EdwardB’s 35 Hot Rod Truck Build

[edwardb]

Here we go again. Enjoy building too much to not have a project underway. So, build number five is on order. Completion date at Factory Five isn’t until 12/05/2020. So, this is an early start to a build thread. But will kick it off anyway. It’s been about seven months since the Gen 3 Coupe was done. I’ve spent the time since then completing a number of home projects. All necessary and good progress. But ready to spend some time on something else. Approaching five years in retirement now (hard to believe) and I love staying busy. To make room, just sold and delivered the 20th Anniversary Roadster to its new owner. What a great car that was and sad to see it go. But we thoroughly enjoy the Coupe. The garage shop does seem to have an opening now though. Time to fill it up.



So back to the best of both worlds. One to drive and one to build. I’ve been keeping an eye on the F9 super car. Thought we might see it in person at this year’s Open House. Didn’t happen of course since it was cancelled. Based on the latest updates it’s clearly going to be a while before it’s available. I like it a lot and hats off to Dave and team for what it’s going to be. But to be honest the more I see and learn, it’s probably not for us. What I really want is something that’s a little more civil and especially something that’s comfortable and easy for my wife to get in and out of. Maybe even convince her to drive one of my builds. The Hot Rod Pick-Up Truck was something that caught my eye when it was released. So, going to give it a shot. Will be quite different than previous builds.

The goal of the build will be a civilized (as much as possible) street cruiser. I much prefer the classic look with the fenders and running boards. Plus, not a fan of rocks and whatever else flying off the tires. Going to do an automatic transmission to stay in the civilized theme. Haven’t done that before and I enjoy learning and trying new things. Plus, the footbox room seems somewhat limited and eliminating the clutch should help. Power steering is a given. Wouldn’t mind power brakes. Heat and A/C for sure. Maybe a sound system.

With the Coyotes in the last two builds, I’ve become a huge fan of the turnkey crate modern computer controlled EFI engines. I know it’s been done, but the size of the Coyote makes it very tight in this model. So, for the engine, I’ve decided to go Chevy LS. Nothing crazy. Planning the 430 HP LS3 crate motor. I’ve been one that isn’t a fan of non-Ford engines in the Roadster or Coupe. And for those cars leave me in that camp. But for this build, it’s such a departure from a traditional Ford I’m going to excuse myself and go for it. In spite of any piling on by Steve Mr. GoDadGo. The LS3 is much more compact, a bit cheaper, and again fits the theme of learning and trying something I haven’t done before. I’ll be very interested to compare an LS installation experience to what I’ve learned doing the Coyotes.

The 430 HP LS3, while by far not the most powerful available, will have plenty of go for my intended use. I’ll look for some dress-up options. It suffers from the same busy wire and hose look like most modern engines. But nothing crazy. One thing it won’t have is covers that say Corvette or whatever like I’ve seen on some LS builds. Not going to advertise that I’ve gone rogue.

This is exactly what I ordered:

• ’35 Truck Kit with uncoated frame
• LS installation kit
• Driveshaft for LS engine and 4L65E automatic transmission
• Black vinyl seats
• Truck front grill
• Platinum gauges
• Chrome tilt steering wheel
• Electric power steering
• Engine cover kit
• Full fender kit
• Wood bed kit
• Moser 8.8 wide rear axle with 3-link
• Black Wilwood brakes front and back

I’m going with the uncoated frame because to be honest I’m not a huge fan of the now standard satin black powder coat. And for the Hot Rod and Truck, quite a bit is exposed. The Factory Five powder coat is a good value. But I’m going to get it uncoated, mock everything up, and make any modifications. Then clean it up (welds as needed, spatter, etc.) and have it coated locally. Along with the uncoated suspension parts and other fabricated misc. Color TBD.

I like the traditional look of the bench seat. But I want to go with something that provides the most amount of people space, height, and adjustment. Plus, I’d really prefer to have head rests for safety. So going with the regular Roadster seats for mock up and study to select the seats I’ll use. Then sell the unused Roadster seats. Used that strategy for the Coupe and worked quite well.

I love the wire wheels I’ve seen on several builds. So, getting information about those. Would appear in that case all four corners use the same size tires versus the usual staggered setup. Which is fine for what I’m planning. Haven’t decided which heat and A/C system I’ll use. More study when the kit is here and can mock everything up. I’d like something a little more sophisticated than the very basic system in the Coupe. But we’ll see if that’s possible. Will have wipers. Maybe washers. Other possibilities are cruise control and electronic e-brake. Probably will go old fashioned with a keyed ignition versus keyless like the Coupe. I like the Digital Guard Dawg setup in the Coupe. Works great. But adds complexity and takes some space. Will look at options to extend the under car exhaust all the way to the back to keep noise down as much as possible. Will have plenty of insulation and try to make the overall driving and comfort level as high as possible. Planning the standard GM electronic controller for the 4L65E automatic, with a Lokar Sport Shifter that can be left fully automatic or has a bump shift mode.

