Joel's Sudbury Mk4 Build

[jklapp]

Hello from Sudbury, Mass. I'm about to start my first Mk4 build and thought I'd start a thead like others before me. Other than some routine car maintenance and repair, this will be my first attempt at building a car. I'm a scientist by profession and woodworker/DIYer by hobby. Like every other skill I've picked up during my half-century, I'll think the best way to way to learn is by doing (and making mistakes along the way). I've been lurking on this site for some time, and now I'm ready to start building. Thanks for all the shared experiences and guidance so far.

My build plan so far:
FFR components:
>FFR Mk4 complete kit (Dec 2023 pickup at the factory - bought a used 18 ft enclosed trailer for this).
>Powder coated frame
>IRS suspension
>Manual steering (thinking about the DCE Microsteer if anyone has tried that - pls LMK).
>Manual clutch
>17 in replica Halibrands
>Wilwood's all around
>Leather seats
>Dash with glovebox
>GPS Gauges
>2 rollbars

Engine/Transmission
>Forte sourced 427W World Products Block, Edelbrock Headers & ProFlow EFI, TKX

Other options
>Breeze battery box, radiator mounts, fan shroud, lower rad pipe
>Wilwood Electronic Parking brake
>Leather hide for door cards, dash, console.
>FFMetal firewall and tunnel cover
>Heated Seats
>Moroso 2 qt coolant tank
>Russ Thompson-spec turn signal, gas pedal and drop truck from TJ @Mountain Metalworks

Body work will be sourced. I hate doing drywall, and the bodywork seems to be along the same lines, so I'll source the dusty sandy mess. I have an HVLP turbine that I used for wood finishing, but I don't use it enough to trust myself painting a car - seems like I end up sanding sags and drips off every project on the first coat before I remember the technique.

I have my crusher car and will send it off to the junk yard when I get closer to completion of the Mk4.

-Joel

[Nigel Allen]

Great project and nice specifications. I switched mine from manual to power steering (EPAS) after a couple of years. I appreciate the car and how much better it drives with power steering, every time I get in it.

Cheers,

Nige

[DW66]

Welcome from Plymouth Mass. I know a lot of the local FFR people if you need anything or have questions just ask.

Dave. 781-953-0358.

[460.465USMC]

Welcome aboard, Joel, from the other side of the country! I've always envied those who lived close enough to pick up their kits in-person. That will be fun day! Should be an exciting Christmas at your house!

[jklapp]

Thanks Dave. Great to have some builders close by!

Welcome from Plymouth Mass. I know a lot of the local FFR people if you need anything or have questions just ask.

Dave. 781-953-0358.

[jklapp]

Great to hear from you. With Mike Forte 4 miles away, and Mark Breeze 8 or so, and FFR <1 hr drive, I figured I had to give it a go. I hope to move back your way when the kids are out of school - I'm originally from Seattle area and my father's family is in Lewiston, ID.

Welcome aboard, Joel, from the other side of the country! I've always envied those who lived close enough to pick up their kits in-person. That will be fun day! Should be an exciting Christmas at your house!

[jklapp]

Getting Ready: Making Room, Body Buck, Frame Dolly
It took several weekends, but I was able to rearrange my wood shop into half woodshop / half auto shop. I have essentially a full garage bay for the build and some table space for parts, sub-assemblies, etc. I used the plans on the forum for both the dolly and the body buck. Once I get the car in the shop, I plan on storing the body on the buck in my enclosed trailer outside.

Body Buck: I used the CAD profiles from Jazzman.
Frame Dolly: Plans from 'Chrisarella' on the other forum.

Next step: figure out how to get images appear vertically (tried saving as separate jpg, but...?).

body_buck_vert.jpgclean_shop.jpgframe_dolly_vert.jpg

[zarnold]

Congrats! Looking forward to the build!

[Rmoore45]

Congrats! With what you picked out, this is going to be an awesome build!

