Massachusetts 818C build

[sgarrett]

Hi MonzaMan,

Yes I do still have it and I would be happy to send it to you. Just PM me with your address.

[sgarrett]

I am making steady progress on the wiring harness and hope to emerge soon....

But I have completely confused myself now and hope someone can help me with the wiring to the starter motor. I continue to struggle with connecting all the engine bits back together since I didn't originally take the engine out.

I have run the big red cable FFR supplies with the kit from the positive battery terminal back to the terminal on the starter motor. I have also run the yellow wire with the black connector on it back to the terminal on the starter. I have also run a big cable back to the starter from the negative terminal on the battery to ground the starter.

1. Where do you guys attach the ground that comes back from the battery? Can I use one of the mounting holes for the starter? I will use the other one to attach the braided cable.

2. On page 268 of the FFR assembly manual it shows two red wires that they call the fuse box/starter wire. It isn't clear where they connect but it looks like they are on the same terminal as the battery cable. But I have no idea what those are. They don't seem to be a part of the original wiring and I can't find them in the Subaru wiring guide either. Where does each end of those paired wires attach?

Any help appreciated.

[sgarrett]

Typical....after thinking about this for way too long, giving up, and posting my questions, I think I figured it out.

1. Looking at pictures of other people's cars, including the one in the FFR showroom, it looks like the two red wires in the manual that confused me actually go to the alternator. They are attached on the same terminal on the starter as the battery cable. In the factory Subaru they are the white/red-stripe wires that come out of the fuse box and go to the alternator. Is that right?

2. I don't actually need to run ground back to the starter. As long as the engine is grounded to the frame and the battery is grounded to the frame then the starter is grounded. Is that right?

3. I have already attached the battery to the fuse box and extended the white/red-stripe wires back to the alternator. I don't think I need to run the ones from the starter to the alternator now. I also don't think it is a bad thing to ground the battery back by the engine. That is what is recommended in some various things I read (ground the battery close to the starter) and I have already made and ran the wire back there. I also grounded the battery to frame at the front of the car. And I grounded the engine to the frame with the braided cable. Is this ok to do?

[MonzaMan]

Just want to say thanks again for sending the “u-hose”. The support of forum members is fantastic. I guess I’m jaded by the typical bitter Internet forums, but the FFR community definitely makes a new builder enjoy the project so much more!

As a random tidbit: this hose is needed for a JDM EJ207 V9.

[sgarrett]

You are welcome MonzaMan. Glad to help! Hopefully you'll be able to get working on it again soon.

[sgarrett]

So I thought I had made huge progress and was excited to post here that I had conquered the wiring harness.

I got it all to fit and am reasonably happy with the layout.

Harness fit into car.jpg

I used the space under the driver seat for some of the modules and even ran some of the wiring for the entertainment system.

And the tunnel/firewall fit with no problem!

firewall and tunnel fit.jpg

And then I got a bit excited and thought I would see if everything lit up the way it is supposed to. Darn it....not even close. Got some (a lot!) debugging to do. The horn works though!

Back to it.....

[sgarrett]

Lots of progress....and two lessons learned that I guess should've been obvious.

1. The turn signals don't work unless you have the emergency flashers button plugged in...and you also need bulbs to make them flash at the correct rate (I knew that one already actually).
2. The door switches are 'open' when the door is closed. I mistakenly thought they were 'closed' when the doors are closed. Same with the seat belt switch. I shorted them to ground when I removed the switches....thus it kept telling me that my doors were open. That was about 6 hours of frustrating wire-chasing until I thought about it the right way! Darn it.

I also discovered that the window switch diagram in the FFR manual is labeled wrong. The pins for +12V and +12V(illumination) are reversed. That one only took me about an hour to figure out.

Need to get everything buttoned back up again, wire in the entertainment system and then I can declare initial completion of the wiring harness. Of course, I have no idea if the engine will actually run yet, but at least I know if the doors are open or closed!

