Wow, Jesse, way to make hay after getting the kit! You're moving right along! And while your first build was something to be proud of, I can see how the game gets upped on a second build. Really nice build going. The 3/8" spaghetti noodle AutoZone line ... yep, I remember that part. Good choice moving away from that. The rear brake lines ... yep, I kept them inside the DS footbox as well, but didn't have the challenge of the Coyote go-pedal. Might seem a bit wonky ... but only to you. Just as functional and reliable, and no one else will see it. Good choice.
Parking brake - great job. Look at that guy stick to a budget (so he can blow it in other places)! Seriously, I'd suggest you do a separate post in the main roadster forum once you've got everything dialed in. Photos, bill of materials, etc. It'll get copied widely, I'll bet.
Looks like you're having a blast. Thanks for sharing in another build thread!
Really nice of you to say. Thanks John.
You are at the hardest part of any build, picking the color, I have unburdened myself by knowing up front. Second time has been a breeze. lol
Originally Posted by Fman
Nice work Jesse, I am really curious how the e-brake location will work. Will that be accessible for adjustment once the body is on?
Travis, the best part of this system is theoretically at least is the tension is set by the current sensor in the board. It will pull to the same tension regardless of how long it takes to get there. Theoretically, it is self adjusting. As the cable stretches it will adjust on it's own.
I have hedged my bets with a spare actuator and board just in case. If the car in on jacks I should be able to reach up there and change whatever I needed to. Hopefully nothing.
Great write ups so far and you're steaming right along. I like the hex head screws in the bracket. I think I will follow this as I like the idea of being able to move/remove bracketing without having to drill out rivets. A good compromise that is probably just one step down from welding.
Coupe complete kit ordered: 9/26/24. Gen 4 Coyote. T-56. IRS w/3.73. Wilwoods. PS. HVAC. Side windows.
Just found your build thread and enjoying a lot of the creativity here, especially on the electric parking brake. I moved mine to the top of the tunnel like you originally mocked up. I actually like the look of the FFR handle.
One thing from your pedal box to check --> grab the Coyote DBW (drive by wire) plug that plugs into the pedal and check if you can actually plug it in. On my pedal box, because of the final position of the pedal I wasn't able to get it plugged in and had to hack away at the pedal box metal to make a clearance notch for the cable. Easier to do now vs. AFTER you run all your harnesses into there like I did. Not sure if this is typically required or not, but it's the only way I could get my DBW plug installed.
Also when you get to the driveshaft safety loop, check out what I did (post #172 and post #173). You may not need to modify it like I did (this was due to modifications on the transmission A-frame I had to make for my T56).
Darryl [dbo_texas]
MKIV #9644 (build thread) (Index)
MK4 Complete Kit | Gen2 crate Coyote | Tremec T56, 3.55 IRS | power steering | hydroboost | dual roll bars | FFR carbon fiber dash | 18" Halibrands + Wilwoods | RT drop trunk kit & turn signal | front battery mount | saddle leather Intatrim Stoneleigh seats + interior accents
Just found your build thread and enjoying a lot of the creativity here, especially on the electric parking brake. I moved mine to the top of the tunnel like you originally mocked up. I actually like the look of the FFR handle.
One thing from your pedal box to check --> grab the Coyote DBW (drive by wire) plug that plugs into the pedal and check if you can actually plug it in. On my pedal box, because of the final position of the pedal I wasn't able to get it plugged in and had to hack away at the pedal box metal to make a clearance notch for the cable. Easier to do now vs. AFTER you run all your harnesses into there like I did. Not sure if this is typically required or not, but it's the only way I could get my DBW plug installed.
Also when you get to the driveshaft safety loop, check out what I did (post #172 and post #173). You may not need to modify it like I did (this was due to modifications on the transmission A-frame I had to make for my T56).
These are great tips. I will keep an eye out on the loop when I get there. I just happened to plug the pedal in this evening and it cleared.
