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Thread: P100DHG Build Thread

  1. #1
    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    P100DHG Build Thread

    To make navigating the thread and skipping to relevant parts easier, I have included a Table of Contents. Obviously feel free to read it through to understand the chronological order of how things happened but I am going to organize it by chapter/subject so everyone can easily jump around. Disclaimer: I am writing this on the fly so I will organize the table of contents by subject and the table of contents might not necessarily follow the order of the posts in the thread.

    Table Of Contents:

    1. Preface
    2. Ordering & Build Specs:
    3. The Build:
    3.1 Disc Brakes
    Last edited by P100DHG; 01-10-2019 at 04:54 PM.

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Preface

    So yesterday I took the plunge and ordered a 65 Daytona Coupe. Given my work schedule and travel obligations I put my FFR completion date out till December 22nd. Stewart will likely pick it up after the first of the year but I may get a holiday surprise delivery. Lets just say I am a sucker for a sale and the 50% of the options got me. I have never built a car like this. I had a 1964 Volkswagen Bug that I did a lot of work on when I was in my early twenties. I said to myself after that car never again will I do a classic car. I maintain that to this day but the idea of building a factory new car with the feel and look of a vintage car got me to bend the rules 10 years later. I thought about starting with a Cobra but after seeing the resale numbers on those (not that I would sell it but still) I thought it was better to buy a used one or a used kit on this forum and complete it rather than building one from scratch (so this will be my next one). Plus those dual side pipes and stance on the coupe are just too hard to resist. I have frequented Bob's Big Boy a local burger joint down the street from my house that has a classic car night every Friday. I've seen FFR cobras, superperformance cobras, even real cobras there but never a coupe. In fact I've never seen one in person.

    I would say my level of DIY is very advanced so I think this is well within my wheel house. Learning the names of all the parts will just have a natural learning curve. I think my biggest challenge with this build is the lack of space I have. I have a 2 car garage but I don't want to displace my Tesla Model S P100D so somehow it's going to have to share the space because that car isn't going outside. My wife is amazing with organization so hopefully she will help me with that. I have most of the tools required and what I don't have (those one time use tools) I'll get from the trusted Harbor Freight. (I'll be clipping those 25% off coupons starting now).

    I'm an avid BBQ guy and when I custom fabricated and built my smoker I posted all the plans and pictures of my build on Smoking Meat Forums and it has helped many people with theirs https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/th...-clone.232875/. I intend to do the same here. At least give some insight as to how I arrived at my conclusions and processes on the build. I want to start by saying that the threads I have read here are unbelievably helpful and I found many things I really liked on other peoples cars. I hope if I use your designs as inspiration you know that imitation is the highest form of flattery.

    In my prebuild thread I explored the thought of a Roush 427 and that is still in my mind but FFR was very concerned about it fitting under the hood. I would have loved a 289 with an 8 stack (original spec of the car) but I am not going to become an engine builder nor am I going to buy a Shelby Engine for $30K. Jeff Miller convinced me to go the Coyote route. His words of advice, "you know it's not a real Daytona right? go with a modern engine." We talked about the carb will come out of adjustment, cams are to aggressive leading to unspent fuel between 1200 and 3000 RPM, and the EFI systems use sensors that monitor the engine only after the fact so they are late to adjust. I plan to track the car a few times per year and I think that the coyote will take the punishment better and with variable timing it will have great street and track performance. My initial exploration of the coyote lead me to the Gen 3 and @edwardb seems to have the latest on that info to date so I am waiting to hear more. My brother, a real car guy is pushing for a 5.2L which lead to the idea of packing in a 5.2L Voodoo engine into this car. Might be insanely excessive so I am going to think on that one, plus there are serious technical issues with installing that engine in a crate type application. For one there is no computer designed to run that engine in the car. All that said I chose a coyote platform and which one will have to evolve.

    Anyway on to the thread.
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-29-2018 at 11:07 PM.

  3. #3
    edwardb's Avatar
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    Congrats on your kit order! Delivery four months away and already a build thread. Nice! Two comments about your order. Have you decided which transmission? TKO (5-speed) or T-56 (6-speed)? Seem to recall you mentioned considering a T-56. I'd be a little cautious about the IRS center section from FFR. Confirm what ratio they'd provide and whether that's the best fit with your intended transmission. The ratios between the TKO and T-56 are different enough IMO that they may require a different diff to be optimal. Not trying to take business away from FFR, but those are pretty easily available elsewhere for the same price (or less). Also TKO and T-56 require a different drive shaft. Similar comment about the wipers. I'd highly recommend the Specialty Power Windows WWK2 Complete Universal Wiper Drive Kit. That's what I found for my Coupe build. It's cheaper and (again IMO) much superior to the Lucas knock-off wiper kit FFR sells. I know the 50% off is attractive in this case. But read the multiple threads about setting up these wipers. Also not sure if they increase the blade and sweep for the much larger Coupe windshield compared to the Roadster. Don't sweat changing your order. You can make multiple changes (and many do) right up to the last couple weeks.