[STiPWRD]

The turn signals don't work unless you have the emergency flashers button plugged in...and you also need bulbs to make them flash at the correct rate (I knew that one already actually).

You mean how LED bulbs flash faster than halogen bulbs? FFR provides you with an LED compatible flasher relay that fixes that issue; this should be in the kit.

[sgarrett]

YAY!!!! After 6 months I have declared victory on the harness. It is now fully installed in the car. Of course, I still need to wrap them (not until I am certain the car starts!) and the parts that go out to the head and tail lights aren't properly in place, nor are the window harnesses. But only because I don't have fenders or doors yet. I confirmed everything I can think of works....windows, lights, flashers, etc. I also confirmed that the starter motor is getting a signal when I turn the key to ignition. I also took the opportunity to wire in an entertainment system and a rear view camera. I also confirmed the remote door unlock still works.

Harness Installed 3.jpgHarness Installed 2.jpgHarness installed 1.jpg

I also discovered it is quite convenient to use some of the wire that I removed to lengthen the wires that were too short. So in the end, I had almost a full bucket of scrap wire.

Scrap Wire.jpg

The next thing I want to tackle is the transmission cables. Started on the center tunnel today. I am making it so that I can remove the firewalls and the center tunnel in the future. Getting much better now at those threaded inserts!

Staring Center Tunnel.jpg

Need to do the cooling and the emergency brake cables after that. Then finish lots of the little things I hadn't pushed across the finish line yet (like mounting my charcoal canister) then I hope to try first start by the end of the summer.

[AZPete]

Congrats on the harness! That's a BIG hurdle and I remember how nice it feels to have the wiring figured out, lengthened, shortened, and ready to be tested and wrapped. Congrats!

[aquillen]

Surgery on the nervous system is always a big deal. Congrats on all that work.

[davidstrother]

So cool that you're doing this with the kids like your dad did with you. I wanted to sell my Porsche 911 to fund a FFR Cobra build with my dad. Unfortunately he passed before that happened. I was diagnosed with cancer bout a year and a half ago. I'm not letting that happen again. 818 #569 is in my garage. I try to get my step son out there as much as I can to help/hang out with me. Best of luck with your build brother.

[sgarrett]

Grab the moment! Glad you are embracing the chance to do what you want.

I find that it is mainly me doing the car. The kids are so busy, and the wiring was definitely not an easy journey. But when there is a clear task that I am 100% sure I know how to do it then I grab them. It is amazing how well they remember those moments.

[sgarrett]

I finished creating the switch plate for the center console. I ultimately plan on wrapping the aluminum in 'pleather' and will wrap the switch plate in faux carbon fiber.

Center console switches.jpg

I am still using the power mirrors switch, two 12V sockets, seat heaters switches, and the power door lock switch (along with the window switches).

I got the shifter and cables installed today....

Shifter 1.jpgShifter 2.jpgShift Cables 1.jpgShift Cables 2.jpg

Two things that surprised me:
1. I needed to use a hammer to get the pivot over the ball on the end of the shifter. Should have done that on the table.
2. I discovered I need to shave off a lot of plastic on the shifter to make sure it stays within the 5 3/8" width of the center tunnel.

I noticed after the fact in the manual that FFR also did both of those things! So I think I'm on the right path.

So I put the seat in to adjust the cables to get the right feel, per the manual. But I am not so sure I know what to adjust. There is about a half an inch play in the cables and I don't seem to know how to get rid of it. I expect the shifter to stay roughly in position when I put it into a gear (like second). But mine just moves back into neutral even thought the transmission is still in second.

Is this typical with a cable shifter or should I be able to get it tighter?

[STiPWRD]

Is this typical with a cable shifter or should I be able to get it tighter?

This is actually fairly common and the reason why so many builders go with the VCP or MR2 shifter. I had the same exact result with the stock cables. The issue is the long cable length and the 180 degree turn - this contributes to a bunch of slop in the shifter. I went MR2.

[sgarrett]

Thanks...That's what I was afraid of.