Have you looked at this electric power steering kit for FFR Mk3/4 cars? https://epowersteering.com/purchase/...-roadster-kit/

Just my 2¢, I would look into upgrading to a hydraulic clutch. While the clutch cable works okay, there definitely room for improvement. I recently drove a roadster that had a hydraulic clutch (mine is cable) and was very impressed with how light and smooth the clutch pedal was.



Regards,
Ranger

[jklapp]

Delivery Day at FFR

Christmas came a few days early today!!! My son and drove down to Wareham to pickup my Mk4 kit from the factory. Everything fit easily in my 8.5 x 18 trailer. Took several attempts to get the trailer backed through my fence gate (9 in to spare on both sides), but it's loaded into my shop. Not a lot of extra room to spare. I'll take a break today and unload the rest of the boxes and put the body on the buck and store it in the trailer. The FFR guys have loading down to a science. The body went in 10 min and the rest of the boxes in 15 min or so. The only really heavy item was the pumpkin. Can't wait to get started, but first to finish up the work week and be Santa's elf for a few days.

forklift_load.jpgtrailer_load_3.jpgtrailer_load_jk.jpgload_into_shop.jpgin_shop_cro.jpg

[gbranham]

Congrats! That's an awfully heavy engine to not have power steering. Not much more $$ in the grand scheme of things, and way easier to do now than later. Regardless, congrats, and enjoy your build!

[jklapp]

Inventory Complete
Got the Christmas decorations down yesterday and completed the inventory this morning.
Only two minor issues: 2 missings pieces from the sway bar kit, and an extra set of standard issue front brakes.
Still waiting on: side louvers, wiring harness, front Wilwoods, and something called a "16616 powdered lower handle"
Overall not too bad.

I spend a good deal of time reading about power steering and decided to swap my manual rack for the power rack. Having driven manual racks before I was not worried about the muscle needed, but the arguments on overall performance were compelling. I'll drive down to Wareham to swap racks and return the extra brakes. Now I need to call Mike and add a steering pump to my build.

Santa brought a Dewalt 20V riveter, so once I use it a bit, I'll post a review. (Reviews elsewhere online were few and mixed.) I have a Dewalt everything and didn't want to buy the Milwaukee one that folks here seem to like a lot. We'll see how it goes...

I have to say that the dash with the glovebox seems really flimsy and cheap...was thinking it would be sheet metal.

[gbranham]

Something you might do now to make searching for parts much, much easier. If you can scan in your 45-47 page inventory list to a PDF, then OCR it with something like Adobe Acrobat, you'll be able to search for things much easier. I got tired of flipping through inventory sheets to find which box a part would be in, then had the idea to OCR the sheets. It's so much quicker to search for, say, 'clip' or 'brake' when looking for some small part.

[jklapp]

I searched a bit to see if anyone had created a spreadsheet, but was unable to track one down...maybe I'll give it a try and post the results if successful.

Something you might do now to make searching for parts much, much easier. If you can scan in your 45-47 page inventory list to a PDF, then OCR it with something like Adobe Acrobat, you'll be able to search for things much easier. I got tired of flipping through inventory sheets to find which box a part would be in, then had the idea to OCR the sheets. It's so much quicker to search for, say, 'clip' or 'brake' when looking for some small part.

[F500guy]

Biggest issue I have is seeming to always need 1 item out of box xx for a fit up or interference check. I have a clear plastic tote that I thorough all the early parts i pull into, still early in my build, but I also believe at least 1 part was discarded inadvertently while wrapped in paper, watch out for the small parts!

[jklapp]

First Piece Attached!

Well, I spent way too long fussing with the alignment of the F-panel before drilling, but I'm now off and running on assembly. Putting the F-panels on was a good start to appreciating the lack of symmetry with the frame. I also had to nibble away a few spots with my dremel to get the panels to align due to protruding welds. I could not get the top of both the upper and lower parts of the "F" to align with both top and bottom frame pieces, so just settled with making sure the top aluminum did not protrude above the top bar. Top bar is curved, panel is straight. Front frame angle on top of F does not match the panel angle...etc. Found a post from "cv2065's build that was reassuming - he had the exact same alignment issues as I did. In cv2065's string, someone mentioned making sure to drill holes where you can get the rivet gun in there, which was a very good tip. Put my son to work on the firewire before calling it a day.

