JeromeS13's 818S

[MrDude_1]

heh, I have the same helmet as your passenger... HJC carbon. Really, I have 3 of them. 1 smashed the back in when I got rear ended on the interstate, one saved my face when I faceplanted after being hit by a drunk, and the 3rd one I bought as a replacement for the other two. good helmet. as far as your intercooler goes, I have to re-read your thread, to remember witch 818 this is (I try to read all the build threads, so I get them confused) but dont forget the other side of the air cooler. If you put an exit duct into a low pressure area, it will draw more air through it... although to be honest, I think this car really needs an air to water intercooler... rear engined cars can be finicky about airflow around the motor...

[JeromeS13]

Jerome,

Here's some information I came across in respect of the spring rates for the 818R

"If you are running the full downforce package, the 500lb springs mount in the rear with the 300lb springs in the front, if you are running without aero (specifically without a rear wing) then put the 300lb springs in the rear and the 500lb springs in the front."

also

"Sway bar:
Due to the heavier spring rates provided with the R chassis we do not generally run the front sway bar. If you are building the car as a street car and switch to the softer spring and shock package of the S model then the sway bar is still recommended."

Hope this helps

Not sure where this came from, but I did play around with the spring rates. During my first session in May, I had the front and rear tires rubbing under braking and over bumps. So, I installed some 400 lb springs in the front and moved the 350 lb springs in the rear. I also left the OEM swaybar installed. As of now, I have no aero add-ons. The car did feel better, and I had very little rubbing.

How hot was ambient temps? I guess on-track temps could be higher... I saw a max of 210 on the video for the IAT. What kind of differential were you hoping for? How about some ducting from those side vents? I know you and I have talked, but I am surprised that nobody is using them for a real purpose other than general engine compartment cooling.

I think during this video, the ambient was in the low 70's. I would love to keep the IAT's within 40 degress of ambient... I tried pulling air down from the vent and I even reversed the fans at one point to push air OUT of the vent. Basically the same results in both directions. (Although, pushing OUT of the vent was drawing hot engine/exhaust air through the IC...

[Wayne Presley]

You could use my AWIC ya know

[metalmaker12]

On your awic put a bleeder, I bet you had air in there.

[BrandonDrums]

Wait, does your car have the STi AMR TMIC mounted aft of the stock location as you say in the video details or are you using the AWIC you list in your parts list on the first post? I only see a shot of an AWIC in this thread...did you build 2 818's or are you playing with different setups?

[metalmaker12]

He's playing with different setups

[JeromeS13]

Wait, does your car have the STi AMR TMIC mounted aft of the stock location as you say in the video details or are you using the AWIC you list in your parts list on the first post? I only see a shot of an AWIC in this thread...did you build 2 818's or are you playing with different setups?

He's playing with different setups

^ What metalmaker said.

[BrandonDrums]

Cool, any data on which setup works best so far?

[Brando]

Hi Jerome. What prompted you to try A2A after having a A2W setup already in place?

[JeromeS13]

Cool, any data on which setup works best so far?

So far, the air-to-water is better.

Hi Jerome. What prompted you to try A2A after having a A2W setup already in place?

The water in the system was getting heat soaked during a session. I believe this is due to heat transfer from the radiator (I had the AWIC reservoir mounted up front). I wanted to try an A2A to see if I could eliminate the need to add ice water in between sessions. I want to see someone else's actual data from running an AWIC at the track before I decide which one to test further with. Hurry up, Brandon! haha

[Bob_n_Cincy]

The water in the system was getting heat soaked during a session. I believe this is due to heat transfer from the radiator (I had the AWIC reservoir mounted up front). I wanted to try an A2A to see if I could eliminate the need to add ice water in between sessions. I want to see someone else's actual data from running an AWIC at the track before I decide which one to test further with. Hurry up, Brandon! haha

Jerome,
Are you saying that you had a Ice water reservoir and NO heat exchanger?
Bob

[Hindsight]

If you had a heat exchanger, what were the dimensions of it?

[JeromeS13]

Jerome,
Are you saying that you had a Ice water reservoir and NO heat exchanger?
Bob

I had both, but essential just used the reservoir for increased capacity. I had to put ice water in the reservoir between sessions to get the system's water temperature back to ambient. Again, I believe my main problem was heat transferring from the (engine) coolant system's radiator.

[JeromeS13]

If you had a heat exchanger, what were the dimensions of it?