[Ajzride]

I expect the shifter to stay roughly in position when I put it into a gear (like second). But mine just moves back into neutral even thought the transmission is still in second.

I experienced the exact same thing with the stock cables and the huge bends. I've ordered the Mr2 shifter but am probably a month away from install and testing.

[sgarrett]

Slow progress....but some progress is better than none!

Got the e brake done. Was more challenging than I thought. When I mounted it back towards the firewall, I discovered that I didn't quite have enough range of adjustment to get it as tight as I wanted when actuated. I moved it forward about 3/4" to fix that, but that exacerbated the cables hitting the aluminum cover. I fixed that but will need to make a little cover to put over it.

E-brake installed 1.jpgE Brake Installed 2.jpg

Started on the cooling tubes today. Got the driver's side installed.

Cooling tube 1.jpgCooling tube 2.jpgColling tube 3.jpg

Observation #1: wow, those corrugated tubes are hard to push into those rubber tubes! That was quite a workout. Anyone have a trick they've discovered?

Observation #2: The manual says I am supposed to cut the lower radiator cooling hose in half and use it to attach the corrugated tube to the engine. It fits on to the engine fine, but there is no way it is going to fit over the corrugated tube! The OD of the corrugated is about 1 3/4" but the ID of the rubber hose is about 1 1/2". In fact, the OD of the hose is less than 1 3/4"! There is no way it can fit over the corrugated. Did anyone else discover this? I am figuring I'll hit the parts store tomorrow and get a radiator hose with some 90 degree bends in it with closer to a 1 3/4" ID.

[STiPWRD]

That's the right idea, I've seen a few guys use generic radiator hoses. For getting tight hoses over tubes, try a little dish soap to help lubricate the surfaces. Also, rubber stretches easier when it's warm so try leaving the hoses in the sun for a few minutes.

If you have issues with the corrugated tubes (some have mentioned they leak), Mike Everson makes a nice tube kit. It's pricey but looks much cleaner and is more reliable.
http://www.replicaparts.com/818%20parts%20page.htm

[sgarrett]

Thanks for the tips.

I had seen Mike's tubes and was definitely tempted. Love the way they look. But not ready to throw out the extra dollars yet.

[sgarrett]

Got the passenger side tubes installed and found a hose that would more easily connect my engine to the corrugated tubing.
Cooling tube 4.jpgCooling tube 5.jpgCooling tube 6.jpg

And thanks for the tip on the soap. I actually was concerned that it would somehow 'contaminate' the lines so I hadn't wanted to use it at first. It helped a lot....but WD-40 helped even more!

[sgarrett]

Three quick questions for the forum:

1. Is this the ground strap for the gas cap?
Gas cap ground.jpg

2. Do I need to use any sort of grease on the gaskets for the exhaust system? I see mixed feelings on that online. Thought I'd see what you guys did. I am just using the stock Subaru Turbo exhaust pipes.

3. I don't have all of the nuts and bolts left from the exhaust system (the guy I bought the donor from had already removed the exhaust when I got it). Replacement nuts and bolts from Subaru are quite expensive! But I figure I do need to use nuts and bolts intended for this use. Do I bite the bullet and use Subaru nuts and bolts or can I just use a grade 8 nuts and bolts from the hardware store?

[Hobby Racer]

Three quick questions for the forum:

1. Is this the ground strap for the gas cap?
Gas cap ground.jpg

Yes, that's the gas cap grounding strap.

2. Do I need to use any sort of grease on the gaskets for the exhaust system? I see mixed feelings on that online. Thought I'd see what you guys did. I am just using the stock Subaru Turbo exhaust pipes.

No grease is needed for the gaskets, it will just burn off and doesn't help to seal.

3. I don't have all of the nuts and bolts left from the exhaust system (the guy I bought the donor from had already removed the exhaust when I got it). Replacement nuts and bolts from Subaru are quite expensive! But I figure I do need to use nuts and bolts intended for this use. Do I bite the bullet and use Subaru nuts and bolts or can I just use a grade 8 nuts and bolts from the hardware store?