    You'll love the Coyote. I sure do. Looks like only a couple more weeks and the Gen 3 Coyote crate will be available from Ford Performance. Confirmed that earlier this week. I suspect you know the flat plane Voodoo will not be available as a crate motor, according to Ford. Guys are making their own by buying the various components. But not a simple or cheap exercise. The roughly 500 hp Gen 3 Coyote will motivate this car pretty aggressively to say the least. Power adders are available to bump it up a bunch more.
    Last edited by edwardb; 08-16-2018 at 06:33 AM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
    Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. #7750 Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017. #8674 Build Thread
    Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017. #59 Coupe Build Thread

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Build Specs 1.0 & Some Thoughts

    Build Specs 1.0:

    I carefully chose my options. I might have revised no less than a dozen times. Here is what I ordered. If it looks like basically everything it almost is. The points I am still unsure of is the wilwood brakes (nice for the track) and the IRS vs the 3 link but IRS seems nice and modern.

    Complete Coupe Kit
    Powder Coating Gen 3 Coupe Chassis
    Body Cut Outs
    Low back Vintage Race Seats (will change for high backs at some point in build)
    IRS
    Center Section and Spindles
    Gen 3 Carpet Kit
    Side Window Components
    Coupe Nose Scoops
    Front and Rear Sway Bar
    Wilwood Front and Rear Brakes
    Koni Dual Adjustable Shocks
    GPS Gauges
    Halibrand 18" wheels
    Windshield wipers (might not install, will have to wait and see)
    Battery Cut off Switch
    Coyote Install Kit
    Coyote Headers
    Coyote Power Steering

    Now the wait and let the reading of the build manual a million times begin.

    UPDATE: BUILD CHANGED AGAIN FROM COYOTE TO 427 SBF SEE THREAD BELOW:
    https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...l=1#post344509



    Some Thoughts:

    The voodoo engine is likely off the table, though I havenít completely nixed the idea. The flat plane crank is what Iím after. After all we are building a race car why not give it a race style engine. That said itís very complicated. The software programming on the ECU is going to be in the thousands, money Iíd prefer to spend elsewhere.

    My plan is to get a Gen 3. I am in fact going to do a T56 magnum. These new gen 3 coyotes can rev quite high so I really want to go with something that can support it.

    I tried finding a 3.73 rear end but have failed to find one on the shelf. That's what the Boss 302 had in it. That said I drove the 2018 Mustang GT which has a variant of the Magnum according to Tremec and that is a equipped with a 3.55 and it was snappy. I would still prefer the 3.73 though. Any leads would be excellent!

    The wiper blade kit Iíll struggle with it will keep me entertained or frustrated or something. LOL. Again not sure I even intend to use them. In Los Angeles rain is a novelty these days.

    I started my build thread because hopefully this preliminary discussion helps someone and ME! LOL. Spoke to Ford the new Gen 3 Coyote part number is M-6007-M50C. MSRP $9500

    Any help with that rear diff would be appreciated. Thanks!
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-29-2018 at 06:12 PM.

  5. #5
    edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P100DHG View Post
    The voodoo engine is likely off the table, though I haven’t completely nixed the idea. The flat plane crank is what I’m after. After all we are building a race car why not give it a race style engine. That said it’s very complicated. The software programming on the ECU is going to be in the thousands, money I’d prefer to spend elsewhere.

    My plan is to get a Gen 3. I am in fact going to do a T56 magnum. These new gen 3 coyotes can rev quite high so I really want to go with something that can support it.

    I tried finding a 3.73 rear end but have failed to find one on the shelf. That's what the Boss 302 had in it. That said I drove the 2018 Mustang GT which has a variant of the Magnum according to Tremec and that is a equipped with a 3.55 and it was snappy. I would still prefer the 3.73 though. Any leads would be excellent!

    The wiper blade kit I’ll struggle with it will keep me entertained or frustrated or something. LOL. Again not sure I even intend to use them. In Los Angeles rain is a novelty these days.

    I started my build thread because hopefully this preliminary discussion helps someone and ME! LOL. Spoke to Ford the new Gen 3 Coyote part number is M-6007-M50C. MSRP $9500

    Any help with that rear diff would be appreciated. Thanks!
    Good luck with the wipers. Don't say I didn't warn you or offer a better alternative.

    Crunch the numbers on the 3.55 and 3.73 diffs with the T-56. Especially with the several hundred higher redline on the Gen 3 Coyote (not that real world driving in these cars will find a 7,500 redline very often, trust me...). I think you'll find the 3.73 is the much better match, as I mentioned before. Ford Performance discontinued them some months ago and any that were out there on the shelf are gone. They're still routinely available in salvage. Since they're Torsen, they're more expensive than the usual clutch pack versions like all the rest. But that alone is another reason to try to find one. They're out there with low miles and probably for a good value. Just start looking and be ready to buy when you find something that meets your needs.