It was relatively small: 26"x7"x2"

http://www.frozenboost.com/water-to-...or-p-1063.html

[Hindsight]

The 24x12x1 is the one I'd go for.... I think the thinner core is going to be better for getting airflow through it and also from preventing air from flowing around it and through the radiator instead of through it and then on to the radiator. Are you sure you didn't have any air in the system? I think someone else may have mentioned adding a bleeder to it.... would be a good idea. In any case, I'll continue watching your results!

[JeromeS13]

The 24x12x1 is the one I'd go for.... I think the thinner core is going to be better for getting airflow through it and also from preventing air from flowing around it and through the radiator instead of through it and then on to the radiator. Are you sure you didn't have any air in the system? I think someone else may have mentioned adding a bleeder to it.... would be a good idea. In any case, I'll continue watching your results!

I did try bleeding it (I had a filler installed just before the core) un-mounting the core and pulling that filler to the highest point. I then ran the pump and filled until I couldn't fill anymore. It made no difference in the temperature delta. I typically saw a delta (between the system's water temperature and IAT) of 50-60 degrees. If I do go back to A2W, I will be going with a larger core and probably that taller/thinner heat exchanger. I'll also be making some sort of ducting to channel the air out of the backside of the radiator.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Hey Jerome,
I was looking at your pictures.
I see you awic pump mounted above your reservoir tank.
It is much better to mount your pump low.
With it up high, if air makes it to the pump all flow stops.
Bob

[JeromeS13]

Hey Jerome,
I was looking at your pictures.
I see you awic pump mounted above your reservoir tank.
It is much better to mount your pump low.
With it up high, if air makes it to the pump all flow stops.
Bob

That picture was taken before I tested the system. I ended up mounting the Bosch pump much lower. I even upgraded to a higher flowing Meziere pump (20 GPM vs. the Bosch's 5 GPM). It didn't make a measurable difference.

[07FIREBLADE]

Do you think if you made a shroud for your setup and added a fan to the system would it increase the delta temperature. Your results are starting to make me a bit nervous. I haven't been logging any data since my car isn't road worthy yet but if there are problems I can correct prior to finishing that would be great. Maybe a fan switch and a power switch for your water pump so you could push/pump while not under load like how a turbo timer would work might help. Just trying to think out load.

[metalmaker12]

That picture was taken before I tested the system. I ended up mounting the Bosch pump much lower. I even upgraded to a higher flowing Meziere pump (20 GPM vs. the Bosch's 5 GPM). It didn't make a measurable difference.

You need to have a bleeder from my research and suggestions I have gathered to make sure you get all the air out. Also you need a HE twice the height like Wayne's to bring the coolant temps way down. Also the lines have to be away from the radiator and it's lines to not result it potential heat soaking. I think if you do all this you won't have any more debates on which setup to use. With the full windshield and the a2a IC in its current location you simply can't get the air volume needed to cool the a2a core down. A setup in the R windscreen with a large duct between the humps to a large front mount mounted up against the rear cover with cut outs to flow air through that core would work well. A stock location or slightly moved top mount is proving to not be efficient in the platform from all of our collected data. Remember 140 is max we wanna ever see when moving under boost, lower is much better.

Ps I believe Wayne is about to track test with the 818 and his awic kit to get us track results.

[Mechie3]

From my research, given two exchangers of equal volume, the one with the thinner core and larger frontal area has better heat exchanging capability. You get a greater volume of air to hit it, more surface area for convection heat transfer, and the air cooling the back half of the exchanger isn't as heated as with a thicker core. It all makes sense, but I heat transfer wasn't my favorite subject in school and I haven't used it since graduating.

The Meziere pump that it was rated for 20gpm with no obstruction. Once you put restrictions on it, the output drops significantly. I found this while doing my initial research for my AWIC setup:

http://saleenforums.soec.org/showthread.php?t=15296

Within the Saleen forums unofficial testing post I found a link to this more data driven post:

http://www.yellowbullet.com/forum/sh...d.php?t=564702

I believe the meziere pumps are the 20GPM and 55GPM pumps. At low pressure drops they flow very well. With restriction they drop significantly and at a certain point under perform against other pumps.

[BrandonDrums]

Given the size of the space, why not experiment with an OEM Subaru radiator for the heat exchanger for the AWIC setup? They are cheap and some of you guys might have them left over from the donor after upgrading to a dual core racing rad. Can't get much thinner than that and the frontal area is literally the max size for the space.

