4-way issue

[FLFrank35]

I seem to have all of the lights working the way they are supposed to, except for the FRONT 4-ways.
With the key OFF, the brake lights, headlights and REAR 4-ways work, but not the front 4-ways.
With the key ON, the front 4-ways work in addition to the rest, including blinkers (front and rear).

Anyone else have this problem? The fuse panel, column wiring connector and headlight buckets all seem to check out. I'm thinking I need to open the main fuse panel harness and trace wires

Thanks,
Frank

[Papa]

How did you connect everything to the hazard switch?

[FLFrank35]

How did you connect everything to the hazard switch?

I have the Ron Francis harness which has the steering column connector, and the United Pacific headlights, all supplied with the kit. In the Front harness I have the Left Green Turn wire to the Front Left headlight and the Right Light Blue Turn wire to the Right Front headlight.

[Papa]

I have the Ron Francis harness which has the steering column connector, and the United Pacific headlights, all supplied with the kit. In the Front harness I have the Left Green Turn wire to the Front Left headlight and the Right Light Blue Turn wire to the Right Front headlight.

What did you do with the RF harness wires for the toggle switch that you aren't using in the dash harness? I have a roadster, so didn't do anything with the steering column plug, but used the wires in the dash harness to operate the hazards via a toggle. I assume if you are using the column plug, you had to cap off the other wires?

[FLFrank35]

What did you do with the RF harness wires for the toggle switch that you aren't using in the dash harness? I have a roadster, so didn't do anything with the steering column plug, but used the wires in the dash harness to operate the hazards via a toggle. I assume if you are using the column plug, you had to cap off the other wires?

Yes I temporarily capped the other wires...I'll probably remove/cap them permanently when I get this figured out.
Also, I cut (as instructed per the manual) the yellow and white rear turn signal wires from the green and blue front turns because they were feeding back and illuminating the front turns when I depressed the brake.
turnwires.png

[Papa]

Also, I cut (as instructed per the manual) the yellow and white rear turn signal wires from the green and blue front turns because they were feeding back and illuminating the front turns when I depressed the brake.
turnwires.png

Maybe a clue here, but I'll defer to those that have done a truck build as I'm not familiar with the specifics.

[Pat Landymore]

You will need at least two diodes to make this work.

I used 3 Amp, 50 volt diodes with axial leads as they are inexpensive and readily available. Google pn# 1N5400.

The first diode needs to be installed up by one of the headlights (I did it on the drivers side) between the “Park” or “DRL” feed and the signal light feed. Why? Because these LED headlamps require power on BOTH the Park and signal feeds at the same time in order to give a yellow colour. With the key off there is no DRL power so you need some way to get power on this wire when the 4 ways are running. The diode will bring power from the left 4 way input and power both park/DRL inputs to give you the yellow colour. The diode must be installed with the stripe end on the Park/DRL wire.

The second diode needs to be installed in the Park/DRL feed up towards the connector for the front wiring harness. Why? To prevent feed back from the DRL’s to the rest of the electrical system, only when the key is off and the 4 ways are operating. So it needs to be in the harness ahead of where your Park or DRL feed wire splits from a single wire into one for each headlamp. You could also do it under the dash, just ahead of the connector for the front harness. This diode needs to be installed with the stripe end on the headlight side of this wire.

This is only necessary for those running DRL’s! For those who have connected the park and signal light wires together directly in their headlights this diode deal does not apply.

[FLFrank35]

You will need at least two diodes to make this work.

I used 3 Amp, 50 volt diodes with axial leads as they are inexpensive and readily available. Google pn# 1N5400.

The first diode needs to be installed up by one of the headlights (I did it on the drivers side) between the “Park” or “DRL” feed and the signal light feed. Why? Because these LED headlamps require power on BOTH the Park and signal feeds at the same time in order to give a yellow colour. With the key off there is no DRL power so you need some way to get power on this wire when the 4 ways are running. The diode will bring power from the left 4 way input and power both park/DRL inputs to give you the yellow colour. The diode must be installed with the stripe end on the Park/DRL wire.