You don't need to use Subaru nuts / bolts but quality hardware helps (i.e. not HomeDepot).

[sgarrett]

Thanks!

[sgarrett]

Managed to corral my son and get the radiator installed! I had been putting off adding the nose to the car since it will take up a bit more space in the garage, but it was time.

Radiator 2.jpgRadiator 1.jpgRadiator 3.jpgRadiator 4.jpg

My son noted that the builders of the Millenium Falcon also used a lot of corrugated tubing. He was also impressed (not) with my one-handed angle grinder technique for cutting said tubing. I reminded him to do as I say, not as I do.

Also got the overflow tank installed and my charcoal canister (finally!).

Overflow tank 1.jpgCharcoal Can.jpg

Feeling like I am making huge progress at last. Working on cleaning up the wiring on the front now that the nose is on. Then I need to bolt on the exhaust, tackle the list of misc little things that I skipped along the way (shorter list than I was thinking it would be), fluids, then try to start it up. Hopefully by the end of the month. Fingers crossed.

Status as of 090919.jpg

[Hobby Racer]

Ooooh, ahh ... love the Pantera

[sgarrett]

Yeah....the Pantera is special. Just got a rebuilt 351 Cleveland back into it. It was off the road for about a year. But unfortunately the intake manifold is now too tall to fit under the hood properly and the rear main seal appears to be leaking....great. The old cars aren't for the faint of heart.

But the cars we build are a completely different kind of special!

Got the front wiring cleaned up and going to the right points.

Front wiring.jpg

Will wrap it all later once things are definitely all working right.

Also attached the exhaust. It looks quite silly sticking out like this without the wheels and body on....

Exhaust.jpg

Getting closer to that first attempted start....

[sgarrett]

It is getting so close to first start!

Continue making progress knocking off the list of little things that needed to get done (like setting some torques, adjusting ride height, etc.). I really thought I could start it this week. I put all the wheels on since I thought it was time....first time I have actually done that during the build. Oops. Should've done it sooner. The front tires hit the cooling tubes when I turn from lock to lock! Argh!

tire hits hose.jpg

Those things were annoyingly frustrating to get in place and I didn't really feel like moving them around. I was trying so hard to keep them really close to the side rail and lower than 5 inches from the bottom of the frame. I thought that maybe I have more room to play with than I thought. So I placed one of the side panels onto the car to see just how much room I have.

side panel in place.jpg

OMG! It is actually starting to look like a car. I had to resist the urge to put ALL of the panels in place just to see what it would look like! As it turns out, I have more room for the tubes than I thought and re-positioning the tubes wasn't so bad. I just wish I had known ahead of time to keep the corrugated inside the edge of the frame. Makes sense now.

tire misses hose.jpg

Then I filled up the transaxle, the engine oil, and greased the front suspension. Also put gas in it. Nothing leaking yet.

I also wanted to see if the clutch I had put in a year ago actually did what it was supposed to do. I rolled the car out of the garage testing the engagement of the clutch. Yay....it seems to work. And so does the emergency brake. First time these parts have been out of the garage in two years!

in the driveway.jpg

Unfortunately, when I was pushing it, the rear wheels seem to keep dragging and making a scraping sound. I figured the calipers I rebuilt 2 years ago were bad. I must have done something wrong with them. As I was straining to push the thing back into the garage I noticed that the sound didn't seem to be coming from the brakes. Another OMG moment: the balance weights on the old Subaru wheels stick out too far and hit one of the rear suspension arms. The scraping sound is me pushing them all the way around the wheel as they lock up against the suspension arm!

wheel weight.jpg

That is an easy fix. Phew. Maybe the brakes are ok! Had the wheels re-balanced today with stick on weights.

When I went to put in the coolant I quickly realized there is a reason that Tony at FFR recommended I offset the expansion tank (and I see that many on this forum have done so also) so I finally moved it.

expansion tank.jpg

I even have the adapter in it getting ready to fill it up!.