Also stopped by Forte's before the weekend to add a power steering pump to my build and got a look at my engine (last photo). Close to dyno testing!

driver_Fpanel.jpg firewall_fitting.jpg engine_at_Forte.jpg

[jklapp]

Inventory Spreadsheet
I scanned all of the inventory sheets to create a spreadsheet you can sort, search, and use for tracking missing items. It is in CSV format, so it should work in any spreadsheet software. I did my best to correct any errors from scanning, but I provide no guarantees on accuracy. The sheet is for my personal kit, so some items may be missing or not in your order. The sheets cover a complete kit with options I went with. I'd be happy to keep a current version if people want to edit it to add items so eventually we have a full list of all options. If you want to scan your own sheets, this was a PITA. I scanned them in as PDFs, used Adobe Illustrator to mask off everything but the text, combined all the pages in Acrobat, then exported as Excel. Then I had to fix all the issues from scanning and OCR interpretation. As soon as I figure out how to upload the file I'll edit this post with a link. PM me in the meantime.

[jklapp]

Aluminum Panels
Since the holidays, I've had little time work on the car. Finally got a few weekends and I've been working on getting all (most) of the aluminum panels fitted so I can send off for powder coating. I got the drop trunk kit from TJ @Mountain Metalworks and that install went OK - went very slow on cutting with a carbide-coated jig saw blade. The most challenging fit was the back cockpit panel. I had to cut off the two tabs that are supposed to be riveted to the floor pans - they were preventing alignment of the seam across the back of the cockpit. I made up some patches with leftover metal from the drop trunk cutout. I also had to trim the top right of the back panel on the drivers side to get things to fit. I will move on to the drivers footbox next. I'm curious if others also fit and drilled the splash guards before powder coating?

I've drilled holes now on the "wrong side" of my line a few times now...debating whether I just cover these with carpet, etc. or fill them with tig welds. I haven't tig welded in a long time, and would need to buy a tig welder (a good thing), but I'm a little wary of constantly burning through thin aluminum...

IMG_9698.jpgIMG_9722.jpgIMG_9704.jpgpatch.jpg

[gbranham]

I'd put a dab of silicone on the holes you whiffed on, and be done with it. After sound and heat mat, and then carpet, you'll never see it.

[jklapp]

Driver's Footbox and Rear Cubbie
Well the inside drivers footbox was a bear to fit. I suspect the main issue was some incorrect bends that form the interface between the upper and lower piece. And, the lower piece was not bent correctly to attach the trans tunnel. I ended up trimming and using my belt sander on the bottom piece to fit over the 4" main tube and then bent the flange on the inside to a sharper angle to meet the trans tunnel. The drivers footbox and rear cockpit wall seem to be common issues many others have faced. I moved onto the Breeze cubby, going with the 17.5" x 5" size recommended in the instructions. I picked up a HF 5" hole saw that was about half the price of the Milwaukee ones at HD, and used my jigsaw to do the rest of the cut. Looks great!
drivers_footbox.jpgcubbie_opening.jpgcubbie.jpg
I'm carefully going to the directions now to see what I'm forgetting to do with the aluminum panels before I go to powder coating. On my list includes the notch in the cubbie wall for the gas struts... Looks like the elephant ears will have to wait until they are fitting on the car, or I can drill holes down without fitting before sending to powder. As much as I want to do the powder coating in one job, I'm sure I'll forget something and need two trips.

After much procrastination, I cut off the ebrake mount since I'm going with the Wilwood electric parking brake, and mounted a patch.
ebrake_patch.jpg
Mike Forte was getting close to dyno on my engine and trans, so I'll have to stop by sometime soon to check on progress.

[F500guy]

Sounds like similar areas that I had issues. Good progress!