    Yes, that's the retail price of the Gen 3 Coyote. Of course, they aren't sold for for that much. The crate Coyotes are typically discounted approx 15%, control packs approx 25%. The exact details and numbers should be more widely available when it's officially released to the public in the next couple weeks.
    Last edited by edwardb; 08-23-2018 at 07:03 PM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
    Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. #7750 Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017. #8674 Build Thread
    Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017. #59 Coupe Build Thread

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Rear Differential

    Paul (edwardb) has convinced me the torsen 3.73 is the right rear end ratio. I found one for $385 from LKQ a national used parts distributor with 27,000 miles on it and a 6 month warranty (which seems irrelevant) They transferred it to a closer location for me at no cost. LKQ said they would exchange it at no cost if my rear end shop didnít approve. LKQ refers to this part as a "carrier assembly" and they have several. Their price points seem completely random to the end consumer. Some are $1200 with more miles and some are $385 with less. According to LKQ it depends on how long they have had it in inventory and where in the country it's located. According to them all are in good drop in condition. Can't seem to go wrong here. I'll clean it up and use Por15 on it, it will be better then new.

    IMG_0064.jpg

    I took the rear end to Hoopers Rear End Inc. A very reputable shop in Los Angeles and Anthony gave it his blessing. Said ďyou got a good one here.Ē How much did he charge me you might ask $0. He sealed it back up for me and after insisting he charge me he said $20. Lol what a nice guy. Here is his info https://www.yelp.com/biz/hoopers-rear-end-sun-valley

    IMG_0067.jpg

    One major headache is that it was filthy and needed to be washed. Well itís got two openings for the axles and I didnít want to get water in them. So I brought in the brains. My wife suggested balloons! They worked great! I inflated the balloons inside the axle holes (thatís the technical term) to make a tight seal and pressure washed it. Surprisingly the balloons didnít pop and kept a strong seal.

    IMG_0089.jpg

    Now for the POR15. It was as simple as following the directions on the kit. Works great. Second coat is weird because the first coat covers so well that the second coat is hard to keep track of where I had applied it because its so black.

    IMG_0097.jpg

    One major item that just drives me nuts about this car is how ugly the interior is. I know it was a race car and intended to be a replica but one thing I intend to do between now and when I receive the kit is to iron out how I want my interior to look. I have looked at many hot rods, and Daytona replicas and come up with an idea of what I want it to look like. I will likely delete my carpet kit, I plan to do button in/ snap down floor mats (keeping them may prove to be better just to have the pattern, we'll see). I deleted the seats and took a $400 credit on my bill. I am in the process of narrowing my interior choices. I am thinking about powder coating every panel silver and use saddle leather for the seat covers I am planning on using Corbeau FX1 Pros for now (I saw someone's on the internet I really liked and will likely just copy them obviously I will give them credit once completed). I spoke with Marx at Lizard Skin he assured me that it can be applied outward facing and it can hold up to road and weather conditions so thats my current plan. My completion date is now Dec 8th so I've got time to start figuring all this out.

    Any comments or advice are always welcome and I am happy to answer questions about anything I've completed along the way.
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-29-2018 at 03:10 PM.

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    Senior Member Clover's Avatar
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    Awesome find on the center section. I am going to look those guys up this weekend as well. I had been looking and kept coming back to a entire rear end for $1,000 plus shipping. I think you source will save me some effort. Where are you getting the spindles and knuckles from that you will need to go along with the center section? Are you just going to order those new from Ford?

    I think your interior will come out awesome if I am picturing it right. I really like the idea of the silver with the saddle leather snapped down. I had been thinking of doing a 33 hot rod and was going to do a similar thing in the hot rod. Good to hear that you can do Lizard skill on the underside of the car. I thought I had seen that done on a car show before but I was not sure it would hold up. I am looking forward to following you build once your kit gets to you.
    Gen III Type 65 Coupe Delivered 6/26/2018

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    So FFR sells the whole center section kit for $1499. Since I have my own rear differential now Factory Five is charging me $450 for the remaining required components. Huge savings.

    According to my phone conversation with Marx at Lizard Skin he said people use it as exterior application on off-road trucks. He seemed certain it could take the abuse. Weíll see, only time will tell.

    One more thing about the POR15 kit for $23 you could paint 5 of these differencials with it. Itís a tiny kit I was not impressed at first until I realized how little it takes and how amazing it covers

  10. #9
    edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P100DHG View Post
    So FFR sells the whole center section kit for $1499. Since I have my own rear differential now Factory Five is charging me $450 for the remaining required components. Huge savings.

    According to my phone conversation with Marx at Lizard Skin he said people use it as exterior application on off-road trucks. He seemed certain it could take the abuse. We’ll see, only time will tell.
    Agreed. Great find and price for the center section. Especially since it's the Torsen version which is a more expensive piece than the standard clutch style version Factory Five provides.

    Of course Lizard Skin would say that. No surprise. It's a rough finish though. Just depends on what you want.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
    Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. #7750 Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017. #8674 Build Thread
    Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017. #59 Coupe Build Thread

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Speaking of Torsen style. Hoopers told me 2 quarts of synthetic lube and no friction modifier because it doesn’t have clutches. I imagine he knows what he is talking about. Any thoughts here?
    Last edited by P100DHG; 09-01-2018 at 06:41 PM.