Better lucky than good.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 10-22-2024 at 10:55 AM.
Last time I bled the brakes I used a friends pressure bleeder. This really worked well and is in my opinion the way to go. I say that because I purchased a vacuum bleeder. I did not like it. There is a couple reasons. First is it is hard to get a good vacuum seal. Even if you do it is nearly impossible to determine if you have pulled all the air out. The vacuum pulls air through the bleed valve so it looks like your endlessly bleeding the brakes. I ended up just pulling on each caliper for a while then got my daughter to help me finish it the old fashioned way. I am pleased to report no leaks were found and we appear to be fully bled and in business
Say it with me, "a coyote is not an SBF".
This wasn't necessarily a case of I have done this before so I moved too quickly but it kind of is. I read the coyote instructions and assumed that their recommendation to put the PCM on the footbox was a good one. When I finally got around to laying things out I realized this was not in fact a good idea. First it puts a funny bend in the harness and it doesn't lay it out in a way that is ideal for getting through the firewall. Lastly I am installing a heater so that really made it a no go. Of course I had already mounted the regulator but fortunately I was able to re use one of the holes for the PCM. I took a step back and re mocked everything up.
Now it was time to start laying out all the spaghetti and rough the wiring harness in. I also got my Kleiner mod up and running.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 10-20-2024 at 12:11 AM.
I took the opportunity this time to thin the herd a bit. The hot rod harness was the first to go.
I also got rid of the warning light. I put a weather pack connection on the pig tails and will run a proper check engine light in the dash.
I mounted the OBD II port and the inertia switch.
So many grounds. There are 5 grounds in the coyote control pack harness. 3 chassis grounds, 1 direct battery ground and the 16 pin harness has a ground. This is a well grounded operation. Indecently the wire to the coyote pedal and the clutch safety switch cleared without any issue in my case.
I have the firewall now set and mounted the computer. The coyote and RF harness are in place, the fuse box is in and I have sketched out my wiring plan. It's a good start. I will be doing this for a while. I actually kind of love this part. The only thing left up in the air is a cutoff switch. I am going with a push button RFID start system. I feel like I want to be able to kill power at the same time I can't find a place to put it that I like. I think if it happens it will be in the engine bay. If I can't find a way to make that work I will not do it. I am not committed enough to the idea to force it.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 10-20-2024 at 09:41 AM.
It's interesting about vacuum bleeding. I owned a Mityvac for a few years and thought it was going to be perfect for bleeding the brakes on my last build. I squeezed the trigger about 67 thousand times over two days and still had a spongey pedal. Went and got my neighbor, pumped the pedal the old fashioned way and voila! brakes bled and pedal firm. I am sure there are other applications for that tool but I sold it on ebay the following week. I am looking forward to pressure bleeding the brakes on my Daytona as I have not tried that but from all reports, seems like the way to go.
Coupe complete kit ordered: 9/26/24. Gen 4 Coyote. T-56. IRS w/3.73. Wilwoods. PS. HVAC. Side windows.
I squeezed the trigger about 67 thousand times over two days
That's not enough squeezes....
I had a time getting all of the air out of my Wilwood brakes even with a pressure bleeder. What i found worked best is to let the system gravity bleed for a day and using these. Obviously keeping an eye on the fluid level in the reservoirs. That got me 95% there and pressure bleeding finished it off, nice firm pedal now.
It's interesting about vacuum bleeding. I owned a Mityvac for a few years and thought it was going to be perfect for bleeding the brakes on my last build. I squeezed the trigger about 67 thousand times over two days and still had a spongey pedal. Went and got my neighbor, pumped the pedal the old fashioned way and voila! brakes bled and pedal firm. I am sure there are other applications for that tool but I sold it on ebay the following week. I am looking forward to pressure bleeding the brakes on my Daytona as I have not tried that but from all reports, seems like the way to go.
Mine uses the compressor to create venturi vacuum. It was a foamy mess.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 10-22-2024 at 12:07 PM.