The second diode needs to be installed in the Park/DRL feed up towards the connector for the front wiring harness. Why? To prevent feed back from the DRL’s to the rest of the electrical system, only when the key is off and the 4 ways are operating. So it needs to be in the harness ahead of where your Park or DRL feed wire splits from a single wire into one for each headlamp. You could also do it under the dash, just ahead of the connector for the front harness. This diode needs to be installed with the stripe end on the headlight side of this wire.

This is only necessary for those running DRL’s! For those who have connected the park and signal light wires together directly in their headlights this diode deal does not apply.

Pat, please forgive my inexperience. I'm a little confused when you say install a diode "between" the Park/DRL feed and the signal feed. Would that be the same as "from the harness to the lamp?" Do I just solder the diode in-line, wire on each end? Then heat-shrink?
And I ran a separate wire for the DRLs and did not connect/use the Park wire. I currently have yellow Turn and 4-ways (but the key needs to be ON).

Also, I'm not sure I understand "bring power from the left 4 way input and power both park/DRL inputs."

I appreciate the explanations! It's always better to know why/how something works.

Thank you for your help!
Frank

[Pat Landymore]

Hi Frank:

The first diode I referred to must be installed bridging between your DRL feed wire and (in my example) the left signal light wire. The diode only allows current to flow one way. Installed as described it will power the DRL segment of both headlights when the 4 ways are on. Then the signal light portion of the headlights is getting pulsed by the 4 way flashers. This adds up to you having yellow 4 way flashers when the key is off.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Pat

[Pat Landymore]

The other diode is installed inline per your description.

Yes to soldering and shrink sleeve.

👍🏼👍🏼

[FLFrank35]

Great! I'll get to it soon.

Thanks for the clarification!
Frank

[chuck35truck]

Hey Pat, I am not an electrical person so I am a little confused. I installed the wiring as described in the manual and for the DRL. I did not connect the tan wire for the parking lights. The headlights and the taillights work but not the brake lights or turn signals. Do I need to install diodes like you described above? Your the first person who mentioned using diodes.

Thank you for your help!

[Pat Landymore]

Hi Chuck

The diodes I’ve mentioned are there to provide power to the signal lights in such a way that they will blink yellow, only when the four way flashers are activated and with the key off.
And most importantly, this matters only if you’ve configured your headlights for
DRL operation.

It sounds like you have other deeper issues with your wiring and lamp connections.

Let’s ignore the diodes for now...

I’ll PM you a list of questions and suggestions for the basic wiring of your lights after I’ve thought a bit about it.

[FLFrank35]

I couldn't get it to work . I installed a diode in the dash area on the Parking light (tan) wire, and one from in the headlight bucket between the Park wire and the Left Turn (green) wire. It seems that I don't have any power (at all) going to the forward 4-ways with the key OFF .

Just to be clear, I initially didn't have the Park (tan) wire connected at all. And I ran power for the DRLs from the Electric choke wire, so the key has to be on. And with this configuration, as well as the other connections, I have all lights working as they should with the key ON (including blinkers and all 4-ways), but with the key OFF I have headlights, tail lights, brake lights and rear 4-ways...no blinkers (which is normal) and no front 4-ways.

As I stated in post #5, I cut the yellow and white rear turn signal wires from the green and blue front turns because they were feeding back. Do you think with the diodes in place, I need to reconnect those wires?

Otherwise, I suppose I could open up the harnesses and the steering column to check the 4-way switch and the wiring path to the front flashers...though I don't relish that thought.

Thanks again,
Frank

[Pat Landymore]

Hi Frank:
I believe I’ve caused confusion by calling the feed wire for the DRL’s the “Park/DRL” feed as I did in post 7. I corrected my terminology for a more general audience in post 9 when I referred to it as “your DRL” feed wire.

As I understand your situation you have additionally connected the original “Park” feed, which is not what I intended. Please disconnect that and install the diode in your DRL feed wire as it is run from your Electric choke feed.

The wire in your headlight bucket that you’ve installed a diode in...is this the ‘Park’ wire from the harness, or the wire which activates your DRL’s? Again this may be confusion caused by my terminology.

