you stick to building up your own and are looking at top end kits, have a look at TRE Performance. They have a wide selection of top end kits (using AFR heads) suitable for 302s or 331/347 if you end up stroking it.
https://treperformance.com/c-330056-...gine-kits.html

Steve

[mburger]

https://treperformance.com/c-330056-...gine-kits.html

Steve

Thanks for this link. Since I am still looking at options to upgrade the top end on my stock 302, these kits may be just what I need since I have the upper/lower intake I want to use.

[Jonathan D]

Thanks for all the comments guys. I don't know the mileage on the engine as it started its life in another car before the one I pulled it from. I understand the crate engine comments but I got this for almost nothing and it ran perfect when I picked it up so I figured it would be fun to give it a new home in my mk4 project. I guess I'll wait and see what the engine shop says after they go over the block, but 331 sounds like it would add to the fun factor. Can anyone give me a ball park on typical cost to go from stock 302 bottom end to a 331 ready for heads?

[Jonathan D]

+1 on the crate engine comments, hard to beat for price.
If you stick to building up your own and are looking at top end kits, have a look at TRE Performance. They have a wide selection of top end kits (using AFR heads) suitable for 302s or 331/347 if you end up stroking it.
https://treperformance.com/c-330056-...gine-kits.html

Steve

Another thanks for the link.....hadn't looked at AFR yet and lots of options on the site

[Murd]

I’d think about upgrading that T5 if it hasn’t been already. I have a 300ish hp 302 and I blew apart 3rd gear at full throttle on my rebuilt ‘87 date code T5.
I had a new one built to T5z spec with upgraded gears and a few other goodies.
The builder’s comment on my old one was that it was metal fatigue and they weren’t very strong to begin with.

[brewha]

My 331 built in highly reputable engine shop cost a little over 5500. It included hot tanking the block, cleaning,magnetic particle inspection, honing .030, resurfacing cylinder decks, cam shaft bearings, new freeze plugs, and computer balnced rotating assembly.

Parts included B16006E Eagle rotating assembly plus flywheel and balancer
10 to 1 Aluminum custom and ported cylinder headers
Comp K31-242-3 cam shaft
Comp 161-16 ultra pro magnum roller rocker arms
New bolts and M68 oil pump

Now all I had was a bare block. So I needed to buy many missing things that you already have. I spent another 1400 on
MSD Distrubutor and coil
Edelbrock Air gap manifold
Water pump
Milodon oil pump pickup and pan
Plus plugs, wires, timing chain cover, and many other little necessities.

Fitech 600 cost 950
Good luck with your research and choice.

[Big Blocker]

FWIW, a stock block 5.0 (302) is pretty much a bullet-proof engine, block-wise, as long as you don't push it too far. By too far, I'm referring to the guys that want 450-500 HP for it. Your desire to get 350 is not too far and the block should last a long, long time. I have a [basically] stock block 302, iron heads that have been worked over for better flow, an E-303 cam and stock pistons, rotating assembly balanced, a complete GT-40 upper/lower running the factory EFI. While about 15 HP short of your 350 target, my little 302 has put up with my heavy right foot now for 17 years with no issues at all. Car gets 21 mpg at a sustained 80 mph on extended cruises, side pipe noise is "comfortable" at road speed, not blowing out my ears.
That being said, if your engine builder wants to rebuild the short block, I [personally] would consider that crate motor mentioned above - best bang for the buck and comes with a warranty from most builders.

Just my 2¢

Doc

[Jonathan D]

I’d think about upgrading that T5 if it hasn’t been already. I have a 300ish hp 302 and I blew apart 3rd gear at full throttle on my rebuilt ‘87 date code T5.
I had a new one built to T5z spec with upgraded gears and a few other goodies.
The builder’s comment on my old one was that it was metal fatigue and they weren’t very strong to begin with.

Good point, the T5 is going to need another look.

[Jonathan D]

Thanks for the details on your build brewha, your numbers are in line with what I was thinking. Do you like the Fitech and what made you decide vs other TBI's on the market?

[Jonathan D]

Big Blocker and others all making great points here, I'm really kinda hoping the news on the bottom end comes back solid and I'll spend $ on a nice top end to make the 302 cubes happy.

[davekp]

One other thing to agonize over is your differential gear ratio. The stock Mustang 3.08 is pretty anemic.