As I work my way through the wiring I have tried to keep working in sections. I broke it down by RF harness, coyote harness, coyote/RF merge, power wiring, trans tunnel/rear end, bluetooth/driving cameras and the dash. So I continue to knock down the list and have moved onto the merge.
I wired in the LED trailer converter this went in without issue. If anyone is interested someone in this forum created this wiring diagram. I used it on my last build and used it again for this one. I didn't create it but it is super helpful so thank you to whoever I took this from.
I also connected the fuel pump per the FFR instructions along with the blue starter wire and the ignition relay trigger to the EFI/Crank wires. I cut back the rest and capped with heat shrink.
I tightened up the rest of the harness and cleaned up the foot box.
Before I can finish laying out the power wire I need to make sure the firewall is set. This means finishing mocking up the heater. When I left it it was trimmed down but needed some refinement. First I cut it with a hand saw. This would have worked much better with a band or table saw. Making it plane is key. I brought it to a buddys house and cleaned up the cut. Then I purchased rubber trim to seal the edge.
I purchased some generic L brackets and mocked it up
Installed rivnuts in the firewall and bolted it on
I seals up pretty well. I plan to put a thin layer of weather seal between the rubber and the firewall. I though about using silicone but with all the heat cycles I think seal is the way to go. I will also trim down the brackets to clean them up.
Clean install. I like the use of rivnuts and that the heater hoses are routed along the outside of the engine bay. I wasn't crazy about where mine had to go with the FFR supplied heater.
Clean install. I like the use of rivnuts and that the heater hoses are routed along the outside of the engine bay. I wasn't crazy about where mine had to go with the FFR supplied heater.
Thanks man, I feel the same, this unit as designed had them on the inside. I simply rotated it. It works better for this layout that way.
I’ve become a big fan of rivnuts, just cleaner. I mounted the wipers the same way. I’ll use a little blue lock tight when it’s time to permanently mount stuff
What is the function of the 5-4 wire converter? Are you using different tail light assemblies than what was furnished from the complete kit or is there a mismatch in the RF wiring harness?
What is the function of the 5-4 wire converter? Are you using different tail light assemblies than what was furnished from the complete kit or is there a mismatch in the RF wiring harness?
It’s an LED converter. The square tail lights that come with the kit are LED’s. You have to wire in the converter in-line. The kit comes now with the tail lights, the converter and the correct flasher relays. Its’s connected in line wire for wire accept the purple brake light wire. That is connected to the input side (red) but not the output. Everything else is connected the same to either side. It can be mounted behind the dash or at the back of the car. If you do it back there and had a problem you would have to drop the fuel tank to replace it. That’s why I put it where I did. There are instructions on the build manual but like most things it’s explained better on the forum.
I've been thinking about using a cut off switch. I don't have a good place in the cockpit. Everywhere I considered I either don't like or the space is otherwise spoke for. I mentioned if I could find a good place in the engine bay I would do it but it had to work. My thinking on the switch is simply this. If my push button start has a glitch and the engine won't shut off a switch makes it easy. Also, it's nice if we go to lunch and leave the car or at a show I can pull the key and not worry about it.
I was puttering around the garage and remembered I had this. The bracket for mounting the PCM. I cut the FFR logo out and widened it. I put a couple holes with grommets as a wire pass through and got to work.
I mounted it to the front of the footbox. I also put a busbar on top. this is where I attached the ignition wires from the RF harness and tied them to the starter power on the right side of the switch.
On the other side of the switch I put the battery power and tied it to the PCM. Ala the same way Paul and any number of other builders wired their coyotes. As Paul pointed out in his anniversary build the Ford Performance instructions recommend keeping the PCM on battery power.
I ran the battery wire along the 4 inch rail right next to the coyote battery ground.
I tapped a separate lug for the engine ground. It's pretty busy on that side of the car so I will ground the engine drivers side
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 10-26-2024 at 10:56 PM.