The whole point of this mod is to get power onto the wire which turns your DRL’s on at the headlight (when the key is off) so that when the power comes from the 4 way signal flasher the yellow light will come on.

If you want, you could turn your 4 ways on with the key off as it is wired right now, go into your headlight bucket wiring with a 12 volt test lamp , probing the signal light wire. There should be an on/off voltage present even though the yellow light isn’t currently working. The fact your signal lights are working tells me all the other wiring in your truck should be correct.

Please accept my apologies for any additional work I’ve caused for you.

[FLFrank35]

No worries, I'm easily confused , but I think I got it!

I put a diode on my electric choke > DRL feed up under the dash and one in the bucket as you said...

IMG_1082.JPG

...and it all works the way it should! And, yes, I know wire-nuts are not proper connections, just temporary.

As Chuck said, you're the first person to mention the diodes. FF really should put that in the manual. It was super easy and cheap, now that I know how to properly use a diode

Thanks all of your patience and help!!
Moving on...
Frank

[Pat Landymore]

Awesome news Frank, I’m very happy to have helped you!

[Pat Landymore]

In a way I’m reluctant to post this, but had another series of questions recently regarding my DRL solution from a forum member.

So, here goes!

First is a video showing how the various functions of how the headlight/DRL/ signal light units work on my ‘35 pickup.

After that I will post a schematic of how I did it.

Please understand that I will gladly help someone through installing the diodes but I’m not interested in helping people with any other wiring issues on their truck. Yes, I’ve had those questions. I don’t know enough about GM Transmission controllers, Ford Mod Motors or Bob & Mike Inc’s. Magic fix-em-up box to answer any of that.

So better if I’m clear about what I know and what I don’t.

This is posted for those that have all aspects of their lighting working correctly with DRL’s, but still can’t get the four ways in the front to blink yellow/orange when the key is off.

Cheers,
Pat

https://youtu.be/lgzxqy0IMHA

And the schematic...

D81DECE3-5466-425E-B6EF-522592156D3D.jpeg

[hugo-k]

Does this headlight offer hi/lo, signals, DRL and park lights?

[edwardb]

Does this headlight offer hi/lo, signals, DRL and park lights?

Don't have mine installed yet. But have played with it on the workbench. Yes to all of the above. If you want DRL's though, needs to be wired and added to the harness. The Ron Francis harness doesn't have it.

[Pat Landymore]

Everyone please take note that although I have parking lights working on my truck, that entails additional wiring changes and a third diode.

If someone is genuinely interested in doing the same, let me know here. I’ll go out to the truck, figure out again how I did it and post a second schematic.
Cheers,
Pat

[hugo-k]

An updated scematic is appreciated! Thank you!

[VIRGIN MIKE]

Using the white bars as DRLs - feed moved to accessory ignition post - they only work as hazards with ignition on or in acc.; I'm okay with that. In the unimagined scenario, where I would need them for an extended period, I would just make sure the radio and any other non essential accessories are turned off; just my humble opinion. (the power windows might need to be used in this situation)

[Pat Landymore]

An updated scematic is appreciated! Thank you!

Here is the revised schematic.

Please take note: the intercept of the Park light wiring must be done exclusively for the front end wiring harness and not the rear. I’m not responsible for any feedback issues etc that occurs if someone gets it wrong.


2C19E2DB-92D7-46D8-9A86-11E2F40E65F9.jpg

[Pat Landymore]

Ps, had it out again today in approx -6C weather with ice, hard packed snow and salted slush surfaces. My buddy couldn’t believe how great this truck drives and how much traction it has!

Kudos to FFR and their engineering!!

[hugo-k]

Thanks for the information, but I just wonder, I want to be shure I understand what is written... A1124769-6CED-49BD-89D5-43FCA553E6B9.jpg

[j33ptj]

Thanks for the information, but I just wonder, I want to be shure I understand what is written... A1124769-6CED-49BD-89D5-43FCA553E6B9.jpg

Feed from Parklight to Front Only

Thats my guess..

[Pat Landymore]

Feed from Parklight to Front Only

Thats my guess..

That is correct, apologies for my terrible handwriting

[hugo-k]

Thank you!