[DW66]

Joel,
I made my cubby wall removable for ease of bolting in the roll bar and seat belts and or fixing cubby lighting if need be in the future. I can easily pull the cubby wall out of the trunk by removing a few screws.

Dave

Cubby wall.jpgCubby wall 2.jpg

[jklapp]

Engine ready for pickup!
Got the call from Mike Forte last week and stopped by on Friday to pay off the balance and see my engine and transmission. I'll pick it up this week. All I can say is WOW! Now I really need to get moving on the build. It's a 427W World Products block, and Edelbrock headers and ProFlow FI. Transmission is TKX with mid-shift.

My main concern at this point is whether my HF 2-ton hoist will be tall enough to lift out of my truck bed...need to do some measuring!

IMG_9792.jpg

[Alec]

Hey, Joel! I wanted to say good luck with the build. I have a MkIV that graduated in the late Fall last year. I share a similar background and skillset as you (Academic neuroscientist, hobby woodworker, did 1 rolling resto a few years ago). I also did a Forte 427w/ PS and PF4 EFI. Very reliable so far in a range of weather. And totally turnkey. Didn't have to do much of anything to make it purr. THe build was so rewarding, and driving/owning the car is fantastic. Enjoy the process, even the annoying frustrating parts. It is worth it! PXL_20231023_204315648.jpg

[jcucinotta1]

A work of art!! Mike does great work!!

[FDLWproject]

You and I are on the same timing from Forte! Just got the call yesterday that mine is ready. We’ve got a very similar spec to the point at which I could only tell the difference by the hose colors. By the way, looks like your dyno video is up in case you hadn’t seen it yet (below). Good luck with the rest of your build.

https://youtu.be/3YJUSPkDNok?si=CNHltkreI8t2QhzR

[jklapp]

Off to Powder Coat
I finally got all the aluminum and other metal parts sanded down and deburred for power coat. What a job! The PC shop is about 3-4 weeks out so it will be mid-Apr before everything is back. I'm blacking out everything with a satin black PC

PC_pg1.jpgPC_pg2.jpgPC_pg5.jpgPC_pg7.jpgPC_pg6.jpgPC_pg4.jpgPC_pg3.jpg

[jklapp]

Patching Holes from Sheet Metal Screws
I just couldn't leave it alone. I think (hope!) I finally figured out an easy way to patch the aluminum holes created by the sheet metal screws from the factory when they tack on the panels for shipping. I tried to TIG welding, but I was out of my league with trying to TIG the 18 ga aluminum panels - lots of practice pieces and I burned through more holes than I patched (n=1). I then discovered aluminum brazing sticks that you just melt with a propane torch. The melt temp of the sticks is greater than the power coating oven, so I hope this works and doesn't make a mess during the PC process. I've attached a few pictures of the process. I'll follow-up if it works.

alum_hole.jpgalum_braze.jpgalum_braze_sanded.jpgbraze_sticks.jpg

[F500guy]

Great Idea, I have a few "Oh Crap" holes...

[jklapp]

Prepping the IRS rear differential and knuckles
Wow! I'm way behind posting. I decided to paint the rear differential and knuckles while I waited for the panels to come back from powder coat. I used Seymor primer and red MRO paint on the diff. My son and I got the diff installed with some effort, and chipped the paint a bit, but I was able to touch up with a small brush and paint sprayed into a cup.

I then used a black VHT epoxy spray paint from Autozone on the knuckles...big mistake. After I primed and sprayed three coats on the knuckles I could remove the paint with my fingernail after a week drying at temp. The instructions said direct to metal...but? So, I started over by stripping off the spray paint, prepping the surface and then using Por15 on the knuckles and then did the axles too. I had a few drips and sags with the Por15 - it's really thin and hard to brush (at least with my limited patience). I bought a six pack of Por15 half-pints, which worked well since the stuff doesn't keep long (and the lids basically glue shut after you open them).