After mocking up the heater I wanted a good way to really seal it to the firewall. One thing I didn't consider when I came up with this plan is if the firewall is flat. The frame is not perfect and unless you consider this when your installing your firewall and shim it on the sides it creates a subtle bow. Hmm, what to do. It's not bad but by using a high powered flashlight I could see light leaking through. I marked the outside of the heater with it mounted and then installed some 1/2 x 1/4 adhesive backed window seal
This ended up working really well. It creates a perfect seal and covers for any variation in the surface. I then filled in the center with insulation mat. I cut out the holes for the vents, trimmed the brackets and re installed. It all worked so well I forgot to take a picture. If for any reason I have to remove the heater again I take one..... Sorry
I also used rivnuts to mount my wiper motor. It's now a little tight but everything fits pretty well. I am pleased with it.
This is where everything is at as I move to the trans tunnel and rear end.
***Update***
After looking at these pictures I realize I hated the "wow" that was on the right side under the switch. It looked sloppy so I reversed the hose clamps. Now it's a lot cleaner.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 10-26-2024 at 07:26 PM.
Looks good. There's a lot going on in that engine compartment! I am following your build closely as your combination of items is going to be very similar to my coupe build. Just got an email that mine will be ready on 11/17 - 10 days early! Keep up the good work.
Coupe complete kit ordered: 9/26/24. Gen 4 Coyote. T-56. IRS w/3.73. Wilwoods. PS. HVAC. Side windows.
I've been thinking about using a cut off switch. I don't have a good place in the cockpit. Everywhere I considered I either don't like or the space is otherwise spoke for. I mentioned if I could find a good place in the engine bay I would do it but it had to work. My thinking on the switch is simply this. If my push button start has a glitch and the engine won't shut off a switch makes it easy. Also, it's nice if we go to lunch and leave the car or at a show I can pull the key and not worry about it.
I was puttering around the garage and remembered I had this. The bracket for mounting the PCM. I cut the FFR logo out and widened it. I put a couple holes with grommets as a wire pass through and got to work.
I mounted it to the front of the footbox. I also put a busbar on top. this is where I attached the ignition wires from the RF harness and tied them to the starter power on the right side of the switch.
On the other side of the switch I put the battery power and tied it to the PCM. Ala the same way Paul and any number of other builders wired their coyotes. As Paul pointed out in his anniversary build the Ford Performance instructions recommend keeping the PCM on battery power.
I ran the battery wire along the 4 inch rail right next to the coyote battery ground.
I tapped a separate lug for the engine ground. It's pretty busy on that side of the car so I will ground the engine drivers side
Nice clean install! My only concern is if your in an accident and are trapped in the car you wont be able to use the cutoff because it's not within arms reach.
Looks good. There's a lot going on in that engine compartment! I am following your build closely as your combination of items is going to be very similar to my coupe build. Just got an email that mine will be ready on 11/17 - 10 days early! Keep up the good work.
That’s awesome. Delivery day is the best. If you’re looking for a build thread to follow Namrumps here has a really detailed one. Your setup will be more friendly for some of these, I also don’t know that I have ever seen a glovebox in a coupe.
Originally Posted by Namrups
Nice clean install! My only concern is if your in an accident and are trapped in the car you wont be able to use the cutoff because it's not within arms reach.
I hear ya, the other option was not to have one at all. I’m not really using it as an emergency shutoff so much as a security tool. I didn’t have one on my last build. I would hope if I was in an accident the inertia switch would shut it down.
That’s awesome. Delivery day is the best. If you’re looking for a build thread to follow Namrumps here has a really detailed one. Your setup will be more friendly for some of these, I also don’t know that I have ever seen a glovebox in a coupe.
I hear ya, the other option was not to have one at all. I’m not really using it as an emergency shutoff so much as a security tool. I didn’t have one on my last build. I would hope if I was in an accident the inertia switch would shut it down.
