TDI powered 818

[shauger]

Our team built a Hybrid GTM a few years ago. I have a new group of students this year and we decided to have them build a biodiesel powered 818. We plan to enter this vehicle in the Green Grand Prix at Watkins Glen in April.

The biggest challenge obviously is fitting the motor and transmission. We are running 2001 TDI engine tuned to 180 HP and 300 ft-lbs which is mated to an Audi six-speed transmission.

We got the motor and trans mounted this weekend. Next we have to fabricate axles. I'll post more pictures as soon as the axles are done.

[shauger]

installed motor.jpg
front motor mount.jpg
front motor.jpg
rear trans mount.jpg

[Frank818]

I knew you'd remove the V bar at the top of the engine bay.

The engine sits pretty high if I look at the oil pan?
How high is the engine from the bottom of the oil pan to the top of the highest part?
How are you going to fit the trunk lid panel (the one with 2 humps)?


These pix are great for me, gives me an idea how to fit a VW engine in (though not the same for me).

[Erik W. Treves]

that's pretty neat!

[Presto51]

Great Work!

Wow that didn't take long for someone to try to install another motor other than the subie power plant.

Now I wonder how hard it would be to stuff a Porsche Boxster drivetrain in it

Ron

[Erik W. Treves]

installed is one thing...finished is another...I think once the rear deck lid get placed on there, you might have a few problems...but it is a great start!!

[metalmaker12]

Cool idea

[wallace18]

A coupe top will work for this IMO.

[AZPete]

Great work so far. Please keep posting with photos of your progress because it's fun to see a different/creative/green 818 being built.

[D K]

Did you guys give any thought to the EE20?

We were thinking of going that route, but ultimatley decided on the FA20

[mn_vette]

Good work. I saw you guys on the news a few years ago with your GTM, and I was very stoked to find out that you were going to do the same thing with the 818. So are there going to be any side bars to keep the engine/tranny from twisting like on FWD cars? I guess maybe you don't need it with the engine not in parallel with the axles. Are you guys thinking of doing a cross brace behind the engine to help make up for the frame parts that were cut out?

[shauger]

We will have to modify the body slightly - the engine does sit high but it's due to the transmission. The bottom of the oil pan is about 3" above the bottom of the bottom rail.

[Oppenheimer]

Wow, great to see you guys back at this. In the years you've been doing this you've beat out University teams including MIT, as well as well funded Big 3 corporate efforts, and ultimately winning the Green Grand Prix. Thats more than something to be proud of, its the kind of thing that gets made into a movie. Underdog inner city high school kids and their genius teacher overcome obstacles and end up beating all comers and winning the big race.

How come you guys weren't on the Today show or something after winning the Green Grand Prix? Imagine the impact of them showing images of some of the goofy fish shaped cars that you competed against, then they have you roll your winning car onto the plaza for all to see, and the national TV audience collective jaws drop when they see the car the high school kids built that got 100 MPG is a supercar looking GTM. Its a better story than the Jamaican Bobsled Team movie Cool Runnings.

The ending of the movie is the high school kids build a Diesel powered car (818) that can be driven on the street that gets 75 mpg. They provide their plans to the small New England car manufacturer that their latest award winning design is based off, so they can start offering it as an option so anyone can build their own 75 MPG supercar. You are documenting your build, right? Recording the mods you have to make and drawings off all the brackets and such you have to make, so your results can be turned into a 818 kit option?

[wleehendrick]

Very cool! I enjoyed watching the Nova episode. Are you planning any modifications to the 818 body to reduce aero drag?

[ehansen007]

You go guys. Make sure to get the local Burger King, Jack in the Box, KFC, and McDonalds, to sponsor you for fuel!

[shauger]

Did you guys give any thought to the EE20?

We were thinking of going that route, but ultimatley decided on the FA20

Yes, we considered the EE20. We will probably do one of those in the future. We know the VW TDI engine well so we thought we would start with it.

[shauger]

A coupe top will work for this IMO.

We're thinking the same thing. I have a group of students working the our auto body teacher making a hard top. I'll post pictures when it's ready - we're months away from having that done.

[shauger]

Good work. I saw you guys on the news a few years ago with your GTM, and I was very stoked to find out that you were going to do the same thing with the 818. So are there going to be any side bars to keep the engine/tranny from twisting like on FWD cars? I guess maybe you don't need it with the engine not in parallel with the axles. Are you guys thinking of doing a cross brace behind the engine to help make up for the frame parts that were cut out?

