33 Hot Rod Build

[Roger Pugh]

Well, I finally did it!! I ordered the kit this morning. My son was so excited he wanted to push the submit button. I think it might take awhile for the grin to fade from his face. I will be putting the theory that these kits can even be built by an idiot. It has been fun prepping my shop. I built it a couple of years ago. I have three bays with about 1900 sq ft minus about a 250 sq ft room in the back. It was big enough to do whatever I wanted until my wife had me line the walls with 9 Costco gorilla shelves for all her bins.... I have no idea where all the crap came from but she has 50 black and yellow bins full of whatever. I will give her credit for her organization as they are all labeled. The only problem is none of the labels say anything about building cars so we have made plenty of room, shifted some back to the garage on the house and I now have the room for the build and even some shelves for parts. It has now been named the man cave after much negotiation and permission from the wife (boss). (I tried to convince her that we should move the riding mower into the garage where she parks her car, but to no avail, that didn't work) I showed her the pic of one of you builders, sorry but I forget which of you it was, with your body sitting in your dining room. She loved it but when I suggested the house could be used to store stuff she was willing to move some bins to the garage. I think she is more excited for me to be in the shop than I am.

Anyway, I see that many have posted their build so I will share what I am doing:

33 Hot Rod
BluePrint SBC 400 ci fi w/ TCI 700R4 auto tranny. I'm a big guy with big feet so hopefully I won't miss clutching it!!
Gen 2 33 Nose and engine cover kit
3-Link rear suspension
Spread exhaust
Tilt steering / electric steering
A/C
Wilwood brakes front and back
I am finding the wheel and tire combo to be a little tricky. I chose not to buy the set from FFR (preference) but am finding the only way to get them to work is to have to custom order. It is what it is. Any success or failure to watch out for in this regard would be helpful.

So.... I would truly not be offended for any advice on the build. I will post pics and video as we go. Should be finished for delivery July 11. My son, a friend, and I are scheduled to attend the June 5th build school so that should be very fun and informative.

I want to add - It has been wonderful for the last couple of months posting and responding to posts on this forum. I don't feel like an idiot when you kindly answer some of my very probable stupid questions. It's a great family to be part of and hope one day that I can be of the same kind of help you all have shared with me.

Here we go!!!

Roger Pugh

[House Money]

Hi Roger, this is Gary - we communicated about two months ago via email about you maybe ordering a kit. Glad to hear you pulled the trigger!!

[HVACMAN]

Congratulations Roger!! Welcome to the madness. Let the spending begin. lol

[wallace18]

Congrats!

[JOP33]

Welcome aboard Roger! You've taken the first step for a successful build for any married man...you have your wife on board! Are you staging the build? Building hardtop or sans? Room becomes quite the commodity sometimes, but it sounds like you have that covered. There is going to be plenty of truly experienced builders that can offer you very sound advice throughout your build - I am not that guy! However, I am a first time builder with very little automotive experience that, although I didn't build my car entirely, completed what I would say was about 2/3 before handing it off for finish up...you will do just fine. Ask a lot of questions, accept a lot of answers then make a more informed decision based off your input. Only you know what you're truly trying to achieve with your build. I will tell you patience was (and still is) my biggest nemesis and for that reason I had to break my build down into many, smaller achievements...so that if I didn't finish the car, I could at least say I dropped an engine in! Always be searching for YOUR wheels & tires, but don't feel the pressure to pull the trigger on them too early...you get the idea. It's a blast and for me, it was a once in a lifetime opportunity that I am soooo glad I was able to do...but could not have done without the help of this forum, the build school, friends & the support of FFR! Enjoy it my friend...and get ready to inventory!

Construction - 5 - Inventory.JPG

[Roger Pugh]

Well, here I go Gary - How's the 35 truck coming?

