Holy cow I am tired of sanding! I have noticed though that when sanding the SP1600 it gives off a nice smelling odor, I think they've done this by design to make the task less aggravating. I'm slowly getting the panels block sanded, re-installed, and working out the final gaps and alignment. I still have to address the hood fitment issue on the driver side, I plan to try heat treatment this weekend to see if I can get it worked out.
Yes Sethmark, I am truly skilled...at craftily taking photos so that you can't see the flaws
And Jop… that plastic is the floor to my 'hi-tech' paint booth
So I spoke with one of the HOK reps yesterday to get a little guidance on my next steps. I have to say again how impressed I am with their technical support. This is the second time that I've called but did not reach anyone and didn't leave a message thinking that I'd call back another time. Instead I received a callback within ten minutes from one of the guys asking if I needed help with anything...great company.
Good news is no more SP1600 for me. I'm not complaining, it's a great product and performs just as advertised, but it's a bit of a chore to sand. Once I'm done sanding the SP1600 coat and working some panel alignment issues I'll be moving on to the KD3000. One drawback that I hadn't worked into my plan though is that the KD3000 wont work at 65 degrees or below. May not be an issue here in Houston but I could potentially need to revise my plans if I'm not able to finish the bodywork as planned and get stuck sitting for a few months.
Yes Sethmark, I am truly skilled...at craftily taking photos so that you can't see the flaws
And Jop… that plastic is the floor to my 'hi-tech' paint booth
So I spoke with one of the HOK reps yesterday to get a little guidance on my next steps. I have to say again how impressed I am with their technical support. This is the second time that I've called but did not reach anyone and didn't leave a message thinking that I'd call back another time. Instead I received a callback within ten minutes from one of the guys asking if I needed help with anything...great company.
Good news is no more SP1600 for me. I'm not complaining, it's a great product and performs just as advertised, but it's a bit of a chore to sand. Once I'm done sanding the SP1600 coat and working some panel alignment issues I'll be moving on to the KD3000. One drawback that I hadn't worked into my plan though is that the KD3000 wont work at 65 degrees or below. May not be an issue here in Houston but I could potentially need to revise my plans if I'm not able to finish the bodywork as planned and get stuck sitting for a few months.
I would suggest you look at their cold weather reducers and activators, they work very well, I needed them. I also heated up my shop hotter than normal and then shut it off before spraying such that the residual heat would be adequate to dry the primers. One extra piece of advice, if you blow through the KD3000 when sanding, then I would spray the extra coats so you alleviate any possible pinholes you won't see now. When doing this again, as much of a PIA the SP1600 is to sand, I will be applying an additional coat such that I have a consistent finish and it will ensure that its as smooth as possible.
Here's a couple of pics of my hood and side panel after buff, polish and application of CQuartz ceramic nano coating. Really happy with the outcome!! 20191116_101422R.jpg20191116_101449.jpg
PS. No comments on the bedding, it used to be my kid's room, now my grandkids room!
Black & Copper #1028 ("The Mistress" according to my wife! )
Brought home: Nov. 2017, GoKart: May 2018, will be Plated & on the Road April 2020
Andreas
Your ride is looking awesome AJT. You’re putting a ton of work into that paint and it sure is looking great. I definitely see your point about the pin holes, those damn things are everywhere. Any idea what causes that?
Made it through round two this past Monday. I sprayed two coats of the KD3000 mixed as a medium build primer. It was quite a bit easier to shoot than the thicker SP1600 for my 4-stage turbine set-up. Time to put it all back together for a final fit, this time with the weather stripping.
I made good progress over this past week. Body is back together except for the rear fenders which I’ll get to this week some time. Doors are back on and aligned, probably my fifth or sixth time to install and align them and it’s still a total PITA. I’m planning to pin all of the hinge hardware before taking it apart this time in hopes that it’ll help with re-assembly later on. C7B87C3B-D512-4A24-A83D-4703C5A45993.jpeg
My replacement driver door cracked at the bear claw just like the original. I have to think now that it’s either a mold misalignment issue or my steel door structure is off. I’m definitely not going to start over with a new door so I’ll need to figure out a patch that looks presentable. 6A2121C9-74CD-4F40-A2DE-71504C2BA9B1.jpeg
Hard top went back on with no issues so it appears that leaving it in the sun strapped in place earlier this year to get it aligned has paid off. With the doors aligned and the top in place I’m able to get the side window measurements. I’ll be making the cuts but debating if I need to do the full window install now as a test fit or just wait until final assembly. B9BE7FC2-BD90-4598-BC12-28E8A2AA99E8.jpeg
Next weekend I hope to get the body panel alignment close to completion. The hood is still fighting me a bit but with the use of a heat gun and strategically placed weight I’m zeroing in on it. 49A12844-3AB6-4639-B1C3-9B4BE93487F7.jpeg
Per your photo, it looks like the door is hitting the striker.