[longislandwrx]

Jerome,

How is your fit in the ergo medium? I am on the fence between a small and a medium, I just want to make sure I wont be swimming in it.

im 5'8 about 170.

[JeromeS13]

Jerome,

How is your fit in the ergo medium? I am on the fence between a small and a medium, I just want to make sure I wont be swimming in it.

im 5'8 about 170.

It fits me pretty snuggly. We're about the same, but I have about 15 lbs on you.

[JeromeS13]

Given the size of the space, why not experiment with an OEM Subaru radiator for the heat exchanger for the AWIC setup? They are cheap and some of you guys might have them left over from the donor after upgrading to a dual core racing rad. Can't get much thinner than that and the frontal area is literally the max size for the space.

Since the heat exchanger mounts in front of the radiator position, you're actually working on a smaller area. The Subaru radiator probably would not fit without a lot of modification.

[longislandwrx]

It fits me pretty snuggly. We're about the same, but I have about 15 lbs on you.

is it snuggest in the hips?

[JeromeS13]

Yes.

[bompus]

Do you have photos of your wiper install with the remote reservoir kit?

[JeromeS13]

Do you have photos of your wiper install with the remote reservoir kit?

I don't have a wiper.

[bompus]

Oh, I thought you squeezed one under the hood. How did you get it registered?

[JeromeS13]

Oh, I thought you squeezed one under the hood. How did you get it registered?

Negative. I had a hand-held squeegee and a hand-held air horn, just in case they asked about it. The guy I had never even asked. They just looked at the paperwork, jotted down the engine block's serial number and asked me where I wanted him to put the VIN plate.

[Ellimist]

I had a hand-held squeegee and a hand-held air horn, just in case they asked about it.

LOL, that's awesome. I'll keep that in mind for my registration. BTW, just spent the last ?? (lots) of hours reading through your whole thread. Awesome - keep up the good work! Not sure how I've missed this thread for so long. Anyhow, speaking of registration, how'd you get it insured in order to be registered? Any recommendations? I have yet to receive my 818, but I just got done getting another kit car (albeit not quite in the same class as the 818 ) insured and registered - so far Progressive is the only one I've found.
-Ben

P.S. Here's a pic of the kit car that's been keeping me entertained prior to parting out my donor:
IMG_20141023_164959.jpg

[JeromeS13]

I have a policy through Leland-West (underwritten by American Modern). It is a collector car policy. As such, it has an annual mileage restriction of 3,000 miles. Also, this makes the car exempt from emissions as long as I carry this type of policy. There is, however, a whole thread dedicated to insurance and these cars.

[Ellimist]

There is, however, a whole thread dedicated to insurance and these cars.

I recall searching for that and didn't find much. But, granted, it was months ago....will commence re-searching!

[JeromeS13]

Well... I had a catastrophic transmission failure while strapped to the dyno today. We had planned on touching up the e85 tune and working on a 91 ACN (Arizona/California/Nevada) gas tune. However, on the 3rd e85 pull, the transmission exploded at around 4k RPM. At the time it happened, I just assumed that 3rd gear had sheared off... But after I looked in the car, there's apparently a hole in the front of the transmission casing. Also, I have no movement in any gear, forward or reverse. I drained the remaining fluid from the transmission and pulled several chunks from the drain hole. I can only speculate, but I'm assuming that something on the front differential ring/pinion failed.

FYI, this was a 2012 WRX transmission (stronger gears) with less than 40K miles on it.

Oh well... I have to weigh my options now... Replace it with another 5 speed and reduce the power (so I can get the car sold) or look for a 6 speed....

[Scargo]

Oh, that's a bummer. Is that odd or are there stresses on a dyno that you don't see in street use?

[JeromeS13]

Well, the way it's strapped to the dyno practically eliminates wheel slippage. So, that probably added to the stress.

[C.Plavan]

Sorry about the trans. Grab a legacy GT 5 speed. I found my pair for $750ish each with 60k and 75k miles. Stronger gears- so far so good (knock on wood)

[JeromeS13]

Sorry about the trans. Grab a legacy GT 5 speed. I found my pair for $750ish each with 60k and 75k miles. Stronger gears- so far so good (knock on wood)

Chad, this one was from a 2012 WRX, which is the same gear set as the Legacy GT. :-/

[Hindsight]

Good seeing you back on Jerome, but sorry about the circumstance. Are you going to build something else after you sell the 818?