[Roger Pugh]

Welcome aboard Roger! You've taken the first step for a successful build for any married man...you have your wife on board! Are you staging the build? Building hardtop or sans? Room becomes quite the commodity sometimes, but it sounds like you have that covered. There is going to be plenty of truly experienced builders that can offer you very sound advice throughout your build - I am not that guy! However, I am a first time builder with very little automotive experience that, although I didn't build my car entirely, completed what I would say was about 2/3 before handing it off for finish up...you will do just fine. Ask a lot of questions, accept a lot of answers then make a more informed decision based off your input. Only you know what you're truly trying to achieve with your build. I will tell you patience was (and still is) my biggest nemesis and for that reason I had to break my build down into many, smaller achievements...so that if I didn't finish the car, I could at least say I dropped an engine in! Always be searching for YOUR wheels & tires, but don't feel the pressure to pull the trigger on them too early...you get the idea. It's a blast and for me, it was a once in a lifetime opportunity that I am soooo glad I was able to do...but could not have done without the help of this forum, the build school, friends & the support of FFR! Enjoy it my friend...and get ready to inventory!

Construction - 5 - Inventory.JPG

JOP33,

You have always been willing to take the time for great information. I truly appreciate it. I'm not doing the coupe top, just roadster. I am, however, going to use the bike fenders. We have a lot of country roads with terrible chip seal and who knows what else I might throw up on me or the car.

What did you do for your wheels? Go custom somewhere? I dig them!

[sethmark]

Have fun. Don’t get frustrated. Expect the manual to be reference, not a step by step instruction. Ask for help....

[NAZ]

Roger, for my Gen I I used Toyo Proxes R888 front & rear mounted on American Racing TorqThrust Classic wheels. Fronts were 255/35ZR18 mounted on 18x9x5.0BS wheels and the rears were 315/30ZR18 mounted on 18x10x5.74 BS wheels. These clear the bike fenders up front and the standard rear fenders. Don't forget to use rack spacers to limit the steering travel so your fenders don't hit the chassis.

Also, if you even remotely think you may run without front fenders you should take a look at how I mounted mine. They can be removed without removing the cap screws that hold the bike fender brackets.
Left Profile.jpg

[Tampa33Build]

Roger,

Congratulations! This forum has a wealth of very knowledgeable people, read posts and asking questions.

I have a Gen 1, currently in the body shop, it has BluePrint SBC 400 with Holley Sniper EFI and TCI 700R4 transmission. Did you go with the EFI?

[JOP33]

What did you do for your wheels? Go custom somewhere? I dig them!

Cragar SS & Michelin Pilot Sport Rubber
Both stock items & Discount Tire out the door for less than $2500

[Roger Pugh]

Roger, for my Gen I I used Toyo Proxes R888 front & rear mounted on American Racing TorqThrust Classic wheels. Fronts were 255/35ZR18 mounted on 18x9x5.0BS wheels and the rears were 315/30ZR18 mounted on 18x10x5.74 BS wheels. These clear the bike fenders up front and the standard rear fenders. Don't forget to use rack spacers to limit the steering travel so your fenders don't hit the chassis.

Also, if you even remotely think you may run without front fenders you should take a look at how I mounted mine. They can be removed without removing the cap screws that hold the bike fender brackets.
Left Profile.jpg

NAZ,

That is just one bad looking machine!!! Fantastic!! I like your wheels a lot - kind of the direction I am looking for. I also like the Toyo's, they have had some great reviews so it's good to hear you like them.

Roger

[Roger Pugh]

Roger,

Congratulations! This forum has a wealth of very knowledgeable people, read posts and asking questions.

I have a Gen 1, currently in the body shop, it has BluePrint SBC 400 with Holley Sniper EFI and TCI 700R4 transmission. Did you go with the EFI?

Tampa33build,

Yes I did, same setup. Would love to see your pics when you are done!

[JimLev]

Congrats Roger. As HVACMAN said we'll help you spend your money.
I also have American Racing Torq Thrust wheels, got them from wheelsforless.com

[NAZ]

NAZ,

That is just one bad looking machine!!! Fantastic!! I like your wheels a lot - kind of the direction I am looking for. I also like the Toyo's, they have had some great reviews so it's good to hear you like them.

Roger

Roger, if you like those wheels & tires I'll sell them to you for half of what I paid for them. They have maybe 50-miles on the tires -- the wheels are like brand new. But you have to pick them up next time your in the Flagstaff area.

[Roger Pugh]

[QUOTE=JimLev;410535]Congrats Roger. As HVACMAN said we'll help you spend your money.
I also have American Racing Torq Thrust wheels, got them from wheelsforless.com[/QUOTEJ

JimLev,

Would you mind sharing me the sizes of your wheels and backspacing? Tires?