I’m going with Wilwood brakes again. They’re expensive and for my driving purposes the standard brakes would be fine. But what can I say? I like the look of the Wilwoods and they’re beautifully made and go together perfectly. This will be the fourth time I’ve used them. The solid axle version uses single piston rears, which aren’t as robust as the 4-piston rears used on the IRS setup. But I had this combination (6-piston front, single piston rear) on my #7750 Mk4 Roadster and they worked fine. As mentioned, will look at power assist. That would mean giving up the Wilwood balance bar setup. But I think would fit well into the build theme and plan. Since it will be electric power steering, no hydraulic available for hydroboost. So would have to be vacuum assist, and I suspect there isn’t room for the reservoir. But we’ll see.

I’m planning to order the LS3 crate motor soon so it’s on hand when the kit arrives. Same for the transmission. Then can starting mocking things up immediately. Looking at using a Gearstar reman 4L65E. All transmissions of this type and vintage I’ve found are rebuilds or remans. Even when buying from GM. The aftermarket seems to offer some upgrades to the internals, more power handling, etc. for similar money.

That’s it for now. Feedback and (positive…) comments welcome.

[JohnK]

Subscribed! I'm so happy you're starting another build. I always learn so much from your build threads. Let me guess... it'll be red

[Papa]

Congratulations, Paul. I'm sure we're about to see yet another benchmark build take place and I look forward to following. I have a few more years before retirement, but I'm already itching to build again. I've even considered offering to do builds for others in the area that have stalled out and want to finish up. Not looking to make any money, just want to have a project to work on.

Dave

[edwardb]

Subscribed! I'm so happy you're starting another build. I always learn so much from your build threads. Let me guess... it'll be red

Oops. Didn't include any discussion about exterior color in my first post. Answer: Undecided. Willing to consider other colors beside red, so open for now. But I've said that before.

[JohnK]

Out of curiosity, have you given any thought to trying to add ABS and/or traction control to a build? I thought about this, but it was just too much complexity for me on a first build.

[Al_C]

Wow! I had an idea that you might go with a truck for your next adventure! Good for you! I know this one will come out beautifully and it will be extremely well documented. I bet the hardest part is waiting for everything to arrive...

[nuhale]

Great! Looking forward to following your progress!

[edwardb]

Out of curiosity, have you given any thought to trying to add ABS and/or traction control to a build? I thought about this, but it was just too much complexity for me on a first build.

No, not something I've considered. Two reasons: These are generally fair weather cars. At least for me, don't purposely drive when it's crummy out. When it happens, take it easy and generally go for cover. And for sure not in the winter when the roads are snowy, icy, salt covered, or all of the above. So braking and traction aids aren't quite the draw for me that they are for a DD. But probably mainly because I worked my whole career around those kinds of systems. I'm personally not an engineer. But as someone in the industry with automotive interest, was witness to the engineering and testing that goes into those systems and the amount of customization depending on the vehicle and how its equipped. I question hanging them onto a chassis and drivetrain they weren't specifically designed for. There are aftermarket solutions that are more universal, but haven't gone there either. Don't want to get into a debate about this. I know others have done it and are happy with the results. That's great. Just not my personal choice.

[legend42]

Congrats Paul! Looking forward to following your build.

Rob

[Jeff Kleiner]

What fun Paul! This will be a great one to watch Aside from the engine choice your plan sounds much like the very civilized pickup that Ron E. just completed for Phil. It's going to be interesting to see you tackle an LS...and I'll be paying attention and trying to learn (if I can ever get the parade of roadsters coming through here to slow down my goal is to build myself an LS powered '35 in the big tire fenderless style like Freddie Simmons has done)

Can't wait to see you get started!

Jeff

[Straversi]

An LS powered 33 is on my very distant horizon so I'm excited to see this as well. Congratulations.
-Steve

[GoDadGo]

Oh My God Paul, You've Come Over To The Dark Side!

.................This is going to be one of the best, if not the best truck ever.

[Logan]

Awesome choice Paul! I’ll be following closely. Can’t wait to see this one go together in your meticulous fashion.