That #4 positive cable is a lot of wire being exposed to a lot of heat. Resistance increases with length and heat. Good thing Coyotes start pretty easily...
That #4 positive cable is a lot of wire being exposed to a lot of heat. Resistance increases with length and heat. Good thing Coyotes start pretty easily...
Jeff
I’ve been thinking about that. I’m considering a heat shield in front of the footbox.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 10-30-2024 at 10:31 AM.
Here's looking down at the front corner of the footbox:
If it were mine I wouldn't shield it...I'd move it. But it's not mine.
Jeff
Well **** pickles.
I think it's safe to say I made my first mistake. I honestly didn't fully consider the heat issue until it was nearly done. By then I was dazzled by the cleverness of my design. I think I am going to scrap the switch all together. I can re rout the battery run up to the busbar and then tie the other 2 into it there as well. Looks like I should order 4 gauge wire in red.
I had to take another bite at the power wiring apple. It turns out a cutoff switch was a bridge too far for the space. No real harm done other than a blow to the ego. I very much appreciate Jeff and all the others on the board that look out for trip ups like this. I would much rather fix it now than try this when everything is in the engine bay. So with that I dusted myself off and made things a bit simpler. Now everything is tied together at the bus bar. The only thing I am going to wait on is the starter wire. I will trim the end an put a lug on it once the engine is in place I will have plenty of access.
I completed the parking brake by adding a 12v NO proximity sensor and made a flag with a piece of steel. You can see it operate here. The brake switch itself will be wired by battery power so it will always work. The sensor will be powered by the ACC power so it will only light the dash when the car is on.
I also completed my harness wiring. In addition to the RF harness I added another leg with wire for the backup lights, Backup Camera, Parking brake, Parking brake sensor. I also ran wiring in the front harness to incorporate the dash cam. I don't have a good spot to put it in the actual cockpit so I will be hidden in the brake duct.
Lastly I have taken a run at the dash layout. This is a competition style with 5 inch Tach/Speedo along with the standard 5 gauges plus a clock. The indicator cluster will be left, right, high beam, Parking brake and check engine light. I am still identifying locations for all the switches. I am not yet married to what gauge goes where just yet but this is close.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 11-01-2024 at 11:32 AM.
Put the steering wheel on and drop a seat in then sit down to see what the visibility is like.
Jeff
For sure. My hub is out with Frank getting reworked for a turn signal. I put the steering wheel approximately where it will go and sat on some stuff. This is all to say I’m not going to cut anything until I get my hub back and my seats delivered. Which by the way are done and currently in route.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 11-02-2024 at 11:07 AM.
I took a break from wiring and tackled some of the beefier stuff. Namely the 2 inch roll bars. I had some drama earlier in the build as all the bars that FFR sent were powder coated but would show up pretty damaged. It also turns out the 2 inch bars don't fit together as gracefully as the 1.5 inch bars do. Ultimately I asked FFR for an un coated set. This in my opinion is the only way to go. you have to really grind and bang on these so I can't see how I would have kept them looking new while I was doing all that.
In order to make them fit I purchased a steel tube 1.75 OD x 1.25 ID. This has a wall thickness of .250. It is really meaty. I cut them into four 3 inch pieces and two 4 inch pieces to make sleeves for the bigger bars. This is where the real work started. The sleeves fit over the roll bar studs without any issue at all. The 2" tubes are tight. Really tight even with itself. The back tube does not fit over the front roll bar at all. I purchased a Burr and worked all the sleeves and the inside of all the roll bar tubes. I also cleaned up the stud that comes out of the roll bar so the back tube can fit over.
The roll bars themselves were a little tight so I used a couple of ratchet straps and I have a couple of telephone poles outside that are only a couple feet apart. I strapped one leg to one and put the other strap around the other to pry the bars apart a little. I got just enough so they both fit over the sleeves now.
