Hindsight's build thread

[Kurk818]

I put ABS on my 818 with full STI running gear with no proportioning valve. ABS pump was used from a WRX to eliminate some of the STI rear differential, steering position and additional G sensor. So far, everything works great as is. Car chirps to an almost instant stop with no rear or front lock up. Im keeping it as is until something tells me otherwise.

[Hindsight]

Thanks Kurk and bbjones for the info.

Kurk, I have thought a bit about not using the prop valves. I feel like the right thing to do is solve it by increasing the rear brake size rather than restricting the fronts but that isn't an upgrade that I have on my radar at the moment. My only reason for not wanting to omit the valves now is that it's going to be hard to go back in and do them later with everything bolted in place. Maybe I'll just leave them out and call it good!

[Kurk818]

The ABS pump itself does a lot of the proportioning already. I went the route of not using the valve and figuring out what needs to be done if breaking was not up to par. So far, i like where its at.

[Tamra]

We are not using ABS, but we are using the provided proportioning valve. We found it very helpful at autocross and were able to dial it in to the point where the front only locked slightly before the rear. With upgraded pads, we didn't have any stopping issues, but I do agree with Hindsight that I don't like the idea of restricting the fronts rather than just adding to the rear. I guess we feel like we have enough braking ability that removing some from the front isn't hurting performance, so we are fine with using the proportioning valve rather than the extra $$ of experimenting with rear brake upgrades.

As of this point we are not planning to add ABS back, although I am glad to hear that you (Kurk) have had good luck using the WRX system. We were worried it would not work properly on such a light car. If we start flat spotting our Hoosiers too much, then maybe we will look into it....

[TouchStone]

The ABS pump itself does a lot of the proportioning already. I went the route of not using the valve and figuring out what needs to be done if breaking was not up to par. So far, i like where its at.

What proportioning is the ABS (I assume you mean module not pump) doing?

[Hindsight]

Thanks for the input Tamra and Kurk. I'm really on the fence. Much more simple plumbing without the valves. For a non-race car that will be tracked on occasion, I'm not sure I need it but I don't want to go back and add it later either.

[Tamra]

I would think it would be easier to add now rather than later. It will give you adjustment options if you decide you need it (and we definitely needed it).

[matteo92065]

I vote for the to proportioning valves. I put them hidden under the dash where I could reach them. I also have ABS. Fronts are STI Brembo's with Yellow stuff pads, rears are WRX red 2 pots, with stock old pads. With the valves screwed in the fronts will lock, and seemed like I was stopping great. With the valves screwed out, nothing wants to lock, but stops MUCH faster. I have pushed hard, but not super hard on the pedal yet. I'm putting on the Wilwood rear kit next week. I will find out how new pads, larger disk, and a little more piston area changes braking.

I'm with Tamra, easy to do now, and adds a lot of adjustment, even for street driving.

As for time it takes; wiring took me months, brake proportioning valves took me 1 day (and I've never done it before).

I like your build and attention to detail!

[Hindsight]

Thanks for the input folks (and the compliment). I agree that adding the valves now is the right thing to do. Worst case is that I don't use them. It's not THAT much hassle to add them in now. I'll just need to make my lines using 3/6" fittings on one end and M10 on the other (I'm ditching the FFR lines and all the wonky adapters and sticking with metric everywhere... also using copper nickel lines).

Hopefully by the end of this weekend I will have completed most if not all the hydraulic lines and can move onto the radiator and front AWIC exchanger. The punch list to first-start keeps getting smaller!

[matteo92065]

I'll just need to make my lines using 3/6" fittings on one end and M10 on the other (I'm ditching the FFR lines and all the wonky adapters and sticking with metric everywhere... also using copper nickel lines).

I did the same think. No adapters and the nickel lines are super easy to flair and bend. I did break the brake rules per the FSM; I reused a few of the original metric fittings. No leaks after 5 months of driving (need to find wood).

[Hindsight]

Wow, never heard that before. Doesn't really make sense to me given that you aren't replacing what they are threading into (master cylinder, ABS body, etc) so why would the fittings need replacing? I'm planning on re-using a few of mine as well and I have pack of new ones to use as needed.