Yes, it was, I've fixed that. Door strikers have been one of the oddities when fitting the doors along with the tendency of fiberglass to 'move around'. Every time that I've fitted, taken apart, and re-assembled there are tweaks required to get it back in-line. I had to modify both door strikers to make them fit and on the last round of dis-assembly/re-assembly they aligned just right. Some how on this round of re-assembly the pass side fit fine and the driver side didn't so I had to cut it down more. It likely has to do with the infinite adjustability of the door frame and hinge assembly.
I’m getting close! Well, not close to being finished but close to another milestone.
Working on panel alignment over the past week. I suppose that all of the hours spent sanding, shaping, removing, installing, and repeating paid off for this latest round of fitment. I ended up with only a few areas that needed attention in order to get a smooth transition between panels. The hood of course is one, it’s been a PITA since the beginning. in original condition it was very low in the rear center and about 3/8” too high on the driver and passenger rear. It also had extreme contact on the passenger rear at the side where it overlaps the side panel. I’ve done quite a bit of heat gun work on it up to this point and had it close enough to where I only needed minor shaping and body filler to finish it off. 5AA52130-C0B7-442A-A59D-F4546C510E07.jpg 9A908C73-1D3D-4EB7-A346-97324DE76DF2.jpeg
I made a few changes with the door hinges as well. Using the door stops as shown in the manual didn’t allow the doors to open wide enough for me so I removed them and will likely weld in new stops later. I’ve adjusted the hinge slots on the body side and marked where I will add the new stops on the door hinge bracket. Much better with the new setup. 01750CED-C4B8-46F0-B11D-3A934F1272AA.jpeg
Added bonus with removing the original door stops is that I can now remove the doors with the hinge arms in place. This makes a huge improvement on removing and replacing the doors. 02B9CAFA-453A-42A8-AF78-EC24AFE8EE10.jpeg
I’ve also drilled several alignment locations on the door hinge hardware hoping that it will help with alignment during final assembly. I have a total of six holes drilled per side in the hinge arms, hinge brackets, and side bars. My original plan was to drill and tap each of the holes for #10 screws but I quickly learned that this chassis steal is really hard stuff. So after breaking two #10 taps and a 1/4” I decided to abandon the tap idea. I now have 1/4” holes at each location without threads. B096B3C9-1A02-4686-AC6E-C1B5992A1E43.jpeg
I modified the door stops by removing the allen head socket top, adding a piece of steel and offsetting the top, welding it all back together. Now with the offset you can adjust how far , within limits, you want the door to open. It does open considerably more than stock, provides room for my old crotchty body to get in and out and still plenty of room for body clearance. FFR could easily make a bolt with an eliptical head that would work.
I modified the door stops by removing the allen head socket top, adding a piece of steel and offsetting the top, welding it all back together. Now with the offset you can adjust how far , within limits, you want the door to open. It does open considerably more than stock, provides room for my old crotchty body to get in and out and still plenty of room for body clearance. FFR could easily make a bolt with an eliptical head that would work.
This sounds like a good solution to the limited access.
Do you have a photo of it to post?
Thanks
i really appreciate the compliments guys. I’m certainly not an expert but working through this has really improved my skills! Lessons that I would have rather not learned after spending this much money on the body kit, but I’m happy with the progress.
There are a few things that I feel could help others;
Patience is a must have. Thankfully now that I’m older I’ve mellowed out quit a bit. I could definitely see my younger self kicking the sh!t out of this fiberglass at several points and making it worse. Been there done that On this project I’ve learned to not set specific goals but instead accept that I may end up working for days on a task that it seems should only take an hour (doors are a good example).
Put the power tools away. For initial fitting I used a DA and air file but since that point it’s been 99% manual. My primary tools are a long dura-block and a long soft sand block.
My initial plan was to scuff the gel coat in prep for the first round of primer. However, following advise from HOK I went really aggressive on the gel coat and knocked down a lot of the high spots prior to primer. I’m thinking that doing so likely saved from doing repeated primer rounds trying to build up around the high spots...don’t really know. I can say that after my first coat of SP1600 I’ve been working with mostly flat surfaces and not negotiating with high spots.