[JohnK]

No, not something I've considered. Two reasons: These are generally fair weather cars. At least for me, don't purposely drive when it's crummy out. When it happens, take it easy and generally go for cover. And for sure not in the winter when the roads are snowy, icy, salt covered, or all of the above. So braking and traction aids aren't quite the draw for me that they are for a DD. But probably mainly because I worked my whole career around those kinds of systems. I'm personally not an engineer. But as someone in the industry with automotive interest, was witness to the engineering and testing that goes into those systems and the amount of customization depending on the vehicle and how its equipped. I question hanging them onto a chassis and drivetrain they weren't specifically designed for. There are aftermarket solutions that are more universal, but haven't gone there either. Don't want to get into a debate about this. I know others have done it and are happy with the results. That's great. Just not my personal choice.

Thanks Paul. That all makes perfect sense.

[jiriza84641]

Following, and he went with an LS whoa! This will epic yet again!

[ydousurf]

Congrats on your new build choice, Paul! I know many, including myself, are very grateful for your Roadster builds. I'm using yours as reference along with all the other builds out here as well.

I/WE/YOU have seen many, many posts of "Thanks" throughout the Roadster and Coupe builds... So, anyone can see that this future 35 truck build will no doubt be very beneficial to builders who will be doing that kit. Whether along with you or in the future, this new build will contribute and be utilized by so many.

You're clearly a master builder and no doubt know what you're doing, but I do hope that it gives you some rewarding challenges and opportunities? No, not necessarily road blocks, but where it challenges you and your skills. Allowing you to demonstrate your thinking outside the box and sharing "new ways" to complete a particular step or phase.

Anyway, it will be a joy to see it come together in real-time as you progress and post. All the best to you! I'll be following along...

Dj

[edwardb]

What fun Paul! This will be a great one to watch Aside from the engine choice your plan sounds much like the very civilized pickup that Ron E. just completed for Phil. It's going to be interesting to see you tackle an LS...and I'll be paying attention and trying to learn (if I can ever get the parade of roadsters coming through here to slow down my goal is to build myself an LS powered '35 in the big tire fenderless style like Freddie Simmons has done)

Can't wait to see you get started!

Jeff

That's a very nice build and definitely one of my inspirations. I have have all of the pictures saved and have been studying them closely. Along with lots of others.

Oh My God Paul, You've Come Over To The Dark Side!

Easy big boy. For this build only and for the reasons mentioned.

[FF33rod]

Have to chime in, glad to see you kick off another one! doesn't matter what you're building I learn stuff....

[GoDadGo]

Easy big boy. For this build only and for the reasons mentioned.

https://youtu.be/Baicy_oPOmM

[wareaglescott]

Excited to watch you do another build! Subscribed.

[mburger]

Good for you Paul, good luck!

[Kodiak]

Will be following this build congratulations Paul .

[7tvette]

Always love your builds and attention to detail. Will be following again!

Troy

[shark92651]

Well that didn't take long! I'm looking forward to following the development of the definitive "35 Hot Rod supplemental build instruction manual"

[Caddy Dad]

That's awesome Paul. I was wondering what you were going to build next. Congrats!

[GTBradley]

What an evolution you’ve gone through! This is going to be a great looking truck and, personally, I love the wire wheels, fenders and running boards classic look. I think you’ll both enjoy driving this even more than the others. Looking forward to the process.

[marshc56]

Congratulationas, Paul. You have a following like no other., and rightly so! It has been my pleasure "studying" your builds and this one will be certainly no exception.

No offense, but in some circles this "build thing" might be considered an addiction... LOL!

marsh

[edwardb]

No offense, but in some circles this "build thing" might be considered an addiction... LOL!

marsh

No offense taken. You know what they say, admitting you have a problem is the first step.

But still having too much fun.

[edwardb]

Here we go. Ordered the LS3 crate motor, LS2/LS3 controller pack, and the 4L65E automatic transmission. I want to have these parts on hand when the kit arrives so I can start mocking things up as quickly as possible. The crate motor and controller pack are here. The transmission I ordered from Gearstar Performance Transmissions in Akron, OH. After looking at several options and reviewing recommendations, this seemed like a good choice. It’s their Level 3 version including the proper torque converter. A bit cheaper then buying the standard Chevrolet Performance version and much beefier. They were very helpful walking me through what I need to know to order. Promised in six weeks. Close enough I can make the drive over and pick it up in person when ready. Not sure yet what transmission controller I'll use. GM has one of course. Gearstar said that would be fine. But also recommended HGM. More research pending.