  12. #11
    edwardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P100DHG View Post
    Speaking of Torsen style. Hoopers told me 2 quarts of synthetic lube and no friction modifier because it doesn’t have clutches. I imagine he knows what he is talking about. Any thoughts here?
    I used the exact products from the Ford documentation: 3.2 pt Motorcraft SAE 75W-85 Premium Synthetic Hypoid Gear Lubricant XY-75W85-QL, 4.0 fl oz Motorcraft Additive Friction Modifier XL-3. I too am pretty certain the Torsen version doesn't need the friction modifier. But the Ford info didn't list any difference. Doubt it would hurt anything either way. But I also always worry about any warranty concerns if the instructions aren't followed exactly. In my case, it was a NIB diff, so did what they said.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
    Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. #7750 Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017. #8674 Build Thread
    Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017. #59 Coupe Build Thread

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  14. #12
    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Build Specs 2.0 - Change of Engine

    So after all the coyote discussion. I've scrapped the plan and I am going to do a Small Block Ford (SBF) engine with EFI. FFR was nice enough to make the change. Had a very productive conversation with Blueprint Engines. Made the decision for 2 reasons.

    1. Factor #1 came about when I was talking with my brother about cars (we love to talk cars together) he made some comment about a replica with a dated engine and it got me thinking about other peoples perceptions of the coyote platform over time and how they might see this car in 10 years. In my short term thinking the Gen 2 coyote is discontinued. A more advanced engine has come along. The Gen 3 and by all accounts it a major improvement but frankly looking at Edwardb's build the gen 3 is off the table. It is just too much to bite off. I am not capable of taking the time learn how to alter the engine like he is and run my business and wrangle our 2 year old. Thus leaving me with the option of a gen 2 "a dated engine" (as my brother referred to it.) Additionally I felt pressure to buy the Gen 2 engine and transmission now because of supply concerns and didn't want to drop $15k on an engine and transmission and have it sit in my garage for a year while I put the car together, the warranty clock ticking and the money locked up.

    2. Factor 2 came about when a gentleman on this forum asked about the value of these cars and I posted my research. In that research I found a Daytona that sold for $30k with an old Mustang 4.6L engine and really there wasn't much of a difference between the cars that sold for $55k and $72k except for the engine. Though I am building the car for me I always think about the value of what I am doing. What will the car be worth once it's done. That's not the objective though to sell it. The objective would be my son takes his prom date to the dance in this car (safely). So, what would be the value of the car in 15 years with a Coyote engine? I don't have a crystal ball but my psychic tells me it's not going to be as valuable as a 427 regardless of the age of the block (just kidding on the psychic, it's intuition).

    I want to throw out a disclaimer. My no means do I disagree with anyone's choice of engine this is your car and I just love the fact we are all here talking about it. I am just sharing my thought process in the hopes it helps guide someone because frankly I almost cancelled my build because I got so frustrated by my confusion. Note, none of my decisions where based on what was period correct (though argument 2 might have some relevance to that).

    Updated: For continuity I am including the link to the thread regarding ordering the beating heart of this build. The Roush 427SR. I have learned a lot researching the SBF since my first posts and I am working out details on fitment as of right now. Likely will order (put a deposit down) before Christmas to lock in the price on the engine. Roush will hold the engine till I'm ready for it. Warranty starts 90 days after I receive it. I don't anticipate needing it for 6 months.

    https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...mer-RPM-Intake

    Build on Brothers!

    -Danny
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-29-2018 at 06:50 PM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

  15. #13
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    Not going to argue or question your decisions. You've clearly thought this through and arrived at your decisions. But FWIW, several comments. The Gen 2 Coyote apparently still has about an 8 month supply on hand at Ford Performance. So they're not going to run out real soon. The Gen 3 Coyote installation I'm doing isn't altering the engine. What I'm doing, e.g. changing the oil pan and pickup, wiring, etc. is normally very straightforward and well documented. The main issue I'm having with the different oil pump is supposed to have a plug and play solution soon. I was just too early for it. A year from now, if that's your timeline, the Gen 3 Coyote will have multiple installations and all the details sorted out. Just like the Gen 2 is now. I find it interesting that you're worrying about the Coyote being a dated engine sometime in the future when the engine you're planning to use has its origins back in the 60-70-80's. Although agreed that is closer to the origin of the Coupe in the first place. Having said that, IMO the engine content between a SBF and Coyote is going to be a wash for the future value. Some will see value in a modern computer controlled engine. Some will see value in an engine more in line with the originals. But mainly future value is going to be based on condition of course, but then build quality and attention to detail. A well built car will command the best price. A poorly executed one not so much. Regardless of engine. This I believe was also one of the conclusions of the thread you started. I'd highly recommend taking these aspects into full account as you're thinking about future value and your build. Very difficult to compare sale prices based on content alone.