Dremel the heck out of every seam. Don’t skip any of the seam areas, if they look even slightly transparent or opaque dig them out and repair them. Take a look at this shot of the front lower section of my hard top. This started with my finding an opaque dot smaller than a pencil eraser. Turned out to be extremely flimsy beneath. 08F756E6-552C-4B0B-A800-17267986877E.jpeg
Buy the Norton Dry Ice sandpaper like AJT recommends. Takes a while for it to arrive even using Amazon so think ahead.
Two is one and one is none. Buy more of everything. Sandpaper, primer, mixing cups, spreaders, bolts, nuts....etc. it’s really frustrating to have to shut down because you’ve run out of something cheap.
Fiberglass can be heated and re-shaped to some extent if you’re patient with it. I’ve had success with my hood and door edges using a heat gun, some weights, and straps.
Read everything on every thread here repeatedly. There’s a ton of practical knowledge here. During your build go back and re-read threads that you’re sure you’ve already seen. Nine times outa ten, depending on your build progress you’ll notice details that you’ve missed before. Things are more relevant when they’re relevant I glance at my build manual rarely, but re-read post from AJT, SVT, FF, JOP and others constantly. When I finally get to the mechanical part I’ll be doing the same.
I’m sure that this will come as a surprise to everyone, but test fitting my hard top windshield today was a complete no-go. Man I'm glad I did this test fit before paint! My current summary of the Gen 2 body as it comes from FF...’it’s made of fiberglass and none of it fits together’. OK I guess that’s a little harsh, my trunk lid and rear hard top glass fit well...but that’s all! Rant over.
Windshield glass didn’t fit into the opening at all. I’ve had to carve out a substantial amount of material all the way around the inset just to get it close. I’m to the point that removing any more material makes me nervous that I’ll end up with stress cracks later from vibrations or other mechanical stresses related to driving. Really wish I’d have just gone with the soft top but I like the look of the hard top, plus I have a lot of hours invested in this top so far. It’s hard to get a good photo that explains but to sum it up either the hard top opening is too small or the glass is too large. In retrospect test fitting the windshield should have been step #1 prior to any sanding or primer work. CC906D8D-72AE-4144-9A35-DD4BCF6EF504.jpeg A933B4EF-A42D-428F-A4DC-C357B18AC0EE.jpeg 026BE1D4-558F-40C8-903D-3BA0FF8B3ACC.jpeg
I knew early on that the supplied door handles just weren’t my thing, I’m looking for a smoother look. I ended up ordering a used Vette door handle off of EBay wanting to see if it fit my vision and also fit the Hot Rod door. Today I finally took the plunge, held my breath, and went for it.
I’m really happy with this. I’ll need to make a linkage rod to get to the door latch and figure out a way to get the lock to work but that shouldn’t be a problem. Notice I had to mount the handle in reverse to make the linkage work also. Good victory after fighting the windshield issue earlier today.
Last edited by Michael101; 12-09-2019 at 08:07 PM.
Those door handles look good. I'm going forward with no handles and using door poppers, but this is a good backup idea if Plan A falls apart (again). Keith
Sorry I didn't respond sooner about the door stops and I didn't take any pictures during assembly. Basically I made an ecentric or an off center circle on the end of the bolt which allows you to adjust the amount of opening of the door. I set it snug, opened the door to the point I wanted then tighten the bolt. Being 6'-2" and old joints, the extra width helps a lot getting in or out.
The Gen 2 power window setup looks to be quite an improvement from before. I had to make a call to FF to help me understand the instructions since my manual still had Gen 1 info in it. But Tony steered me in the right direction and all turned out well.
Something important to note. In my manual it leads to cutting the window openings on the top of the door to somewhere near 3/4” but the Gen 2 opening requirement is much larger. I wasted quite a bit of time carefully trimming before Tony pointed out that I wasn’t even close to getting the cut opened up enough.
Another important point. I’d initially thought that I’d wait until final assembly to fully install the entire window assembly but thankfully decided to do the full install now and tear it down before pint. Getting the whole assembly completed isn’t all that difficult but you will need to remove and re-install the parts multiple times to complete it. I think that the odds are that I’d have slipped up at least once and damaged my paint if I’d waited. Also, getting the final window alignment requires trimming and drilling so again there would be risk to a finished surface.