For prep on all, I used a wire wheel on my die grinder, and then some 150 pads, also on the die grinder. Then, wiped down with acetone, and finally a microfiber cloth.

stripped diff.jpgprimed diff.jpgpainted diff.jpgdiff_installed.jpgaxle_paint.jpgknuckle_paint.jpg

[jklapp]

Rear IRS suspension & brakes
I had to use the bolt and nut spreader on the rear suspension mounts to attach the upper and lower control arms. I had a long bolt and some nuts and washers sitting around and these worked great. I found the tabs would bend back a bit after I removed the tension, so I had to spread things out a bit wider than I liked. But it worked. Finally have that feeling that I'm making progress on the build. While I learned a lot with the aluminum panels, they're off now and the frame looked like I hadn't done a thing! spreader.jpgassembled_knuckle.jpgrear_end_side.jpgknuckle_installed.jpgrear_end_assembled.jpg

[jklapp]

Finishing up the rear brakes
I had to order some safety wire and I also bought a pair of safety wire pliers. Took about 10-12 attempts, but finally ended up with a result I was happy with. Pliers work really well once you get the hang of them. Sore and bloody fingers at the end. I also ended up with a 1/4" ft/in torque wrench and some 12-point sockets with this project. I got the rotors back on the hubs and put the Wilwood electronic parking brakes on temporarily. I swapped the E-brakes Left-to-right as others have shown, and it appears you need to plug them into the wiring harness before mounting...not a lot of room with the coil over.

first rotor.jpgrear_rotor_wired.jpgassembled_brake.jpgbrake_rear_closeup.jpg

[jklapp]

Fuel Filter
Well, powder coating is taking a very long time (more on this in a later post), so I've been poking along trying to find things to do that don't involve first attaching a panel. I bought the Trick Flow canister filter. It's likely much too big - you could probably run a dragster off this thing. But, I liked that you don't have to remove the fittings to change the filter. The filter comes with an aluminum L-bracket that is anodized black. I had to trim it a bit and redrill holes to mount it below the surface of the trunk on the 3/4 tube. I used some black spray paint to cover the cut end.

fuel_filter_abo ve.jpgfuel_filter_below.jpg

[jklapp]

Steering rack and Shaft
I used the Breeze steering rack solid aluminum offset bushings to install the rack. After I installed them with the holes pointed up, the rack was perfectly aligned....so it seems the bushings really just adjusted the height of the rack. Not sure if others had a similar experience here? The back tab (towards the firewall) on the passenger side that holds the rack was not aligned well at all. I had to bend the front part of the tab back to point the bolt downward to make the hole, and even then used my impact wrench to drive it through. The threads were OK - I was a bit worried I would damage them. I then installed the steering column. The main shaft in the engine bay was a bit long. The shaft extends into the swivels a bit, but the manual says they need to be flush. I spun the shaft a few times and there is no interference, so I think I'm OK here? I could cut the shaft down, but doesn't seem necessary. What am I missing?

steering_shaft.jpgsteering_upper.jpgfront_end.jpgfront_side.jpg

[jklapp]

Panels finally back from powder coating
I had all of my panels and hardware coated satin black. I dropped them off at Central Mass Powdercoat in Clinton, MA in early March and there were finally done in mid-May (about a month longer than the original estimate). I'm happy with the results. This shop does a lot of production work, likely with repeat customers, so I suspect that was the source of the delay...my project is a one-off and not the highest priority. The shop owner told me he's done at least a dozen FFR's over the past decade so he was familiar with the materials. The only piece they would not do was the locks and the mirror. There was concern that there might be plastic parts in the locks that would melt in the PC oven. I'll take these apart myself and PC in my shop (bought an Eastwood gun), or just spray paint them. In the photos you see below I managed to get the passenger footbox installed.

first_panel.jpgfront_end.jpgpanels_front.jpg

[jklapp]

Front suspension
You'll see from my earlier post that I did get the front suspension and brakes in. I found that the upper ball joint needed a washer to put the hole for the cotter pin in the center of the castle nut. I found a fat grade washer at the local hardware store that did the trick. Not sure if others had the same issue after torquing to spec.

UCA_front.jpg