    OK, now carry on and have fun. That's the whole idea, right?
    Last edited by edwardb; 10-27-2018 at 09:49 AM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
    Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. #7750 Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017. #8674 Build Thread
    Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017. #59 Coupe Build Thread

  16. #14
    TheBabyBadger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardb View Post
    Not going to argue or question your decisions. You've clearly thought this through and arrived at your decisions. But FWIW, several comments. The Gen 2 Coyote apparently still has about an 8 month supply on hand at Ford Performance. So they're not going to run out real soon. The Gen 3 Coyote installation I'm doing isn't altering the engine. What I'm doing, e.g. changing the oil pan and pickup, wiring, etc. is normally very straightforward and well documented. The main issue I'm having with the different oil pump is supposed to have a plug and play solution soon. I was just too early for it. A year from now, if that's your timeline, the Gen 3 Coyote will have multiple installations and all the details sorted out. Just like the Gen 2 is now. I find it interesting that you're worrying about the Coyote being a dated engine sometime in the future when the engine you're planning to use has its origins back in the 60-70-80's. Although agreed that is closer to the origin of the Coupe in the first place. Having said that, IMO the engine content between a SBF and Coyote is going to be a wash for the future value. Some will see value in a modern computer controlled engine. Some will see value in an engine more in line with the originals. But mainly future value is going to be based on condition of course, but then build quality and attention to detail. A well built car will command the best price. A poorly executed one not so much. Regardless of engine. This I believe was also one of the conclusions of the thread you started. I'd highly recommend taking these aspects into full account as you're thinking about future value and your build. Very difficult to compare sale prices based on content alone.

    OK, now carry on and have fun. That's the whole idea, right?
    First off... great progress so far! Way ahead of the ball, that's the way to be! I'm going to chime in and piggy back Paul here... The Gen2 Coyote is powerful and well sorted. The Gen3 is going to be in a similar boat (lol) in the coming year. There are about 5 other Coyote variants (like my Boss, Voodoo, XS, Roush, etc)... the cars may change in value to some degree between these motors, but Gen1/2/3 you're really just splitting hairs. Aside from going from an NA engine to blown to turbo, etc, the differences aren't going to affect value THAT much. The more "plug and play" the engine is, the more likely I can see some one buying it, IMHO.

    If you were deciding between a carbureted 427, a 331 stroker and a Coyote... those are major differences. Essentially you're just taking the same cute girl out with a different dress, my friend. By the time the car is done, anything you run will be a few months, a year old, whatever. Don't sweat the petty stuff, and don't pet the sweaty stuff. Also, don't break your back reinventing the wheel. Recipes work for a reason. God speed, no matter what you choose, it's going to be a hoot when it's done!

    Lastly, keep in mind your DIY skills. There's a huge difference between building this car and doing something like Paul. While he's incredible humble, understand he has a carnal knowledge of these builds and he's not a DIY guy, he's writing the DIY book.

    Most importantly, HAVE FUN! Can't wait to see it begin, hopefully I'm go-karting by then!

    Oh and SUBSCRIBED!
    Gen3 Coupe: BOSS 302/Coyote & T56 Build Thread - https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...733#post312733

    Arrival: 6/21/18 1st Go Kart: TBA Registered: TBA Painted: TBA Complete:TBA

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  18. #15
    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Parts & Tools Ordered

    Per Edwardb I ordered the Moog ES2150RL Tie Rod End through amazon $18.39 prime shipping and extended holiday returns (not that I will need this but it's nice to have). I didn't like the idea of cutting the tie rods. This is a great solution. Grateful he is paving the way. Delivery on the Coupe is looking like end of January. My completion date is 1/12/2019. I'm starting to gather necessary tools from Harbor Freight and the internet that I don't have and parts that will be needed in the beginning stages. My goal is to have a well measured pace but not to rush through it. Just steady progress. I love the dash that forcefed1 came up with. Very very nice. Defiantly inspired by that.
    Last edited by P100DHG; 11-11-2018 at 07:04 PM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    December 2018 Update

    Just to clarify something I was confused on and for those waiting for your kits and want to order stuff while you wait, here is some clarification to a problem I was trying to solve. The front wheel studs provided by factory five are 1/2"-20 (length is unknown by me but also irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion). The rear IRS hubs come with metric studs installed. Factory Five provides standard 1/2"-20 studs and 1/2" lug nuts. The manual requires you to press out the metric studs and install the standard 1/2"-20 studs by pressing them back in. If you intend to put wheel spacers on the rear (the style I used anyhow) than the 1/2"-20 studs provided that you will be reinstalling will be too long and make contact with the back of the wheel. Most people thread a bolt onto the stud, cut the stud to length with a grinder and back off the nut (thus cleaning up the threads). I ordered the Eibach Spacers from Speedway. Though the picture and description showed they came with shorter studs, they did not. They have since remove the picture. They were nice enough to give me a $30 credit for the inconvenience. (they offered, I did not ask for it).

    https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Eibac...rd,324913.html

    I called Eibach to try to clear up the discrepancy and spoke to someone (Tanner I believe) who said they'd call me back, never heard anything even after a follow up call back to them.