I jacked up the back of the car and started pouring in the coolant. I got one of those bucket things that sits in the hole for the expansion tank. I would pour some into it, then let it go into the car. A little at a time. Checking hose fittings constantly. Wow. How much does it take to fill it up? I put in two gallons then had to go back to the store. Nothing leaking! Still looks good. At 3.5 gallons I had gotten cocky and wasn't really watching the rest of the car. That is when I noticed a very pretty stream of green coolant flowing under the car and towards my garage door. After reflecting for a moment how vibrant the green color is, I realized I had a problem. Turns out there is a crack in my radiator.

radiator crack.jpg

Now I know why the donor car had a big sticker on the windshield that said "DO NOT START ENGINE". I don't remember the reason given to me at the time, but I KNOW it wasn't that the radiator has a crack in it. Plus by the time I picked up the car the engine was already out of it and the coolant drained. I sincerely thought about fixing it myself with some JB-Weld. But then thought better of it.

My thanks to all of you on this forum. After just a few minutes of reading posts on here about radiators, I picked out a drop-in Koyo replacement and it will be at my house in a couple of days. All aluminum and still cheaper than an OEM Subaru replacement. I even finally understand why the Wayne Presley coolant fix (the nipple added to the water outlet on the engine) is important. Going to get that in tomorrow. Sure would've been easier to to do it before the engine was in the car. Live and learn I guess.

Still hope to start it up soon! And at this point, first start and go kart could be the same day.

[STiPWRD]

Congrats on all the progress! It's a good time to test fit and pre-drill the front splash guard aluminum since it will also need to clear the coolant tubing. It's much more of a pain to do it later when more stuff is in the way.

[sgarrett]

As always, thanks for your suggestions STI. Always helpful. I saw your post about the radiators and was going to get the CX Racing one you recommended. But I saw too many reviews that said it started to fail after 3-5 years. That pointed me in the direction of Koyo (since they were all lamenting that they didn't get one) so that is what I went with to begin with. Got a good deal on it! It should show up on Monday. Darn it! I really wanted to run the car by the end of this week.

As for your recommendation....I had seen that I needed to put that splash guard into place in a few other builds. There are two of them that I am looking at. Here is the first:

80171 - FRONT WHEEL WELL INSIDE, REAR, LEFT.jpg

I can see where this one attaches, but I need to move my darn clutch lines:

Clutch lines in the way.jpg

I think I am just going to leave them where they are since they are working (and bleeding them was a challenge). I'll just put a couple of small notches in the aluminum panel to go around them. I also need to increase the width of the opening for the control arm. It is just a hair too tight and I don't want it scraping off the powder coat.

But I think you are talking about this one:

80175 - FRT WHEEL WELL INSIDE, FRT, LEFT.jpg

I don't see anywhere in the manual where it actually tells me to put it in. I only see it on page 593 where there is a call out for it. I think I put it on the backside of the same piece of the frame where I attach the first splash guard I pictured above. But to do that I need to notch the top of it to go around the brake line. Is that what you had to do? And I can see how both of these will become more difficult the further I go!

Thanks....

[STiPWRD]

Correct across the board! I also notched the aluminum in a few spots to clear lines and had to extend it on some of the more forward splash guards where it didn't line up well (passenger side so I don't have pics). The small panels do go inside the frame but by the time I got to those it was very cramped and I could only get about 4 rivets to attach those.
20190218_123811.jpg20190218_123959.jpg20190218_124017.jpg

[sgarrett]

Thanks for the pictures! Very big help. And I am glad to see I wasn't the only one who thought it would be good to run the clutch lines near the outside edge of the firewall.

[sgarrett]

I finished installing the barbed fitting onto the water outlet. Everything seemed to go ok and it was able to tighten up nicely when I screwed it in.