[brewha]

When I was looking for an Efi unit with built in ECM’s, Holleys Snipers were scarce with a waiting period 60 to 90 days. Fitech had been around and available for awhile. The Sniper was so new at the time that I feared being in that new product stage where it was exciting and new but unproven and could be faulty. I went with Fitech because it was proven reliable and it was available.
I found support was available at many different forums, and saw very few negative reviews. I also saw a lot of them on tv car shows being used.
Either the Fitech or Sniper are both good units now with the Holley support getting better and building that proven reliability.
I’m very happy going with my choice of Fitech(600).

[DadofThree]

FWIW, I went down this road during my build with my stock 302 with the 3.08 rear end. And with all the decisions to add more power, better gearing, aluminum heads, etc.; I started to piece together (on paper) that would get me in the mid 300's hp with a 3.27 or 3.55 gear ratio. But I was only doing that because I saw others doing it.

The more I thought about it, I realized that I needed a BASE to start from to learn the car. If the stock 302 with T5 and the 3.08 rear end was the drive train of a Mass produced Mustang GT; then it should be a great drive train for my Cobra that will be 1,000 lbs lighter. If you want a cruiser with your wife, there is no harm is starting with the base 302 with the 3.08. Put a E303 cam in there, add a carburated intake and a fitech on top of it, soften your koni's, add 15" wheels with big rubber sidewalls and you'll have a GREAT cruiser. It will still put you in the back of your seat, or will cruise at 78 mph at 2,000 rpm while getting 20 mpg, with 87 octane. You can always add the aluminum heads and/or different gearing once you learn the car.

BTW, I'm 16,300 miles into it, and still haven't considered a change yet.

[Jonathan D]

DadofThree.....I like your thinking in learning the car and I would have to agree that just about anything that came in the mustang would be fun in the lighter FFR cars. I just don't want the hassle of doing heads down the road, I would really like to build a solid cruiser engine now with a new top end and drop it in the car to sit for many years untouched. I'm with you on the 15's even though the rubber is harder to find than 17's. My plan is to keep the vintage look and feel for this car.

[Jonathan D]

When I was looking for an Efi unit with built in ECM’s, Holleys Snipers were scarce with a waiting period 60 to 90 days. Fitech had been around and available for awhile. The Sniper was so new at the time that I feared being in that new product stage where it was exciting and new but unproven and could be faulty. I went with Fitech because it was proven reliable and it was available.
I found support was available at many different forums, and saw very few negative reviews. I also saw a lot of them on tv car shows being used.
Either the Fitech or Sniper are both good units now with the Holley support getting better and building that proven reliability.
I’m very happy going with my choice of Fitech(600).

Appreciate the insight. I can't say I know much about these yet but everything is see is usually either Fitech or Holley.

[Avalanche325]

Let's see.......you got a free engine. One trip to the forum and we have you buying a new crate motor, transmission, and differential.

Anything else we can help you with?

DadofThree - You are cranking the miles out! Was hoping you would show up at autocross yesterday.

[Big Blocker]

Let's not forget the non-factory EFI setup . . . we (my fellow forum family members) absolutely love to spend your money.

Doc

[Jonathan D]

oh I have never needed much help spending my money haha
Once the engine is gone over I will let everyone know if its time to start spending

[John4337]

oh I have never needed much help spending my money haha
Once the engine is gone over I will let everyone know if its time to start spending

Needed or not we’ll help you spend it

[DadofThree]

DadofThree - You are cranking the miles out! Was hoping you would show up at autocross yesterday.

Yeah, Sorry Chris. I did want to see you and Dennis. I should have shown up. I plan to see you at the Round Up. You too, John.

Build that thing so you can join the fun Jonathon!

[Jonathan D]

Can't wait to join the fun but realistically its going to be a couple more years but I'll have the drive train all ready to drop in at least! I had some time today and tore the engine down....the block is on the back of the truck, dropping it off to the engine shop in the morning. Can anyone point me in the right direction for details on my engine block? The stamping on top of the block is JF3C2186. I thought the engine and trans came from a 1988 GT but the T5 is stamped 90 so it came from a 1990 or later, now I'm wondering about the engine. I know its the E7TE so it came from the 87 truck casting but the number on the top will narraw it down more if someone can help me.