    I really don't want to cut the studs so I went ahead and ordered shorter studs on Amazon.

    https://www.amazon.com/Dorman-610-36...=ATVPDKIKX0DER

    IMG_1273.jpg

    To match the rear Wilwood rotors I bought VHT Satin Black Roll Bar and Chassis Paint

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    IMG_1274.jpg

    I am going to stick to thumbnail size pictures as much as possible to help condense the thread. My goal is to show the progress of the build and document it as closely as possible, try to document where I deviate from the directions (custom stuff), or where I see people may need clarification.
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-29-2018 at 06:48 PM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Engine Ordered

    Engine ordered. Here is my engine build invoice from Roush.

    FF76EC88-270D-42CD-BF91-0F747CA585E2.jpeg

    I think the valve covers were a bit expensive but a nice touch. Mark said he would send me a video of the engine on the dyno once completed, which I will post. I’ll send final payment and they will ship when I’m ready to take delivery (hopefully sometime this summer). Should look very similar to this completed.

    A858ADA5-3946-4A57-8F8D-AC5F5D03CA50.jpeg

    Happy Holidays!
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-22-2018 at 01:23 AM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

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  22. #18
    Straversi's Avatar
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    Congratulations. That’s a beauty.
    -Steve
    MK IV #8901 - Complete kit, Coyote, TKO-600, IRS. Ordered 5/23/16, Delivered 7/14/16, First Start 8/13/17, First Go-Kart 10/22/17, Registered and Completed 10/18/18. Build Thread: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showt...V-Coyote-Build Graduation Thread: https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...-Roadster-8901

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    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Thought Capsule 1

    I am posting this as time capsule into my design thought process. My hope is I can reflect back and track my train of thought before I dive head in to the actual building process.

    Interior:
    I’ve been working on a design board for my interior. I have nailed down the interior seat color to a Saddle leather. It's going to look all race car but keep that high end feel. I am taking inspiration from Mike Dusold’s 67 Camaro. I am leaning toward directly replicating his seats (imitation is the highest form of flattery after all).

    IMG_0223.jpg

    Floor mats and door panels will match the seats. All interior panels will be powder coated silver for a high end finished look. The dash I’m still fighting with the design. Once the kit arrives I can make some cardboard templates and work on the arrangement of the vents and gauges. Better to figure this stuff out before I build it than realize I made an error and have to rebuild it.

    Exterior:
    I am strongly considering the same deep blue with white stripes as the Factory Five #1 car. Should complement the interior. I am definitely cutting out the rear body vents.

    A2-CAM10002.jpg

    My brother is pushing me to replicate this paint job. AMAZING but I am not sure I want a green car. Here is a great article on a green and yellow Daytona

    DSC_8296_David-Hart-and-Olivier-Hart_1964-Shelby-Cobra-Daytona_2017-July-28.jpg

    Engine Bay:
    I may have the powder coater do all the panels in satin black. I think this will play off the polished engine and satin black valve covers well. Problem is the frame is gloss black... . Gloss black is an option Paul B's looks great. I thought about silver for all the engine bay panels... I could use some suggestions here.

    Wheels:
    I bought the FFR 18” wheels. Might powder coat or paint them a lighter color to pop better or go with a new wheel setup. I spoke to Joey at BBI Autosport (they do work on my brother’s car) and he advised just to get the wheels from FFR and do the full suspension setup with them before considering different wheels. I really like this bone white color and am considering painting the wheels this color if I don't replace them all together or paint to match the interior silver powder coat to tie it all together.

    ImageFetch__9_.jpg
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-24-2018 at 12:00 AM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

  24. #20
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    Paid Invoice

    Trying to keep all the major records in one place. Should help those researching buying a kit.

    Invoice.png

    My next post should be in February with pictures of the kit in my garage.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

  25. #21


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    Quote Originally Posted by P100DHG View Post
    ...Problem is the frame is gloss black...
    Actually the frame will be a matte black. They changed from gloss several months ago


    Wheels:...I really like this bone white color and am considering painting the wheels this color if I don't replace them all together...
    Ever since seeing them on Gary Chaney's Gen1 Coupe way back in 2001 or so I've really like the look of white wheels on a blue Coupe but you need to consider whether you'd be willing to put up with the brake dust that will be on them after every drive.

    Good luck with the build!

    Jeff

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    Your build thread is great and I’ve been going through it in my efforts to spec my project. My question relates to the IRS and the advantages over the 3 link standard? I’m planning Coyote with T56. Also are the double adjustable Konis worth the extra investment in your opinion? Thanks for any help. Again your thread is great.

  27. #23
    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher Lake Hot Rods View Post
    Your build thread is great and I’ve been going through it in my efforts to spec my project. My question relates to the IRS and the advantages over the 3 link standard? I’m planning Coyote with T56. Also are the double adjustable Konis worth the extra investment in your opinion? Thanks for any help. Again your thread is great.
    I can’t speak to IRS vs 3 link I just assumed that every modern sports car has IRS and this is a 400-500hp car that weighs 2300lbs and no traction control, it could use every technalogical advantage available.