Two things about removing and replacing the window motor assembly repeatedly. One, insert the screw that I show here first instead of the one shown in the manual. Trust me, after your first try you’ll understand. Two, the blunt threads of the screws along with the flat face of the motor mount threads are a big challenge especially since you’re working in a tight space. Find some 1/4”-20 tapered point bolts to use for mock up. 04578C08-9305-4A27-BD01-44104DB45C40.jpeg
Last piece to the bodywork puzzle is done. Mounted the roadster windshield without any issues. Can anyone tell me if it’s safe to take this windshield frame apart? I’d like to have it powder coated but can’t tell for sure if it’s glued or just using rubber for the glass mount. B55E8B4B-BE71-4EBA-B0BE-47288F863DCF.jpeg
So after seven months of bodywork I'm now moving on towards the mechanical fun. I have my body parts set aside and will continue to work towards final paint but can now work the go cart as well. I’m thinking that a few weeks of prepping the metal parts and test fitting a few things should do and then it’s off to the powder coat guy. 38F14AB5-E817-46E0-80B5-21C8E799FE51.jpeg
Last piece to the bodywork puzzle is done. Mounted the roadster windshield without any issues. Can anyone tell me if it’s safe to take this windshield frame apart? I’d like to have it powder coated but can’t tell for sure if it’s glued or just using rubber for the glass mount. B55E8B4B-BE71-4EBA-B0BE-47288F863DCF.jpeg
I had my frame apart for polishing with no issue. If you are going to powder or plate, make sure you tape off any mating surfaces so that the frame fits back easily without a lot of clean up.
33' Hot Rod Coupe/Roadster (GEN 1), Fendered, Ford 302, 350hp, EFI, AOD, 4-Link, Double Adjustable Koni Coilovers, Split Rear Exhaust, Electric Power Steering, AC/Heat/Defrost, Moser 8.8"-3.55, Willwood Front/Rear Brakes, 18" x 8" Fronts/20" x 10" Rears, Ordered: 1.26.17, Arrived: 3.29.17, First Start: 7.2.18, Go Cart: 11.4.18 Paint/Body: 2.23.19, Back Home: 11.24.19, Completed: NEVER!; View More Pics @ https://starmobileone.com/
The Gen 2 power window setup looks to be quite an improvement from before. I had to make a call to FF to help me understand the instructions since my manual still had Gen 1 info in it. But Tony steered me in the right direction and all turned out well.
Something important to note. In my manual it leads to cutting the window openings on the top of the door to somewhere near 3/4” but the Gen 2 opening requirement is much larger. I wasted quite a bit of time carefully trimming before Tony pointed out that I wasn’t even close to getting the cut opened up enough.
Another important point. I’d initially thought that I’d wait until final assembly to fully install the entire window assembly but thankfully decided to do the full install now and tear it down before pint. Getting the whole assembly completed isn’t all that difficult but you will need to remove and re-install the parts multiple times to complete it. I think that the odds are that I’d have slipped up at least once and damaged my paint if I’d waited. Also, getting the final window alignment requires trimming and drilling so again there would be risk to a finished surface.
Two things about removing and replacing the window motor assembly repeatedly. One, insert the screw that I show here first instead of the one shown in the manual. Trust me, after your first try you’ll understand. Two, the blunt threads of the screws along with the flat face of the motor mount threads are a big challenge especially since you’re working in a tight space. Find some 1/4”-20 tapered point bolts to use for mock up. 04578C08-9305-4A27-BD01-44104DB45C40.jpeg
For a Gen 1 build you might want to check out Tim Collins' build thread (tcollins). Tim built aluminum window support frames and shared his design drawings with anyone who asked. Really nice build and a really nice guy.
Keith
I’ve spent the last couple of weeks prepping metal and marking it for powder coating. I think that the hardest part has been to finally land on a color and stop flopping around about what direction I’m going but that’s finally over. It’s been a little weird for me, I usually know exactly what color combos I’m after before I even start on a build but not with this car. I think the issue is that regardless of the color, it’s still going to be a cool looking car so every color that I imagine would work.
Made the trip today to drop off the frame and parts for powder. While I live in Houston and have easy access to several reputable coating companies, I chose to make the 280 mile round trip to Louisiana so that a long time friend can do the work. I’ve known this guy for many years and trust him.
Love your build!! You are doing an amazing job! If you don't mind me asking... could you provide a ballpark figure on your powder coating costs? i have asked several shops but no responses yet.
Love your build!! You are doing an amazing job! If you don't mind me asking... could you provide a ballpark figure on your powder coating costs? i have asked several shops but no responses yet.
PC costs vary widely between vendors and locations. Out here in the People's Republic of Kalifornia the cost to coat a chassis is 4-8 times what it is in Louisiana, for example. Also, don't forget the cost of the prep work - some shops quote that separately. I suggest you take photos (or actual parts, if small) of what you want coated to several shops in your area and talk to the owner / manager. Finding someone you can work with is more important than absolute lowest price, IMHO. Keith