Did you bend all the lines by hand or did you use the plier-shaped bending tools? I have the tool but it seems to kink the lines and a hand-bend looks better.

[bbjones121]

I reused lots of mine.

[matteo92065]

I tried the plier tool. Hated it. Could not get it to work right ended up kinking and denting my tubing. We have a simple pipe with the groove in it that ended up working out the best for us. So unfortunately I have a mix of slightly kinked, hand bent, and perfectly formed mandrel bends.

The factory Subaru manual says never reuse brake fittings, along with a bunch of other rules like never let the ABS pump get empty, never turn it upside down, etc. It made for interesting reading.

[bbjones121]

I tried the plier tool. Hated it. Could not get it to work right ended up kinking and denting my tubing. We have a simple pipe with the groove in it that ended up working out the best for us. So unfortunately I have a mix of slightly kinked, hand bent, and perfectly formed mandrel bends.

The factory Subaru manual says never reuse brake fittings, along with a bunch of other rules like never let the ABS pump get empty, never turn it upside down, etc. It made for interesting reading.

Subaru has probably been sued plenty over the years that everything from their direction is new, new, new. It is CYA. Plus they make all the money on new parts.

[Hindsight]

I tried the plier tool. Hated it. Could not get it to work right ended up kinking and denting my tubing. We have a simple pipe with the groove in it that ended up working out the best for us. So unfortunately I have a mix of slightly kinked, hand bent, and perfectly formed mandrel bends.

Do you have a pic of the tool you liked? Did it work a lot better than hand bending?

[STiPWRD]

One of these worked perfectly for me:
http://www.harborfreight.com/1-8-eig...der-94571.html

[Hindsight]

Thanks. For $10 it's worth a try!

[RM1SepEx]

That's what I use, works great

[Hindsight]

Thanks Dan. I work by a HF so I'll pick one up on the way home tonight.

[insurance guy]

Thanks Dan. I work by a HF so I'll pick one up on the way home tonight.

I am going there also for that, I find the plier type difficult to get just right, those look like exactly what I need

[bbjones121]

I used that also. Worked great.

[Hindsight]

Thanks again everyone for the tips. The front lines are all done. I've learned it isn't hard to do them, but it gets exponentially harder the cleaner you want it to look. Sloppy? Super easy. Clean? Moderately easy. OEM clean? Extremely challenging. I didn't reach my goal of OEM clean but it's functional.

I still need to run the rear lines.

I also got the AWIC brackets and intake pipes I made back from the powder coater and they look great. You can see the front and rear brackets in the pic below. I chose to make them out of steel.

I have some 3" mandrel bent SS pipes coming so I can start fabbing the exhaust soon. I'm trying to set it up so that wiring is the last thing standing in the way of my first start. I feel like it will give me more motivation to complete that tedious job. Still hoping to go-kart it in 2015.

[Tamra]

Looking good! I think go karting in 2015 is doable considering your progress!

[Frank818]

Man those brake lines, it's awesome.

[Hindsight]

I haven't posted much to my build thread but I have been spending a lot of time on the car. I'm getting very close to my first start now.

The radiator is in. I used Rori's spacers and fabricated my own upper mounts partially re-using the donor upper mounts. I got stuck here though because I ran out of the flexible steel coolant hose (made a bad cut). Luckily, STiPWRD was nice enough to ship me his extra hose so as soon as I get that, I can connect the hoses to the radiator. Once those are on, I need to fab some brackets for the AWIC heat exchanger. Waiting on 1/2" NPT x 3/4" barb fittings before I can do that.


The engine is basically completely finished. All that's left is to connect one of the two AWIC lines to the right side of the intercooler and route it up to the front heat exchanger, connect the wiring harness, and fab up an exhaust system. Still haven't fully decided which way to go on the exhaust but I'm either going to do a dual setup with a muffler over the trans, or a single setup with a hidden tip dumping out the bottom of the engine compartment, or coming out the side of the bumper like the blue car but I think that looks a little weird. In the pic below, the clear silicone hoses are so I can test some theories about air bleeding. If everything works the way I want it to, I'll replace them with black heater hose.