    The Coyote T56 is the right combo. As it turns out there is no 351w/302 + T56 + IRS drive shaft supplied by FFR. According to Dave B. it would have to be custom made. So my final build is going to be and SBF with a TKO600

    As for the suspension I can speak to that. Dual adjustable suspension can be dialed in so that you have ride comfort and performance. It’s not a one size fits all like single adjustable suspension. It doesn't have to be rock hard to give you great cornering or a soft and mushy to give you a comfortable ride. The shock can be dialed in to give you comfort and performance. I intend to take my completed car to a suspension expert to dial it in perfectly, and set the alignment up for great performance (not build it but tune it). This is the one expert besides a paint shop I intend to use.

    The shocks were not actually $1800 they were a $900 upgrade because I got the 50% options summer sale and I felt like it was worth the money after speaking to experts about how much it would cost if I made the wrong choice and had to buy those from scratch. That said what did sting were those wildwood brakes and they just better be unbelievable because if they aren't I will have really sacrificed the look of the car I wanted see below. Plus on top of the $3k I had to pay for the upgrade I had to pay $130 from them to ship from Wildwood which is 30 min from my house. People familiar with them attest they are worth the money.

    This project can snowball for example. The brakes. Experts will say, "gotta have great brakes if you're putting 400hp to the rear wheels of a 2300lb car" so I went with the Wilwoods. I wanted to put the 15" wheels and those awesome radials on the car but when I tried to find tires the shops would ask me about the build. The first thing they would say was "those tires are going to give you horrible performance get bigger wheels so we can put a modern tire on that car. It's a performance car!" not to mention that the wildwood 12.88" brakes can't fit under 15" wheels so I'd have to put on smaller brakes. So if I put smaller brakes on the car, and 15" wheels I would never be able to get the full potential out of it or if I put smaller brakes on my car and 18" wheels and keep a set of 15" as a second set I still would have to settle for smaller brakes. No right answers here it's all personal preference and if you can't tell I got sucked in by "expert" opinions. I tried to make my decisions as educated as possible.
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-30-2018 at 11:08 PM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

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    Thank you. This is very helpful. I’m reading everything I can on the forum to get ready.

  29. #25
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    Good discussion and feedback. Two follow-up comments. I've had solid axle and IRS. Highly recommend IRS. It rides better and with the 2015+ Mustang version it's also the highest performance. Does add +/- couple thousand to the build cost, which obviously can be a factor. Also depends on how you plan to use the car. A solid axle is generally a better choice for hard launches, like drag passes. But for everything else, the IRS is a great choice. You won't regret it. Nobody likes to talk about it because they think they'll never sell their car. But also adds to the desirability and resale value.

    As far as the driveshaft, if Factory Five doesn't offer a length that fits your engine/trans/suspension combination, that doesn't have to steer your decision. A driveshaft shop can easily shorten an existing driveshaft. Or a brand new custom length can be ordered from a place like Denny's Driveshafts.
    Last edited by edwardb; 12-31-2018 at 07:05 AM.
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
    Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. #7750 Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017. #8674 Build Thread
    Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017. #59 Coupe Build Thread

  30. #26
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    Another item to think about, the rear body mounts in the vent area so if you cut them out the body mount will have to be modified.
    David W
    Mkll 4874 built in 2004
    Gen 3 coupe #16 under construction

  31. #27
    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Williamson View Post
    Another item to think about, the rear body mounts in the vent area so if you cut them out the body mount will have to be modified.
    David W
    Whaaaaaat??? Missed this one. Anyone got here? What’s the procedure? No wonder FFR won’t cut them out. They didn’t say why though...
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

  32. #28


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    Quote Originally Posted by P100DHG View Post
    Whaaaaaat??? Missed this one. Anyone got here? What’s the procedure? No wonder FFR won’t cut them out. They didn’t say why though...
    That is correct; the rear body fasteners are in the simulated vents. Paint the indentations and hardware black then install the mesh and they'll appear to be open until you look closely.

    Jeff

  33. Thanks P100DHG thanked for this post
  34. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by P100DHG View Post
    Whaaaaaat??? Missed this one. Anyone got here? What’s the procedure? No wonder FFR won’t cut them out. They didn’t say why though...
    Putting the body mounts under the vent screens is a rather clever way IMO of hiding the rear body mounting bolts. As has already been pointed out, they're not functional. Even if you cut them open, not much is going to happen. There's an aluminum panel on the other side that walls off the hatch area. Carpeted if you're doing that. The Coupe that Factory Five wind tunnel tested had vents behind the rear wheels. But not on the back. https://www.factoryfive.com/whats-ne...esting-report/
    Build 1: Mk3 Roadster #5125. Sold 11/08/2014.
    Build 2: Mk4 Roadster #7750. Sold 04/10/2017. #7750 Build Thread
    Build 3: Mk4 Roadster 20th Anniversary #8674. 03 of 20. 2015 crate Coyote, 2015 IRS. Legal 04/18/2017. #8674 Build Thread
    Build 4: Gen 3 Type 65 Coupe #59. Gen 3 crate Coyote. Delivered 12/2/2017. #59 Coupe Build Thread

  35. #30
    Top Notch Builder P100DHG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kleiner View Post
    That is correct; the rear body fasteners are in the simulated vents. Paint the indentations and hardware black then install the mesh and they'll appear to be open until you look closely.