Coolant fitting 1.jpgCoolant fitting 2.jpg

I actually had a hard time finding a barbed brass tee fitting, but Amazon had one that they sent me the next day. $4.00. Not bad!

Here is the tee fitting in action bringing the hoses from the barb and the radiator up to the degas tank.

Coolant tee fitting.jpg

I was quite worried about messing this up and having to pull the engine out to fix a mangled hole. I have done a lot of tapping in my life, but was extra diligent on this one.

I bought a new tap and new drill for the pilot hole, blocked up the tube down stream from the hole I was drilling (then almost couldn't get the rag back out!), ran my vacuum constantly and surrounded the hole with wide painters tape. I didn't want any stray metal chips!

But as I am sure you all know, that area is hard to access with the engine and rear firewall all in place. I needed a really long tap to reach down there. Or at least a really long handle....the only thing I had with a 'square drive' that was big enough for the tap was the drive end of my socket extension. The bit actually fit really good!

Tap tool 1.jpg

I added a little duct tape to make sure it stayed in tight and then wrapped more tape around it for good measure....but it wasn't long enough. So I had to add another extension (and more duct tape).

Tap tool 2.jpg

I turned the whole combination with a vice grip clamped on the top. Worked much better than I expected and now I can check this one off the list.

[sgarrett]

I got the new radiator in and plumbed. And I think I have as much coolant in as I can without running the engine and using the water pump to move the coolant around.

Radiator front.jpgRadiator back.jpg

All ready for first start. But I need to wait to do it with my son because he wants to be there....no problem. Hopefully later tonight or by this weekend.

Meanwhile, I started looking at that nose aluminum to get it installed before it gets trickier as you guys have pointed out. Thanks for your pix STI....very helpful.

But I am wondering which way people mounted the radiator supports. In my picture below I have them mounted to the outside of the frame.

Radiator mount detail.jpg

That is what the pictures in the manual look like. But the words say you should put them to the inside of the frame (opposite of what I have in the picture). If I put them on the inside it seems to make one of the aluminum pieces sit better. So I was thinking I should move them to the inside. Where did others put them?

Thanks...

[redbudrr]

I followed the pictures and directions in the manual and mine look just like yours, and it is working fine.

[sgarrett]

Yay. It started....first try. I was speechless.

[sgarrett]

And then I go-karted it back into the garage. Hmmm....these shift cables will take some practice to figure out.




It doesn't look like there are any leaks and nothing seemed to smoke or catch fire. Oil level measures good and I'll keep trying to shove more coolant in there. But the engine sounded really 'rattley' to me. The video is actually fairly accurate as to how it sounded (at least on my computer). Maybe it is valves not seating properly. Or it sounds like there isn't enough oil to my untrained ear. But it definitely measures right and I put in over 4.5 quarts. Could it just be the fact there is no muffler on it? Or it is just badly tuned?

I think next steps will be to get it to a tuner and aligned. I may try sticking the original muffler on there just to see what that sounds like.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

But the engine sounded really 'rattley' to me.

I also notice a high pitch buzzing noise that changed pitch with engine rpm. May something rubbing the fly wheel teeth. Maybe the timing belt rubbing something. I't didn't sound like valves to me. could be something itn the turbo, like a bad bearing.
Bob

[sgarrett]

Thanks Bob. Yes, I was thinking it was something mechanical in nature also. I ran it again and walked around it more carefully. I do think it is flywheel related. That seems to be where the noise is concentrated. Part of me was hoping it was just a turbo issue. Much easier to get that off....and throw money at it.

But I think my next step is to pull the transmission back off. Just out of curiosity, can I run the engine mounted in the car without the transmission in place? Or does it need that additional anchor point provided by the transmission? That would leave only the two anchor points on the sides of the engine....probably not enough.

2 steps forward, 1 step back. At least I'm not in Frank's shoes yet. ✌

[STiPWRD]

Congrats on the first start! The transmission needs to be on to run the motor because the starter is attached to it. The noise sounds like a bad bearing to me as well but it could be something minor.