Thanks,

Roger

[JimLev]

Roger, tire info is in my sig below.
I purchased the wheels from wheelsforless.com
Here's what's printed on the paperwork.

The rears are VN8158165 Chrome PVD Torq Thrust II, 18x10, backspacing is 5.75"
The fronts are VN8157867 Chrome PVD Tork Thrust II, 17x8, backspacing is 5.48"

I have 1.25" Hubcentric spacers on the front and 1" Hubcentric spacers on the rear.
Your backspacing will depend on what rear end your using. I have the Ford IRS diff.
With a different backspacing you wouldn't need spacers. I used the spacers to move the wheels out closer to the edges of the fenders.

Now if your not doing full fenders and running boards you won't need spacers.

[FF33rod]

Your backspacing will depend on what rear end your using.

Really? I thought all FFR rears (3 link, 4 link, and IRS) all had the same width. No?

[progmgr1]

Really? I thought all FFR rears (3 link, 4 link, and IRS) all had the same width. No?

No, apparently not. I have a 4" backspace on my '33 and the wheels/tires are centered under the fenders (using 2015 IRS).
Keith HR #894

[JimLev]

Without spacers on the rear the inside edge of the tire was 3/8" from the body and the outside edge of the tire was 1 3/8" from the outer fender lip. It didn't look good. The spacer gave it the correct look.

[Roger Pugh]

I finally picked my wheels and tires. I have been a bit nervous about this as not only am I a newbie to this, I would hate getting them just to have them be the wrong size. Dave Brigham was good enough to talk to the wheel company for me to make sure all the numbers will work. The wheels are the Challenger EXL from Schott Wheels. I will also be painting a ceramic color with the groove down the middle of the spokes still polished. The pic in my avatar is a mock up of what it should look like. I think they are sharp. I also decided on the Nito 555 g2's. Hopefully they will give some miles while still looking great.

FFR told me today that the car will actually be done a bit early and Stewart already scheduled pick up. Should be here on the 16th of July. Can't wait to get this started.

[TxMike64]

Really? I thought all FFR rears (3 link, 4 link, and IRS) all had the same width. No?

There were three different 8.8 housings and four different axle lengths used for the Mustang [and two different IRS]. I believe the spec on the FFR33 is using a Fox body flange [hub-to-hub] width which is the narrowest Mustang 8.8 axle assembly.

8.8 Flange Widths:
Fox ('86-'93): 59.25"
SN95 ('94-'98): 60.75"
New Edge ('99-'04): 61.75"
S197 ('05-'14): 65.40"

The axle housing widths are the same on Fox and SN95 but use different axle lengths. The New Edge has a wider housing and longer axles. The S197 uses a unique wider housing and longer axles. The Fox, SN95, and New Edge were 4-link. S197 are 3-link.

I can't say for sure what housing width or flange width the Moser supplied FFR sold axles are - I assume Fox-body width.

I believe the IRS used on the FFR33 is custom as these are the Mustang IRS flange widths:
'03-'04 Cobra IRS: 62.50"
2015 IRS: 64.9"

[FF33rod]

the half shafts on the FFR IRS solution are custom, this makes the 3 link, 4 link and the IRS solutions from FFR all the same width. If you source other parts then validation of width is up to you

[RoadRacer]

There were three different 8.8 housings and four different axle lengths used for the Mustang [and two different IRS]. I believe the spec on the FFR33 is using a Fox body flange [hub-to-hub] width which is the narrowest Mustang 8.8 axle assembly.

8.8 Flange Widths:
Fox ('86-'93): 59.25"
SN95 ('94-'98): 60.75"
New Edge ('99-'04): 61.75"
S197 ('05-'14): 65.40"

The axle housing widths are the same on Fox and SN95 but use different axle lengths. The New Edge has a wider housing and longer axles. The S197 uses a unique wider housing and longer axles. The Fox, SN95, and New Edge were 4-link. S197 are 3-link.

I can't say for sure what housing width or flange width the Moser supplied FFR sold axles are - I assume Fox-body width.