    Jeff

    Okay got it makes sense thanks guys!! Great clarification.

    - Danny


    PS just for reference here is what we are talking about for those following along. This is the only reference I could find in the Gen 3 Coupe manual Rev 4F at all, just a picture with no explanation.
    297B3B40-0B85-4935-95A9-E3EB143E9DC8.jpeg
    Last edited by P100DHG; 12-31-2018 at 03:56 PM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

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    Build Day 1 - Bolting Wildwood Rotors Together

    Wow a super awesome package arrived on Friday!!

    IMG_2251.jpg

    Guess what!?!? This marks the official start of the build! I wasted no time getting to work. Started by nesting AKA rearranging my garage. Worked all day Saturday on that and then started in on the Wildwood Disc Brakes on Sunday

    DO6A1296.jpg

    I torqued the bolts to spec 155in/lbs and used required locktite and marked each one with a paint pen and a line extending front the top of the bolt to the rotor so if they move it's easy to see on inspection

    IMG_1396.jpg. DO6A1299.jpg

    I was under the impression that the calipers needed to be assembled but at first glance it looks completely assembled. Check that off the list. Here is one initial hiccup. Wilwood very nicely explains that the .032 safety wire that is required is "cheap" but they also fail to include any of the required "cheap" safety wire... So that has to be ordered.... So make sure you buy that before you start your build I bought this Malin - MS20995C Stainless Steel Safety Wire / Lockwire | .032" Dia. There were some other thoughts but I can't remember what they were at the moment so I'll update when they come to mind.

    If anyone needs the wildwood instructions for whatever reason I can upload pictures of them. Safety Wire Instructions can be found here: http://www.wilwood.com/pdf/datasheets/ds386.pdf

    Once the wire comes and my safety wire pliers I bought arrive I'll get start on that. Kit completion date is this Saturday then the wait for Stewart. Though I am not in a rush to spend another $2,000 for shipping to California so I can be patient. LOL.

    Just for reference assembling all 4 took me 1 hour and 15 minutes. I threaded each bolt on half way to confirm alignment of the rotor to the hat before torquing anything down so this technique took a bit longer.
    Last edited by P100DHG; 01-10-2019 at 04:57 PM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

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    Safety Wire Wildwood Rotors - Day 2

    Just as a piece of information installing the safety wire on the first rotor took me 40 minutes to complete. Mind you it was my first one and I am not trying to pump these out but it goes quickly once you get it dialed in. I want to share some tips or instructions since there really isn't a guide to how to do it, just a picture of the completed product. Also if you are exploring buying a kit it's nice to see peoples approach and fill in the gaps of the instruction manual so you know what you're getting yourself into. I like to build everything in my head before putting my hands on it.

    Step 1: I took my .032" safety wire and measured out 14". After threading it through the bolt perpendicular to the rotor, I grabbed it and bent it up at an angle with a set of needle nose pliers.

    IMG_1509.jpg

    Step 2: It's really hard to pull the wire through with a needle nose. It's simply not going to do the job so I attached my safety wire pliers (these are the one's I bought on Amazon they are great) and pulled it though

    IMG_1510.jpg

    Step 3: This part is tricky. Where to place your pliers so don't over twist or under twist the wire. What I mean by that, is not to twist the wire so far that you have to untwist it to get it into the next bolt or too short and you find that the twist doesn't make it all the way to the second bolt hole. I hope that makes sense. If you line up your pliers like so (see picture below) you will have the perfect amount of twisted wire between bolts. I attached my pliers to the wire just a few millimeters past the bolt hole. This took me a couple attempts to get it perfect but I took a picture to mark my distance past the hole once I got it right and it came out great.

    IMG_1508.jpg

    Step 4: Thread the wire through the second bolt hole and the other wire around that back side as shown in the picture below. Then take both wires and thread them under the twisted wire. If you don't the wire that wraps around the back of the bolt will want to jump up above the bolt and you will find yourself struggling to get it to sit back down.

    IMG_1507.jpg

    Step 5: With the wire perpendicular to the twisted wire as seen in the picture above. Go ahead and twist it in this position. As the wire begins to twist and tighten soften the 90 degree angle (perpendicular angle) to a 45 degree angle and cut the excess with a snip. I cut about 3-4" of excess wire off.

    IMG_1513.jpg

    I thought about doing this without the safety wire pliers. My advice is don't. The pliers make the results so easy and so professional it's well work the money. Here are the tools I used to complete the job

    IMG_1514.jpg
    Last edited by P100DHG; 01-10-2019 at 11:39 PM.
    Gen 3 65 Coupe - Order Date 8/2018 - Delivery: Jan 2019 - P100DHG 65 Coupe Build Thread

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