Received the LS3 controller pack several days ago and have that spread out on the floor and studying the instructions. Hard not to compare to my Coyote control pack experience. In some ways, similar. But in other ways quite different. The main difference is the crate motor has almost no wiring on it like the Coyote. So the supplied harness includes the complete engine harness. More to hook up. But since the LS is a simpler engine, not all the much. The instructions are OK. But not great. I’ll figure it out. The drive by wire (DBW) accelerator is big and beefy. Will definitely need to go on a diet. I'll wait until I see where it goes in the footbox.



The engine arrived today. Always a big event. It sure looks small compared to a Coyote! I didn’t check the exact specs. But a quick tape measure compare to the Coyote in the Coupe shows it’s about six inches narrower. Had a minor surprise. The information from Chevrolet Performance said I needed a flex plate and related hardware kit. So had that on hand. Unwrapped the engine and it already has the same exact flex plate already bolted in place. So, my first return is underway. I’m sure won’t be the last. I’ll need a starter, alternator, and A/C compressor. Going to wait on those until mocking up in the chassis to see how the front accessory drive sorts out with the available space. There are a ton of options for the LS. I read in another build thread that I may need to change out the oil pan to clear the electric power steering setup. We’ll see about that later in mockup. The kit comes with new headers for the LS, so the supplied ones will be swapped out. I draped the harness over the engine and was able to identify where all the connections go. There aren’t wires on the harness for a couple on the engine. So more research and study needed there. I'm learning about the different cylinder numbering GM uses. Some of the harness wires said "odd side" and "even side." I get it now.

As I mentioned in my first post describing the build, this is the 430 HP LS3. Not their most potent by any means. But for what I'm planning, I think should be plenty. What I have learned is the next step up (495 HP as I recall) is exactly the same engine just with a different cam. So could make a pretty easy upgrade in the future it I really wanted to. That’s about it for now.

[DamnYankee]

Great engine choice. I did the 495hp version with the T56 transmission.

[460.465USMC]

Congratulations, Paul! I’m a bowtie guy at heart—oops! Was that my outside voice?—and will be cheering you on all the way.

Subscribed! Pen out and ready to take notes.

Chris

[RR20AC]

Should be a great one Paul. Don't they say the hotrod is a great auto crosser. Be fun to have one for just that. My plane is to be overall grey with red and some yellow highlights. Can't get away from the red totally. How are the prices on the engine package for chevy compared to Ford? Thanks for the new build. jim

[edwardb]

Should be a great one Paul. Don't they say the hotrod is a great auto crosser. Be fun to have one for just that. My plane is to be overall grey with red and some yellow highlights. Can't get away from the red totally. How are the prices on the engine package for chevy compared to Ford? Thanks for the new build. jim

Thanks. Will be interested to see/hear more about your plane project. Can't offer too much yet on the price difference between the LS and Coyote until I have the package completed. The version LS3 I purchased is less than a Gen 3 Coyote. But not a lot. The electronic packages are about the same. I still need to add accessories (starter, alternator, A/C compressor) and will need mounts to position the alternator and compressor properly. Just briefly browsing, there appear to be many more aftermarket parts for the LS package. In the end I'm not expecting my build to be substantially less than a Coyote build. The picture might be different if going used versus new just based on pure volume. But I don't know.

[Lancaster Lad]

EdwardB

Will be following along as I did with your Roadsters.
You might look into the Vintage Air Frontrunner system for your AC and Alt mount. It is very compact.
I saw the system mounted in a Hot Rod at HB numerous times and it fits nicely. And I think the Truck
is the same as the Hot Rod in the front. It also fits in a Roadster very well.

[GoDadGo]

The Dark Side Has Been Embrased!

....Soon You Will Understand It's Power!

[delta0014]

Awesome,
Looking forward to watching this build come along.

[Rook]

Very cool! I'm reading through your other build threads and am learning a ton. It'll be fun to follow along in real-time for this one.

[House Money]

For the accessory drive you might want to look at the Holley systems. I used one on my truck and really like it. A few features I really liked were there are no brackets, everything mounts to the main water pump housing, next is that housing has a drilled and tapped provision for the steam line. And one thing i really liked is that you have two options for routing the heater hoses, straight out like on your water pump included with your crate engine, or down like I did. I think when you test fit the engine in your chassis you will see why that could be important, those nipples came really close to one of the frame tubes on mine. Plus, I'm not running a hood or side covers so having the hoses drop down helped to hide them.

Gary

[John Dol]

Yeah buddy, another great build to follow!!

John

[David Williamson]

looking like another great build. The LS3 is a great package a friend is finshing up a 68 Chevelle resto mod with one.
David W