We haven't mounted the torque mount yet. And yes, we are definitely adding cross bracing to replace what we cut out. I'll post pictures when it's done!

[shauger]

Wow, great to see you guys back at this. In the years you've been doing this you've beat out University teams including MIT, as well as well funded Big 3 corporate efforts, and ultimately winning the Green Grand Prix. Thats more than something to be proud of, its the kind of thing that gets made into a movie. Underdog inner city high school kids and their genius teacher overcome obstacles and end up beating all comers and winning the big race.

How come you guys weren't on the Today show or something after winning the Green Grand Prix? Imagine the impact of them showing images of some of the goofy fish shaped cars that you competed against, then they have you roll your winning car onto the plaza for all to see, and the national TV audience collective jaws drop when they see the car the high school kids built that got 100 MPG is a supercar looking GTM. Its a better story than the Jamaican Bobsled Team movie Cool Runnings.

The ending of the movie is the high school kids build a Diesel powered car (818) that can be driven on the street that gets 75 mpg. They provide their plans to the small New England car manufacturer that their latest award winning design is based off, so they can start offering it as an option so anyone can build their own 75 MPG supercar. You are documenting your build, right? Recording the mods you have to make and drawings off all the brackets and such you have to make, so your results can be turned into a 818 kit option?

I'm sold. Do you know anyone in Hollywood :-)

[shauger]

Very cool! I enjoyed watching the Nova episode. Are you planning any modifications to the 818 body to reduce aero drag?

We're not sure if we going to touch the body for the initial build. We want to see what king of economy numbers we can get at the Green Grand Prix first. We usually run a car for a couple years and keep tinkering with it. We will probably make aero mods down the line.

[Frank818]

the engine does sit high but it's due to the transmission. The bottom of the oil pan is about 3" above the bottom of the bottom rail.

That's what I thought. I hope in my case I can have the pan about 2" under the bottom rail, otherwise I guess I say byebye to the crossbar and will need to modify the deck lid.

[Frank818]

Any updates?

[Doowop]

thinking outside the box. Cool project!

[shauger]

Sorry for not posting for a while. We've decided to get the car ready for the Green Grand Prix at Watkins Glen. Our goal is to get better mileage than the GTM we raced there. I hope to post updates once a week.

Since the last post, we've got the axels 90% done - they will be installed next week. We've got the front and back suspension done and the rack in. We laid out the radiator, intercooler, and fuel cell. We hope to have them installed by the end of next week. I'll post pictures as soon as they're in.

We've made a bit of progress on the body. As you can see in the pictures, we started to design a roof. The TDI engine sits slightly above the rear deck so we hope to incorporate the roof design into covering the engine.

jSTwbwr.jpg

tYHfiDW.jpg

[Frank818]

Ha, that's the trick, you'll get rid of the rear humps/deck lid. Too excessive for me, if my VR6 sits too high, I'll have to find another way. But I like the curvature of your roof!

Am I seeing the intercooler inside the rear bumper? How are you designing the airflow?

[flynntuna]

Wow! I'm really enjoying following this build. The lines of your hard top look amazing, can't wait to see the final product. It reminds me of an other classic design.

[shauger]

Am I seeing the intercooler inside the rear bumper? How are you designing the airflow?[/QUOTE]

We did the same thing with the GTM. We had the GTM in Boeings wind tunnel and found high pressure at the top of the rear deck and low pressure at the rear of the car (no big surprise there). We ran the radiator and intercooler in the rear. The biggest surprise is that the radiator fan almost never comes on in this configuration which would indicate the airflow is very good (TDIs also happen to run cooler in general). If we were trying to set a land speed record, then the intercooler would need a better placement. But for how we drive the car, it works out great.

[Frank818]

That's interesting.
Where will you put the rad?

[shauger]

The radiator sits above the intercooler at an angle. I'll try to post some pics this weekend. We have some more photos on our flickr site:http://www.flickr.com/photos/evxteam...7640644850934/

[Frank818]

Hey there!

I see your build is done, pretty great!
What's going on on the hard top?

And any pix to give me a fitment idea of the top deck lid panels? I can't believe the engine fitted without modifying the FFR panels, so I would like to see what's been done in that area.

[mxcobra]

What is the exact tranny you used for this ?

[Speedy G]

Awesome build. Any chance you guys are going to sell the hardtop?

Speedy G