Yesterday I started on the wiring. I've actually enjoyed working on it a lot because it's the kind of thing you can sit down and just do for hours; you don't get stuck because you ran out of something or need some bracket or bolt from the hardware store. You get a momentum going. Anyway, I'm taking the approach of removing ALL shielding and tape from it first. The connectors are already labeled with blue masking tape from when I pulled them off the donor. The tape stayed on nicely over the last year (I ensured I wraped it around the wires so it was sticky side to sticky side). After all the shielding is off, I used some small velcro straps to keep the wires bundled in their approximate shape to keep them organized. This allows you to pull wires all the way through the harness. Next I figure out what components I won't need and then remove the wires leaving a 4" pigtail behind the connector they went into (just in case I removed something I shouldn't and have to go back in and patch). Next I will lay it in the car and figure out where I'll mount everything, then figure out what needs to be shortened or extended. After that I'll put the wires inside some split braid loom for the interior, and possibly some flexible plastic loom for the exterior (not quite sure yet).



These tools have been invaluable. The orange pick I use to insert under tape, then twist to the side which pierces and then splits the tape about 1/2" at a time. Not risky on the wires inside. The seam ripper can be used for the same thing and to split round plastic sheathing but you have to be careful it doesn't touch the wires inside. And lastly, the velcro straps from any hardware store. Very nice to work with and cheap.


So after plumbing the radiator, fabbing the turbo-back exhaust, and connecting the wiring, it will be time to fire it up.

[Frank818]

So after plumbing the radiator, fabbing the turbo-back exhaust, and connecting the wiring, it will be time to fire it up.

Are you sure? There's always something we kind of forget.

[Hindsight]

Just gas I think!

[Hindsight]

No more pics, sorry, but the wiring harness has come along faster than I suspected. Of course, given the "body integrated control unit / Immobilizer" and the keyless entry systems, and how tied they are into the various sensors and systems of the car (I found links to the radio, climate control, door switches and door locks among others), it's tough to know for sure if I dieted anything that should not have been. If the immobilizer will allow the engine to start without door switch sensors, door lock sensors, climate control, and a radio, then I should be ok.

One issue I came across is that my donor is an '07 and the Ken Gilbert website that provides free downloads of factory service manuals doesn't have a 2007-specific manual; they have 2006 which is very close, but not exact, as I have unfortunately discovered. One of the biggest changes is the connector and wires on the engine wiring harness. I was able to get the right diagrams by purchasing a subscription to AllDataDIY.com. It's ~ $25 for a year and works in any web browser. The only drawback is that unlike the PDF, you can't search the wiring diagrams (for example, if you want to search for connector "B179", you can't). The wiring diagrams are also organized very poorly and you can't scroll through them exactly, you have to go in page by page, but the info is accurate and it's all there. I would definitely recommend for the price. Contains everything the FSM does.

The reality of how close I am to first start is really setting in. It might happen this weekend or next.

[Aero STI]

I deleted all of those sensors/switches from my '06 harness and had no issues with the immobilizer.

[Hindsight]

Whew, that's a load off. Thanks!

[bbjones121]

You can get a three day subscription to Subaru manuals (downloadable in pdf). Go to the STIS website. Subaru Technical Information System.

[Hindsight]

What is the STIS website? I googled STIS and did not like what came up on my screen

[bbjones121]

Search Subaru Technical Information System

[Hindsight]

Got it, thanks. Much better than the other results.

[bbjones121]

Got it, thanks. Much better than the other results.

Haha, good.

[Hindsight]

The first step to recovery is admitting you have a problem:

[C.Plavan]

The first step to recovery is admitting you have a problem:

Bahahahahahahahahaha

[Hindsight]

The sad part is that this collection of boxes doesn't go back more than a couple weeks. There have been many piles before this and will be many piles after.

Ok, engine coolant system is completed and sealed. All I need to do now is lay the wiring harness in place, plug in the connectors, fill the engine and trans with fluids and start the car. That is, assuming I didn't make any major mistakes on the wiring harness diet.

[Aero STI]

I had a similar pile at one point. Summit, Amazon, Eastwood... Nice work.

[Frank818]

It's cool, you can save the world if you recycle your boxes, you got so many it's gonna save the Amazon forest! Not amazon.com, they actually use boxes!