I believe the IRS used on the FFR33 is custom as these are the Mustang IRS flange widths:
'03-'04 Cobra IRS: 62.50"
2015 IRS: 64.9"

Interestingly, and I may be wrong, but when I got my junkyard rear I researched and made the following notes:

"'02 Mustang GT rear (3.27, 8.8, limited slip, 5 lug, solid rotor, 62.52" wide)"

but i never measured it. I was happy to get the wider option at the time.. but perhaps it really is 61.75?

[WIS89]

Roger-

I am a little late to the welcome aboard party, but wanted to add my welcome! Congratulations on ordering your kit! I understand your son being excited, as my two were pretty nuts when I ordered mine!

However, I have a beef. You shared all of this information about your wicked cool garage, but didn't share any pictures; what gives? I would enjoy seeing your build space!

Congratulations again, and please share your progress. Also, please tell your son he will absolutely love it!!

Regards,

Steve

[Roger Pugh]

Roger-

I am a little late to the welcome aboard party, but wanted to add my welcome! Congratulations on ordering your kit! I understand your son being excited, as my two were pretty nuts when I ordered mine!

However, I have a beef. You shared all of this information about your wicked cool garage, but didn't share any pictures; what gives? I would enjoy seeing your build space!

Congratulations again, and please share your progress. Also, please tell your son he will absolutely love it!!

Regards,

Steve

Steve,

My humblest apologies!! I will attach some pics.

We are a bit crazy excited here, just got word that Stewart Transport is now picking it up a few days before they thought it would be done so super stoked. I'm now expecting it while on vacation. I will have a brother here to accept delivery but it's almost worth skipping vacation to be here for the 33 birth. Anyway, we have had fun decorating the shop as it will be where we live for the next many months. Had a friend make a really neat FFR sign, it's perfect. Just need a little more clean up and organization and we will be ready.

[FF33rod]

Wow even looks organized!

[j33ptj]

I am soooo jealous of the garages in the US, I have a large garage for Dutch houses and it is only 7.5x3.5m.... 24x9ft for the metrically challenged...

Will have to expand somehow when(!!) I start my build...

[TxMike64]

That's a NICE workspace! Congrats on starting your build, it will be a blast!

[TxMike64]

Interestingly, and I may be wrong, but when I got my junkyard rear I researched and made the following notes:

"'02 Mustang GT rear (3.27, 8.8, limited slip, 5 lug, solid rotor, 62.52" wide)"

but i never measured it. I was happy to get the wider option at the time.. but perhaps it really is 61.75?

Those are the numbers I have in my notes. I've seen various numbers all over the place, all different, even from reputable sources. These numbers were from LMR and were the same as another site (I think Hot Rod), so I stuck with these. To be honest, who knows which are accurate without going and measuring a hundred axles myself. Whatever the actual measurements, I know Fox is "spec" width, SN95 a bit wider, and New Edge a bit more wider, and S197 probably too wide. Like you I wanted a bit wider than the spec width to have a little more space between the tire and body, so I have a '00 axle I'm rebuilding.

(Sorry for the thread-jack Roger!)

[Roger Pugh]

I am soooo jealous of the garages in the US, I have a large garage for Dutch houses and it is only 7.5x3.5m.... 24x9ft for the metrically challenged...

Will have to expand somehow when(!!) I start my build...

We are pretty blessed. I built my house almost 20 years ago and it has a 3 car garage 42'x36', which my wife thought was overkill. However, she is the king of collecting things and putting them in totes and then forgetting about them. A couple of years ago my youngest son (the one who will be doing the build with me) was too young to join his two older siblings working with the other high schoolers at the local nursery so we decided to build the shop together. It's 50'x36' with a room in the back where I have all my tools (lathe, drill press etc) where I spend many hours turning pens and other small wood projects. I have a feeling I won't be spending much time in there for the next year or so.

[progmgr1]

The number of mods you make to the basic kit are exponentially related to the number of hours in the shop and the skills you need (ask me how I know). If you just build the kit more or less as delivered it really is a bolt / rivet assembly and a fairly quick process. Other than a few brackets, etc. you shouldn't have to fab anything. The minute you start adding "nice to have" features, all bets are off. Of course to me time spent in the shop is a benefit, not a cost. YMMV
The whole point of building one of these cars is to have fun, so do whatever you enjoy and make the car unique to you.
Keith HR #894