The alignment between the back tube and the roll bar isn't perfect. I can get them together but it requires a rubber mallet and I have to lever the botttom of the back tube up a bit. I am ok with all of this but I do end up with a little bit of a gap in the back. The front side of this connection is perfectly flush. Question for the experts is should I grind the front away to make it flush all the way around or is their a better way?
All in all they look great. I really appreciate the thicker look compared to the stock bars. I want to do all the drilling and bolt installation now once I get the final alignment.
Thanks for posting your experience with the 2" bars. They're on my list. Now that you've gone through the trouble, would you do it again, or just stick with the 1.5" bars? They look great.
Thanks for posting your experience with the 2" bars. They're on my list. Now that you've gone through the trouble, would you do it again, or just stick with the 1.5" bars? They look great.
I can imagine I would ever go back to 1.5 inch bars. I just don’t like them. If these were not available I would’ve either gone to the 1.75 setup from breeze or the full cage from Whitby
Jesse,
That came together well. What I've found helps with that gap is to bolt the down tube and hoop together tight before tightening the 3 roll bar to chassis bolts.
OB6 and I had a conversation about the bars a few months ago when his looked like this:
After putting together over 100 sets of roll bars I have seen the gap before but until that conversation I had not ever laid a straight edge across the down tube to stub interface. I had 4 cars in the shop at that time so out of curiosity I checked and found that out of 8 roll bars 3 were like the photo, 2 were dead straight and one was skewed the opposite direction. I guess this is just part of the FFRs quirky charm, kind of like the hood that isn't centered on the body and isn't straight, the headlights that are cross eyed, the radiator opening that's crooked, the license plate lamp and trunk handle that aren't on the same center, and so on! Want to know something else about the roll bars? If you have both driver and passenger side bars and lay a straight edge across the lower front surface of the "U" shaped hoops you'll find that the 4 tubes are not on the same line! Some times it's better if you don't dig too deep
After putting together over 100 sets of roll bars I have seen the gap before but until that conversation I had not ever laid a straight edge across the down tube to stub interface. I had 4 cars in the shop at that time so out of curiosity I checked and found that out of 8 roll bars 3 were like the photo, 2 were dead straight and one was skewed the opposite direction. I guess this is just part of the FFRs quirky charm, kind of like the hood that isn't centered on the body and isn't straight, the headlights that are cross eyed, the radiator opening that's crooked, the license plate lamp and trunk handle that aren't on the same center, and so on! Want to know something else about the roll bars? If you have both driver and passenger side bars and lay a straight edge across the lower front surface of the "U" shaped hoops you'll find that the 4 tubes are not on the same line! Some times it's better if you don't dig too deep
Jeff
Thanks Jeff,
I figured as much. I used some strategically placed ratchet straps to really pull them together. I got them as close as I can. For all intents and purposes I think we are probably good.
I will say this, drilling the bolt holes for your roll bars can be dicey. On my first one my 1/8 pilot hole bit broke off inside. I then spent the next hour working the back tube off so I could get the piece out and start again. My only advice to anyone no matter what size bar you use is drill them before you put the body on. As a matter of fact do it before the rest of the aluminum goes on.
My plan when I take these back off is to mark all the studs with numbers 1-6, then mark all the sleeves with corresponding numbers. I will also drill out the holes on the sleeves and make them oversized, maybe as much as a half inch. I think this will allow them to go back together easier if they don't have to be perfectly aligned.
I set the back cockpit aluminum in place to get a sense of what they will look like. I definitely prefer the look and happy I made the switch.
Last edited by Blitzboy54; 11-11-2024 at 12:04 AM.
Give the reducer sleeves a couple of tack welds at the bottom to secure them into the bars then you won't have to fuss around with alignment when assembling them. Best of all neither will the guy who has to put it all back together after paint
Give the reducer sleeves a couple of tack welds at the bottom to secure them into the bars then you won't have to fuss around with alignment when assembling them. Best of all neither will the guy who has to put it all back together after paint
Jeff
Ha, that is a fantastic point Jeff. I will do that
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Originally Posted by John Ibele
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